'I am an Indian Muslim, not a Pakistani' - BBC News

[Indus Pakistan]

What about the Muhajirs? Even Jinnah himself was a Gujarati, though born in Sindh. But, his family are pretty recent converts.

Read what I said below. The majority defines. Not the minority. London has large Bangla population but that does not make UK Bangla. They remain a ethnic minority that has to integrate to the larger national canvas.

UK has at least 6% population with heritage to South Asia but that does not make UK a South Asian country because rest of the 94% have differant background and are native to British Isles. ditto Pakistan/Indus River Valley.

 

[El Sidd]

Desi is not my word. I became only really frequented to it at PDF and sort of adapted it since as it appeared to be the rage here. The meaning I let you guys define it. English is my forte or I like to think it is.

Really?

Well it isnt going to be pretty but the word desi actually came about by the early progressive migrants to the UK and USA, who made fun of old cultural conservatism of the sub continent.

 

[MultaniGuy]

That's only true if you don't know how different the various ethnicities in Pakistan are from each other. I don't know of any Punjabis familiar with Pashtunwali for example. Punjabis share a lot more with northern Indians than they do with Pashtuns, Balochis etc. It's just that Punjabi culture is so widespread in Pakistan and the other ethnicities are not represented as well that we forget about these differences.


Even if that were true, it would be a good enough. Pakistan was not created on the basis of ethnicities but religion.

Yes Pakistan was created in the name of Islam. Everybody knows that. But still, the only thing we have in common with a Muslim Tamil is just religion.

 

[Shorisrip]

Of no consequence here. About 20% of Pakistanis are racially identical to SW Iranians/Persians. That doesn't make Pakistan Iran or Persia. Just as it doesn't make us indian/indian Muslim.

Who are these 20%? I'm well versed on genetics, and even Pashtuns fall between the South Asian spectrum, and believe it or not are closer genetically to Punjabis and Sindhis than they are to Persians from Iran. Your language does not define your genetics.

 

[MultaniGuy]

Who are these 20%? I'm well versed on genetics, and even Pashtuns fall between the South Asian spectrum, and believe it or not are closer genetically to Punjabis and Sindhis than they are to Persians from Iran. Your language does not define your genetics.

For a Bengali like yourself, what would you know about Pakistan? Pakistanis are vastly different to Indians.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

progressive migrants

Then I must not be "early" or "progressive". I found that word annoying but then sort of embraced it because it was the rage here.

 

[Shorisrip]

Read what I said below. The majority defines. Not the minority. London has large Bangla population but that does not make UK Bangla. They remain a ethnic minority that has to integrate to the larger national canvas.

By that logic, Pakistan will be only Punjab, or before Bangladesh split of, Bengal. Muhajirs especially from the Hindi Belt make up a significant portion of Pakistanis, that's the truth.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Pashtuns fall between the South Asian spectrum

Now we got Banglas telling us who we are. Great. I am outta here. Too "fishy smell" around here for my liking.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

That's only true if you don't know how different the various ethnicities in Pakistan are from each other. I don't know of any Punjabis familiar with Pashtunwali for example. Punjabis share a lot more with northern Indians than they do with Pashtuns, Balochis etc. It's just that Punjabi culture is so widespread in Pakistan and the other ethnicities are not represented as well that we forget about these differences.


Even if that were true, it would be a good enough. Pakistan was not created on the basis of ethnicities but religion.

Lol......lol......lol.........
indian Punjabis are very different to Pakistani Punjabis. I know many Pushtuns from Pakistan and I hardly notice the difference between them and Pakistani Punjabis. I see them as Pakistani. That's all. I feel 0 connection to indian Punjabis and do not relate to them at all.

Whatever the reason for the creation of Pakistan it's ultimate destiny has become as a safe space for a unique race of people, with a unique culture and way of life.

If Islam is a binding force then there should be 1 country stretching from Tunisia to Indonesia. There isn't and there is a reason for this.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

By that logic, Pakistan will be only Punjab

Whether we like it or not the fact is Punjab does dominate Pakistan. How else does that corrupt don NS keep winning gain, again and again. If KpK was the largest province by now PTI would be running PK with IK as PM.

 

[MultaniGuy]

By that logic, Pakistan will be only Punjab, or before Bangladesh split of, Bengal. Muhajirs especially from the Hindi Belt make up a significant portion of Pakistanis, that's the truth.

No that is totally wrong.

Muhajirs only make a small percentage of Pakistan.

 

[Shorisrip]

For a Bengali like yourself, what would you know about Pakistan? Pakistanis are vastly different to Indians.

I know enough. Punjabi or Pashtun Muslims or "indigineous" origin Muslims in Pakistan are different to Indians, but not Muhajirs who make a big portion of your population. Also, a pashtun from Pakhtunkhwa is also culturally similar to a Qandahari Pashtun than a Punjabi from Lahore, same thing with West Punjabis and East Punjabis (except Hindko or Pothwari speakers).

 

[MultaniGuy]

I know enough. Punjabi or Pashtun Muslims or "indigineous" origin Muslims in Pakistan are different to Indians, but not Muhajirs who make a big portion of your population. Also, a pashtun from Pakhtunkhwa is also culturally similar to a Qandahari Pashtun than a Punjabi from Lahore, same thing with West Punjabis and East Punjabis (except Hindko or Pothwari speakers).

No you don't. You come from East of South Asia, which is far away from Pakistan.

Secondly Muhajirs make a small percentage of Pakistani population.

Thirdly Pathans in Pakistan have more in common with Punjabis in Lahore than Pathans in Afghanistan.

We Pakistanis have nothing in common with Indians.

 

[El Sidd]

Then I must not be "early" or "progressive". I found that word annoying but then sort of embraced it because it was the rage here.

So you gave in to the mob?

 

[SabzShaheen]

The above is mythological propaganda that has been debunked many times on PDF. Your conjecture does not hold up in real life. If ANY of what you said is true then Pakistan and ultimately bangladesh would never have been created.

Wasn't Bangladesh part of Pakistan before? Or do you believe it was always a separate country? Your logic could be applied to any part of Pakistan now and the claim could be made that it is always a separate country. Bangladesh became separate because of ethnic nationalism which was used by India in the same way it is being used now in Balochistan and other places. If these places became independent would you claim they were also never part of Pakistan and we share very little with them?

I don't understand you. If Muslims are one then there should be one country from Morocco to Pakistan. Or at least Pakistan should accept any Muslim from anywhere anyplace like Israel accepts jews from across the globe.

You can argue with Jinnah's reasoning if you want. He's the one who said Muslims are one nation. Anyway, there is a difference between a nation and a country. One nation can have many countries.

And as regards Pakhtun, Punjabi, Sindhi, Baloch well that is real and in the very make of Pakistan DNA. In case you missed the history boat NWFP, Punjab, Sindh, Balochistan existed before Pakistan and in 1947 federated into by Pakistan. For instance if Sinsdh had voted for India it would have been part of India.

I know that. So if Sindh became part of India would you argue that they were always different from us?

As regards the small % that overlaps into India that is nothing unique. Turkey/Iran/Iraq share the Kurdish overlap. However do note this overlap is a sliver of tiny sliver. Exactly how many Sindhi's are there in India? Or how many Punjabis are there in India. Below 3%.

UK has at least 6% population with heritage to South Asia but that does not make UK a South Asian country because rest of the 94% have differant background and are native to British Isles. ditto Pakistan/Indus River Valley.

I'm no genetics expert but I bet every ethnicity in the region is very genetically similar when collectively compared to central asia for example. Also, our culture is similar so genetics is not the only thing.

There are huge differences between Urdu and Hindi.

Hindi has been sanskritized now and shares little in common with Urdu.

So? Speaking wise they are pretty much the same and lots of people in India speak Urdu anyway

Yes Pakistan was created in the name of Islam. Everybody knows that. But still, the only thing we have in common with a Muslim Tamil is just religion.

And I've told you already that that should be a good enough reason for us to identify as a single nation, according to Jinnah.