IAF Pilot comments on Babur Missile

[foxhound]

Salaam!

Another article of interest......by an ex-IAF Pilot.


Pakistan test fires updated Babur (Hatf V11) cruise missile
Posted by vkthakur on 22 March 2007 (EST)
The range of the missile has been increased from 500km to 700km


The Hatf V11 being test fired. Photo Credit: TV Grab
22 March 2007 (Sawf News) - Pakistan today tested an updated version of its Babur cruise missile.

"The Hatf-VII missile, which is also called the Babur, has a range of 700 km and the flight data collected validated the design parameters set for the flight test," said a military statement.


The Hatf V11 being test fired. Photo Credit: TV Grab
The nuclear capable Babur was first test fired in August 2005 and described as "a terrain hugging missile, which has the most advanced and modern navigation and guidance and a high degree of maneuverability and its technology enables it to avoid radar detection and penetrate undetected through any hostile defense system."

Today's test of the missile seems to have caught India as much off guard as the first test that left our military shell shocked.


The Hatf V11 being test fired. Photo Credit: TV Grab
The Babur is undoubtedly a potent weapon system. However, despite it terrain hugging capability and advanced guidance system, a cruise missile such as the Babur can be engaged by AESA radar equipped fighters with long range air to air missiles. Unfortunately, the IAF does not have any such fighters.

The tardy pace of MRCA procurement could result in a serious strategic imbalance as Pakistan begins to deploy the Babur in numbers.

http://kuku.sawf.org/default.aspx

(Welcome to Vijainder K Thakur's BLOG
Aviation, strategic affairs and space research have been my enduring interests since childhood. Nothing surprising there considering by father was in the Army. I served 20 years in the Indian Air Force as a fighter pilot and have a brother who served the Indian Navy for 20 years as a marine commando.)

 

[foxhound]

http://www.sawf.org/Newsphotos/blogphotos/HatfV11a.jpg

http://www.sawf.org/Newsphotos/blogphotos/HatfV11b.jpg

http://www.sawf.org/Newsphotos/blogphotos/HatfV11c.jpg

 

[EagleEyes]

The pilot apparently wants AESA radar to be equipped in the IAF fighters for its fellows to coup with the future aircraft inventory of Pakistan Air Force.

 

[su-47]

He was talking about AESA mounted fighters to act in an anti-missile role, but ofcourse as we all know, AESA can also be used to detect and destroy aircraft.

If IAF plans to get Mig-35, they should be looking at the Elta 2052 at the moment. If they r going for F-18, then the APG-79 that comes with it will do.

 

[Keysersoze]

The website in question is actually quite a good read. I am not sure if they are the same person, but I think malay was on there being insulted by a fellow Indian for daring to Inpune the honour of the MKI by suggesting the Eurofighter was better than it!

 

[Janbaz]

malay was on there being insulted by a fellow Indian for daring to Inpune the honour of the MKI by suggesting the Eurofighter was better than it!

Come on, it's the mighty MKI!

 

[EagleEyes]

He was talking about AESA mounted fighters to act in an anti-missile role, but ofcourse as we all know, AESA can also be used to detect and destroy aircraft.

If IAF plans to get Mig-35, they should be looking at the Elta 2052 at the moment. If they r going for F-18, then the APG-79 that comes with it will do.

Do you know the price of an AESA radar? Elta and APG-79.

I will take one Mcdonalds chicken burger with a diet coke.

 

[Contrarian]

The website in question is actually quite a good read. I am not sure if they are the same person, but I think malay was on there being insulted by a fellow Indian for daring to Inpune the honour of the MKI by suggesting the Eurofighter was better than it!

Yeah that was me. In the article "MRCA Procurement - Is the IAF Chasing a Moving Target?"

I did not fully understand the complexities of planes at that time, and yes indeed the other guy was a fool to think that the Su-30MKI would be able to beat the Typhoon on a 1 on 1.

But i was wrong as well. I thought the Typhoon would simply knock the Su-30 out of the sky. After reading a lot on the issue , i have realised that the Typhoon though superior, would not have a field day out on the Su-30MKI. Infact apart from Rafale, the only plane of the older generation that would be able to give a Typhoon a real run for its money in a2a would be the Su-30MKI. So on a 1 to 1 basis, the Typhoon wins, but for eg i would say its a hard match in a 2:1.

Its a very good site key, the man gives his own views and calls them so. I dont agree with all of his views, but it is a good read nonetheless.

Webby, WHICHEVER plane we get for the MRCA, we will get AESA with it. Obviously AESA is an important step, with aesa our fighters can engage cruise missiles effectively, apart from moving a step closer towards the evolution of radars.
Webby, India can afford the AESA radars.

 

[Joodi]

Yes, AESA radars will be there on all 126 multirole fighters jets india is planning to procure. Pakistan is also planning to procure AEASA for its jf-17 and other jets.

 

[Misbahulhaq]

Do you know the price of an AESA radar? Elta and APG-79.

I will take one Mcdonalds chicken burger with a diet coke.

Each AESA radar costs mimimum $20-25 million a piece, which is more expensive than the whole of JF-17 THUNDER!

 

[blain2]

Each AESA radar costs mimimum $20-25 million a piece, which is more expensive than the whole of JF-17 THUNDER!

Yes it is expensive but as part of a package to equip more than a 100 JF-17s with the AESA capability is a very lucrative deal for any AESA radar producer. Usually the price can be revised downwards as the volume goes up. With plans on acquiring upwards of 250 JF-17s, you can imagine any one solicited for an AESA would like to win the deal.

Also the price of the AESA radars is bound to come down as new solutions come around (SABR as an example).

 

[Quwa]

Yes it is expensive but as part of a package to equip more than a 100 JF-17s with the AESA capability is a very lucrative deal for any AESA radar producer. Usually the price can be revised downwards as the volume goes up. With plans on acquiring upwards of 250 JF-17s, you can imagine any one solicited for an AESA would like to win the deal.

Also the price of the AESA radars is bound to come down as new solutions come around (SABR as an example).

The AESA race for light fighters such as JF-17 has already begun...

Selex/Galileo Avionica Vixen-750 AESA.
Europe designs radars autonomously from U.S.: AINonline

A slightly larger version of this design, the Vixen 750, is proposed for lightweight fighter applications like the F-16.

Northrop Grumman SABR.
Scalable Agile Beam Radar (SABR)

While designed initially to fit the F-16 with no structural, power or cooling modifications, the SABR is scalable to fit other aircraft platforms and mission areas.

It is only a matter of time before Thales reveals an AESA for light fighters...Northrop, Galileo and probably the Chinese are already on the ball. It isn't only the 250 Pakistani JF-17s to compete for...countries like Egypt, Algeria, Saudi Arabia may also buy JF-17 in hundreds.

 

[Neo]

Each AESA radar costs mimimum $20-25 million a piece, which is more expensive than the whole of JF-17 THUNDER!

I beg to differ, AESA for JF-17 can be purchased for $5-7 million a piece depending on the order and license to export to third parties.

 

[Joodi]

Read this report:

EADS offers to co-develop AESA radars with DRDO news

26 February 2008

New Delhi: European aerospace and defence major, EADS, has offered to co-develop with India the technology for active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar for installation on board the indigenously developed, light combat aircraft Tejas. The offer has been made even as US aerospace giants, Boeing and Lockheed Martin, are awaiting clearance from the US Congress to offer a transfer of technology (ToT) agreement to India for the same technology.

Talking to the media persons, EADS CEO, Stefan Zoller said, ''We have offered to co-develop the AESA e-copter radars with DRDO-LRDE.''

AESA radars, which are sported by some US frontline fighters like the F-22, help pilots track threats such as cruise missiles. AESA radars can track targets simultaneously in the air and on the ground.

Under India's Defence Procurement Policy (DPP) 2006, ToT agreements for AESA radars is one of the key elements of the request for proposals sent out to six major aerospace and defence companies who are bidding for the $10-billion deal for 126 medium range multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) for the Indian Air Force.

Meanwhile, EADS has said that it has so far ensured coherent delivery of end-to-end services for its military and security customers and is fully engaged in future tactical and infrastructure network projects for the Indian Army.

According to Zoller, ''As an example of its commitment to India, we have delivered to the Indian Army a complete test bed (Parikshak) in order to help it understand the need for the tactical communications system (TCS) project,'' Zoller added.

As the bid opening time for the MMRCA project nears, Eurofighter, one of the contenders for the project, has said that it intends to open an office in New Delhi shortly in order to have local representation during the competition."


PAF and KAMRA guys should pull up their socks and get AESA for jf-17. either a joint venture with chinese for an AESA radar or french /european AESA radar with ToT(if possible)

 

[su-47]

Read this report:

EADS offers to co-develop AESA radars with DRDO news

26 February 2008

New Delhi: European aerospace and defence major, EADS, has offered to co-develop with India the technology for active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar for installation on board the indigenously developed, light combat aircraft Tejas. The offer has been made even as US aerospace giants, Boeing and Lockheed Martin, are awaiting clearance from the US Congress to offer a transfer of technology (ToT) agreement to India for the same technology.

Talking to the media persons, EADS CEO, Stefan Zoller said, ''We have offered to co-develop the AESA e-copter radars with DRDO-LRDE.''

AESA radars, which are sported by some US frontline fighters like the F-22, help pilots track threats such as cruise missiles. AESA radars can track targets simultaneously in the air and on the ground.

Under India's Defence Procurement Policy (DPP) 2006, ToT agreements for AESA radars is one of the key elements of the request for proposals sent out to six major aerospace and defence companies who are bidding for the $10-billion deal for 126 medium range multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) for the Indian Air Force.

Meanwhile, EADS has said that it has so far ensured coherent delivery of end-to-end services for its military and security customers and is fully engaged in future tactical and infrastructure network projects for the Indian Army.

According to Zoller, ''As an example of its commitment to India, we have delivered to the Indian Army a complete test bed (Parikshak) in order to help it understand the need for the tactical communications system (TCS) project,'' Zoller added.

As the bid opening time for the MMRCA project nears, Eurofighter, one of the contenders for the project, has said that it intends to open an office in New Delhi shortly in order to have local representation during the competition."


PAF and KAMRA guys should pull up their socks and get AESA for jf-17. either a joint venture with chinese for an AESA radar or french /european AESA radar with ToT(if possible)

Its an offer to give typhoon a boost in MMRCA. If EADS can offer typhoon with AESA, it'll certianly make it a very hard offer to refuse. Delaying MRCA certainly has its advantages. it keeps opening doors to opportunities like this,.

Lat i heard India was interested in the Israeli Elta 2052 AESA