IAF Fighter Roles and Mission profiles --When and how will they be used ?

[indian navy]

well how will be condition if we have an base in Afghanistan

 

[CONNAN]

i hope this old news will throe some light

Is Air force capable of facing Two Front War Indian army is already revising its doctrine to fight War in two fronts with China and Pakistan, Army with its 1.13-million strong personnel and recently held war games might have even cemented Army’s doctrine on possible “Two Front War “ .

But the Question remains will Indian Air force will be able to fight a “Two Front War “, Air force which already has lowest Squadron strength in decades is fighting hard to induct new jets in its arsenal, delays in MMRCA, Tejas has already hit Air force hard, and blunders made in purchase of Hawk AJT’s from Uk has already hit production and pilot training, Grounding whole fleet of HTT-32 basic Trainer by air force has only worsen the situation.

PLAAFÂ already possess more than 500 Long range 4th generation fighter aircraft like Sukhoi-27k and Sukhoi-30MKK and their Chinese copy of J-11 ,not to forget 150 plus home grown J-10 fighter aircraft ,this itself total ups what IAF has in its current inventory not to forget order generation J-7 (Mig-21 copy) and J-8 variants which PLAAF in large numbers . PAF on other hand with around 400 combat aircraft is still a formidable air force in the region.

Poor radar coverage and fewer fighter aircraft deployment in North Eastern sector will also hamper Air forces role in support of ground troops, while IAF is actually deploying small number of Surface to air missile in the region is consider as baby  steps by many experts which Chinese forces have fortified their side of border with heavy SAM batteries . While border line areas near Pakistan have good radar coverage but due to lack of radars and failure to modernize older ones have left blank spot in the region.

According to Defence Expert Rajesh Sharma IAF might lose 40 % of its fleet in less than a week if both china and Pakistan use their air forces aggressively towards India, According to Mr. Sharma first three days of war will see heavy IAF aircraft lose, If PLAAF is able to destroy major airbase in northern sector Long Range Bombers and Fighter aircraft will be able to bomb many major northern eastern cites even Kolkata will be not be spared.

IAF needs to be Defensive in northern-eastern sector and offensive in western sector ,to achieve that northern-eastern sector needs to be heavy fortified with SAM batteries and better radar coverage and better Aircrafts like Sukhoi-30MKI deployed in large numbers to intercept and PLAAF aircrafts and Drones .

 

[Sudesh Lahri]

well how will be condition if we have an base in Afghanistan

Our adversary will be screwed up bigtime!!!

 

[CONNAN]

2 nd Radical scenario --

Chinese scenario ---

As WAR breaks out, Chinese builds up pressure. Makes threatening speaches , builds up the troops , conducts Air excercises. This causes IAF to divert many of its superior aircraft towards NE border -- Leading to a total lack of available aircraft to maintain/achieve Air superiority.

This in my opinion is very likely and one which can happen with certainty. Note that Chinese dont need to attack us , they just need to make threatening noises to build up the pressure. IAF would automatically divert the aircrafts to NE border.

To summarize...

- PRC will not initiate a war with India. Its strategy is to dominate the world with its cheap labor and economic interests.
- PRC strategy is to limit India to a second rate power, thru its proxy Pakistan.
- PRC cannot take a nuke-bloom in Beijing but it might be able to take a conventional defeat. It will not go nuclear even at the worst provocation (Delhi - are you listening?)
- PRC will stop prodding India once India achieves enough economic clout.


So India's strategy vis-a-vis can be -
- Deny economic space for China in India and its tributaries
- Build proper nuclear-deterrence against Beijing
- Openly support Tibet, Uigher, Tiwan, and other freedom movements in China

 

[gubbi]

Time to bust some of the Mission profiles, i will try to be a bad boy...and will put some radical scenarios or atleast try to where the mission profiles will be radically different.


SU 30 Busted - The Myth.

We all know Su 30 has never been proven in WAR. Apart from picture perfect Air shows nothing/no Su 30 aircraft has seen action anywhere in the world. Taking this into account, its time to bust the Su 30 Myth.Also consider that Su 30 is a very important aircraft for IAF , persistent loss of aircraft would lead to it being used less in the WAR.

Wrong info. Su-30 is a designation for export derivative of Su-27. Its like the different blocks of F-16 Falcon.

Operational history
Russia
The Su-27 has seen limited action since it first entered service. These aircraft were used by the Russian air force during the 1992-1993 war in Abkhazia against Georgian forces. One fighter was shot down by an S-75 Dvina on March 19, 1993.[4]
Recently, in the 2008 South Ossetia War, Russia used Su-27s to gain airspace control over Tskhinvali, the capital city of South Ossetia.[5][6]
On 18 January 2010, Iran denied overflight permission for a Russian Su-27SKM that was enroute to an airshow in Bahrain.[7]
[edit]Ethiopia
Ethiopian Su-27s reportedly shot down five Eritrean MiG-29s and damaged another one[8][9] in February 1999 and destroyed another two in May 2000.[9][10] The Su-27s were also used in CAP (Combat Air Patrol) missions, suppression of air defense, and providing escort for fighters on bombing and reconnaissance missions.[11][verification needed] In the War in Somalia (2006-present), the EtAF used their Su-27s to deadly effect, bombing Islamist garrisons and patrolling the airspace. The Su-27 has replaced the aging Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 as Ethiopia's main air superiority fighter.
[edit]Angola
The Su-27 entered Angolan service in mid-2000. It is reported that one Su-27 in the process of landing, was shot down by SA-14 MANPADs fired by UNITA forces on 19 November 2000.[8][12]

The rest of your post regarding a probable devastating scenario is not plausible. Su-30 MKI is a air dominance fighter as well as a mini AWACS. It will not be used as point defence fighter or an interceptor. IAF has other aircraft for those roles - viz MiG-21 Bison. IAF MiG-29s cannot and will not be used for air superiority.

Lastly, unlike in '71, PAF of today cannot pull off a surprise attack on forward airbases.

 

[anathema]

To summarize...

- PRC will not initiate a war with India. Its strategy is to dominate the world with its cheap labor and economic interests.
- PRC strategy is to limit India to a second rate power, thru its proxy Pakistan.
- PRC cannot take a nuke-bloom in Beijing but it might be able to take a conventional defeat. It will not go nuclear even at the worst provocation (Delhi - are you listening?)
- PRC will stop prodding India once India achieves enough economic clout.


So India's strategy vis-a-vis can be -
- Deny economic space for China in India and its tributaries
- Build proper nuclear-deterrence against Beijing
- Openly support Tibet, Uigher, Tiwan, and other freedom movements in China

What PRC can do or will do is left to anyone's imagination. I am interested in Air war scenarios regardless of how the governments will function.

At this point in time we face a counter in PAF (PRC not yet). So i am interested in a Air to Air scenarios wrt to PAF.

One thing i cant figure out is effective utilisation of AWACS. Both sides have AWACS , so there will no tactical surprises to speak. So the question is how to over come the AWACS system ?

 

[CONNAN]

And also we should not forget that At present, this will put tremendous strain on our resources - both military and infrastructure.
There are multiple dimensions to it:

Military
Here, greater degree of indigenization on military hardware is going to be one of the key points. The dependence on foreign suppliers has its limitations - well known to all.

Political
a. External/World Dimension: There will be global reaction to this from different areas of world. I cant guess it right now. For west, both the chinese and the Indian economies are of interest. Other members may be able to contribute more on it.
b. Internal: How do our netas react to it and get things moving to our side. (after overcoming the initial shock and awe )

 

[CONNAN]

What PRC can do or will do is left to anyone's imagination. I am interested in Air war scenarios regardless of how the governments will function.

At this point in time we face a counter in PAF (PRC not yet). So i am interested in a Air to Air scenarios wrt to PAF.

One thing i cant figure out is effective utilisation of AWACS. Both sides have AWACS , so there will no tactical surprises to speak. So the question is how to over come the AWACS system ?

to be honest nobody realy knows the capability of chineese AWACS

 

[anathema]

Wrong info. Su-30 is a designation for export derivative of Su-27. Its like the different blocks of F-16 Falcon.

Operational history
Russia
The Su-27 has seen limited action since it first entered service. These aircraft were used by the Russian air force during the 1992-1993 war in Abkhazia against Georgian forces. One fighter was shot down by an S-75 Dvina on March 19, 1993.[4]
Recently, in the 2008 South Ossetia War, Russia used Su-27s to gain airspace control over Tskhinvali, the capital city of South Ossetia.[5][6]
On 18 January 2010, Iran denied overflight permission for a Russian Su-27SKM that was enroute to an airshow in Bahrain.[7]
[edit]Ethiopia
Ethiopian Su-27s reportedly shot down five Eritrean MiG-29s and damaged another one[8][9] in February 1999 and destroyed another two in May 2000.[9][10] The Su-27s were also used in CAP (Combat Air Patrol) missions, suppression of air defense, and providing escort for fighters on bombing and reconnaissance missions.[11][verification needed] In the War in Somalia (2006-present), the EtAF used their Su-27s to deadly effect, bombing Islamist garrisons and patrolling the airspace. The Su-27 has replaced the aging Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 as Ethiopia's main air superiority fighter.
[edit]Angola
The Su-27 entered Angolan service in mid-2000. It is reported that one Su-27 in the process of landing, was shot down by SA-14 MANPADs fired by UNITA forces on 19 November 2000.[8][12]

The rest of your post regarding a probable devastating scenario is not plausible. Su-30 MKI is a air dominance fighter as well as a mini AWACS. It will not be used as point defence fighter or an interceptor. IAF has other aircraft for those roles - viz MiG-21 Bison. IAF MiG-29s cannot and will not be used for air superiority.

Lastly, unlike in '71, PAF of today cannot pull off a surprise attack on forward airbases.

Fair enough..I wasnt aware of combat history about Sukhoi's. I will do more research and try to present it. However based on the matter that you have presented it can be clearly seen that Su's have not yet met their match .i.e. it hasnt scored any kill on western aircraft. Only time will tell how it will fare against this adversary. Also the point about Su's downed by SAM's gives credence to the point that due to its huge RCS it will be a easy target for SAM's. Also consider that since this being a prestigious aircraft for us , more losses will definetly force IAF to rethink.

Finally this is a dooms day scenario , i just felt that the pciture was getting a bit rosy. I agree with Air dominance, however it is still on paper and is yet to meet its match. Unlike F15 which has proved itself over and over again for it to rest on its laurels -- Su has far few.

PAF will not be able to surprise attack but the cruise missile attack would give far less reaction time.

 

[anathema]

to be honest nobody realy knows the capability of chineese AWACS

We do know about Pakistani AWACS !!

 

[CONNAN]

We do know about Pakistani AWACS !!

there is no way PAF AWACS gonna cross the border and ofcourse ther will be SAM SITES on the border in this case PAF got he advantage in defenive role

 

[anathema]

there is no way PAF AWACS gonna cross the border and ofcourse ther will be SAM SITES on the border in this case PAF got he advantage in defenive role

PAF AWECS dont need to cross the border !! Just as Phalcons AWACS dont need to cross the border. The operational monitoring radius of SAAB AWECS and PHALCON AWACS are believed to be 300 miles .i.e both AWACS can monitor 300 miles of each others territory from their location.

 

[CONNAN]

PAF AWECS dont need to cross the border !! Just as Phalcons AWACS dont need to cross the border. The operational monitoring radius of SAAB AWECS and PHALCON AWACS are believed to be 300 miles .i.e both AWACS can monitor 300 miles of each others territory from their location.

yup i believe the only way you can do it by sacrificing our gunships in anti sam role

 

[TaimiKhan]

Dude I know the response from Pakistani poster, they will nuke us and annihilate us. There will be no place for our planes to land.

Before any Pakistani poster coming into this thread, you have already derailed it with your comments.

Strange why blaming Pakistanis when you are more then enough for derailing it yourself.

By the way it seems Indian posters are this time more interested in nuking Pakistan compared to hardly 1-2 Pakistani posters so far who have not yet mentioned nukes.

 

[Jazzbot]

T.Khan, let them play in their fancy lands... lol