IAF needs more than the Pilatus to plug gaps in its flying training

[selvan33]

IAF needs more than the Pilatus to plug gaps in its flying training

IAF rookies will start learning their first flying lessons on the brand new Pilatus PC-7, a Swiss basic trainer aircraft, from July onwards, but the training troubles at the Air Force Academy, Dundigul, are not getting over anytime soon.

The local aircraft-maker Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is yet to sort out critical design issues related to the development of the Intermediate Jet Trainer (IJT) – a simple jet meant for the second stage of the flying syllabus – leading to concerns about the project on which the pilot training programme is heavily dependent.

The Indian Air Force (IAF) desperately needs IJTs by 2014 by when the existing ageing fleet of Kiran Mk I and Mk II jets – currently being used for the second stage training – will begin to be phased out.

Normally, flying is taught in stages with cadets beginning on basic aircraft, graduating to a jet, and then moving on to more advanced versions of the flying machines

But for the last few years, IAF cadets have been flying Kiran jets right from the word go, an arrangement which is unadvisable. The IJT was first flown in 2003, four years after it was conceived in 1999. But it has been a struggle since then.

The design problems – pertaining to the stall and spin characteristics of the aircraft – became so complicated to address that HAL was forced to appoint a consultant in 2012.
IAF needs more than the Pilatus to plug gaps in its flying training | idrw.org

 

[Abingdonboy]

How did I know this would be from IDRW before even opening this thread?!


BTT---> AJT and specifically PC-7 -----> BAE Hawk is a tried and tested path rookie pilots take in many AFs around the world, why should the IAF/IN need something in between? Are Indian pilots some how less able than the rest of the world's pilots that they need a complety unique training program?!


I've said it before, the demand for the IJT is based on outdated requirements and today the PC-7 ---> HAWK MK.132 ----> OCU program will work just fine. To cram the IJT in there would be foolish at best.



Once again it is the case of HAL trying to force a product no one wants down the throats of the Indian military.

 

[acetophenol]

How did I know this would be from IDRW before even opening this thread?!


BTT---> AJT and specifically PC-7 -----> BAE Hawk is a tried and tested path rookie pilots take in many AFs around the world, why should the IAF/IN need something in between? Are Indian pilots some how less able than the rest of the world's pilots that they need a complety unique training program?!


I've said it before, the demand for the IJT is based on outdated requirements and today the PC-7 ---> HAWK MK.132 ----> OCU program will work just fine. To cram the IJT in there would be foolish at best.



Once again it is the case of HAL trying to force a product no one wants down the throats of the Indian military.

However,it is to be noted that IAF traditionally followed the 4 plane training layout i.e, the
Hal Deepak(Basic)>>Hal Kiran(Itermediate)>>Iskra(Advanced)>>MiG 21(Supersonic). Once when the Iskras were retired,the advanced stage was crushed between the Kiran and MiG 21. So its acceptable for them to go for the same layout again, i.e the Pilatus>>Sittara>>BaE Hawk,with Hawk handling the advanced and supersonic stages.

 

[Abingdonboy]

However,it is to be noted that IAF traditionally followed the 4 plane training layout i.e, the
Hal Deepak(Basic)>>Hal Kiran(Itermediate)>>Iskra(Advanced)>>MiG 21(Supersonic). Once when the Iskras were retired,the advanced stage was crushed between the Kiran and MiG 21. So its acceptable for them to go for the same layout again, i.e the Pilatus>>Sittara>>BaE Hawk,with Hawk handling the advanced and supersonic stages.

BAE HAWK cannot go supersonic, it is a SUB-sonic trainer. The first exposure a fighter pilot will have to supersonic flight will be at the OCU (operational conversion unit) stage wherin they train on the trainer version of the type of fighter they will fly in (MKI/M2K/JAG etc). This is why I say the IAF should be looking at a supersonic LIFT and maybe even (my preferred option) have HAL customise the AF LCA version into a LIFT. So that Indian fighter pilots go on the supersonic LIFT before going to their OCU.

 

[acetophenol]

BAE HAWK cannot go supersonic, it is a SUB-sonic trainer. The first exposure a fighter pilot will have to supersonic flight will be at the OCU (operational conversion unit) stage wherin they train on the trainer version of the type of fighter they will fly in (MKI/M2K/JAG etc). This is why I say the IAF should be looking at a supersonic LIFT and maybe even (my preferred option) have HAL customise the AF LCA version into a LIFT. So that Indian fighter pilots go on the supersonic LIFT before going to their OCU.

BaE HAWK can go transonic in a dive. Also HAL already has plans on a LIFT based on Tejas.

 

[Abingdonboy]

BaE HAWK can go transonic in a dive. Also HAL already has plans on a LIFT based on Tejas.

I'm talking about prolonged supersonic flight on a/b- transonic dives cannot train anyone for that. I've not heard anythign about a LIFT variant of the LCA, care to expand/share?

 

[acetophenol]

I'm talking about prolonged supersonic flight on a/b- transonic dives cannot train anyone for that. I've not heard anythign about a LIFT variant of the LCA, care to expand/share?

I agree with you on the first part,though Hawk crosses 1.15 mach in a dive,its not enough as its about 0.9 mach in leveled flight.
As for the LIFT,the name "HAL HJT-39 CAT". Unveiled 2005 aero india as a mockup ,its gonna be based on Sittara and Tejas trainer,with twin engines. The project is likely to be shelved.

 

[Abingdonboy]

As for the LIFT,the name "HAL HJT-39 CAT". Unveiled 2005 aero india as a mockup ,its gonna be based on Sittara and Tejas trainer,with twin engines. The project is likely to be shelved.

This must be on the back-back burner nothing on this a/c has been mentioned recently.

 

[AUz]

Good to see indians admitting the massive gapes, actually holes, in indian pilot training..Train your pilots good..PAF will like some good competition..beating an easy adversary is no fun for our pilots..

 

[cloud]

Even I'm not happy with HAL on this episode. Since their are already orders have been placed for PC-7, then just increase the budget and get 40 more what IAF wants. which should be in few millions. If they want to develop an IJT or even the basic trainer, then develop it(a prototype, not the Mockup), and keep it updated with the new techs, so that when we need more trainers after a decade or so we can go back to HAL.

 

[acetophenol]

This must be on the back-back burner nothing on this a/c has been mentioned recently.

May be its dead already.