How the British victory at Plassey created the modern Durga Pujo

[Rajaraja Chola]

Any and all Hindus were dold as slaves in muslim Bengal.

Not in British bengal because Brahmins made up the BULK of the East Indian army.

Their Bengal regiment was their finest regiment and Brahmins joined up in bulk because they saw a way out of Islamic terror.

This changed only after the Brahmins turned on the british during the 1857 revolt, which was started by a Brahmin called "Mangal Pandey".

So from the Maratha Peshwa to the "Munity of 1857", it was the Brahmins who fought for hindus.

Its your hate and ignorance that make you sprout such dravida nonsense.

Lol. Brahmins formed the backbone of adminstration under Muslim regimes too I am talking from Mughal point of view. They formed the backbone of British administration too. We need some experts in Bengal history to talk about Bengal scenario.

It really doesnt matter whether I am a dravida or not. But the fact remains I am able to call a spade a spade. And you dont. And I have a lot of Brahmin and Muslim friends in real life.

 

[HariVamsha]

Lol. Brahmins formed the backbone of adminstration under Muslim regimes too I am talking from Mughal point of view. They formed the backbone of British administration too. We need some experts in Bengal history to talk about Bengal scenario.

It really doesnt matter whether I am a dravida or not. But the fact remains I am able to call a spade a spade. And you dont. And I have a lot of Brahmin and Muslim friends in real life.

I don't really care if you are a dravida or not, you are speaking the language of dravida anti brahminical mindset.
Same goes or your personal friendship with people of different caste or faith. That is irrelevant and unverifiable.

Brahmins were the educated and scholarly lot in the Indian society, so its natural they were sought out by the kings and local rules irrespective of who ruled. From Hindu rulers to muslim rulers to British rulers.

Its a concept called Meritocracy. You might have heard about it before the advent of "reservation".

However the majority of Adminstrative work was in the hands of non muslims and non hindus, so I do not see how you can single out the brahmins for abuse.

In fact, Hindus in India hold a great deal of debt to the brahmins for keeping the traditions of Hinduism and the scriptures of Hinduism alive. Not to mention the great works of literature, art, music, dance, architecture etc. alive.

Without the brahmins, everything Hindu would have been wiped out of India in the last 1000 years.

So first learn to say "Thank you" before you assume you have the "right" to abuse them.

In fact, Brahmins were discriminated by the British after their experience of 1857 and they educated the Hindus to hate the brahmins and hold them in contempt. You are the product of this same british "re-education". ONly you are too stupid and ignorant o recognized it.

Finally here is proof you will loath to see,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Brahmans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3rd_Brahmans

Prior to 1857, the majority of Sepoys in Bengal Presidency were Kanyakubja Brahmins from Awadh and Bhumihar Brahmins from Eastern UP and Western Bihar. Infact, these Brahmin Sepoys (along with Mahars and Madras sepoys) won battles for East India Company prior to 1857 which paved way for the British Raj.

All of those employed were from kingdoms ruled by muslim rulers.

 

[Levina]

There is different between a regular offender and one of instance and I am sure you can differentiate that.

Is it?
One off instance?
Really?
I can post a lot more evidence against BBC but then I will be picked up for derailing this thread. Lol


Btw your link shows this>>>>

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Lol. Brahmins formed the backbone of adminstration under Muslim regimes too I am talking from Mughal point of view. They formed the backbone of British administration too. We need some experts in Bengal history to talk about Bengal scenario.

It really doesnt matter whether I am a dravida or not. But the fact remains I am able to call a spade a spade. And you dont. And I have a lot of Brahmin and Muslim friends in real life.

All people collaborated. But more research is needed to find out who did more. From your perspective you may say it is group x. A more thorough analysis of this should be done.

Was Brahmins sold as slaves in Muslim and British era is my question

In their thousands.
The biggest example is in Kashmir itself.

In the British era - not so much. Because they were usually not well built for hard manual labor.

But during the Islamic rule, they were widely used as sex slaves, especially the women. Every temple destruction usually had the Brahmins first put to death.

Even the 'Brahmins' who worked in the court of the Mughals for instance actually had to convert to Islam. Like Tansen and so on.

But the fact remains I am able to call a spade a spade

The part where you say Brahmins took care of themselves alone is partly true. But that is true for the entire Dharmic community - even broadly Hindus, Buddhists, Jains etc. The level of unity shown by the Muslims in conflict was unprecedented in India. That remains true to this day.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

All people collaborated. But more research is needed to find out who did more. From your perspective you may say it is group x. A more thorough analysis of this should be done.

In their thousands.
The biggest example is in Kashmir itself.

In the British era - not so much. Because they were usually not well built for hard manual labor.

But during the Islamic rule, they were widely used as sex slaves, especially the women. Every temple destruction usually had the Brahmins first put to death.

Even the 'Brahmins' who worked in the court of the Mughals for instance actually had to convert to Islam. Like Tansen and so on.


The part where you say Brahmins took care of themselves alone is partly true. But that is true for the entire Dharmic community - even broadly Hindus, Buddhists, Jains etc. The level of unity shown by the Muslims in conflict was unprecedented in India. That remains true to this day.

I know how Brahmins were converted in kashmir. Infact in Kashmir an Brahmin convert to Muslim Minister along with the King played havoc in conversion of people in Kashmir. But the topic in general was about Bengal Brahmins, which I have less knowledge of.

And its very much true they took care of themselves. Man see the pre & post colonial top Indian Admininstrators. They being educated in all eras could have used to educate, unite Hindus and could have come themselves as leaders. But that was not to be. They were very mindful of their place in caste hierarchy, practised untouchability (various other non brahmins castes practised that too) etc etc. Though I have nothing against current brahmins, but our past ones were outright selfserving.

Irony though it may seem, but they were forefronts of Indian Independence till later OBC leaders came in and shared stage.

I don't really care if you are a dravida or not, you are speaking the language of dravida anti brahminical mindset.
Same goes or your personal friendship with people of different caste or faith. That is irrelevant and unverifiable.

Brahmins were the educated and scholarly lot in the Indian society, so its natural they were sought out by the kings and local rules irrespective of who ruled. From Hindu rulers to muslim rulers to British rulers.

Its a concept called Meritocracy. You might have heard about it before the advent of "reservation".

However the majority of Adminstrative work was in the hands of non muslims and non hindus, so I do not see how you can single out the brahmins for abuse.

In fact, Hindus in India hold a great deal of debt to the brahmins for keeping the traditions of Hinduism and the scriptures of Hinduism alive. Not to mention the great works of literature, art, music, dance, architecture etc. alive.

Without the brahmins, everything Hindu would have been wiped out of India in the last 1000 years.

So first learn to say "Thank you" before you assume you have the "right" to abuse them.

In fact, Brahmins were discriminated by the British after their experience of 1857 and they educated the Hindus to hate the brahmins and hold them in contempt. You are the product of this same british "re-education". ONly you are too stupid and ignorant o recognized it.

Finally here is proof you will loath to see,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Brahmans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3rd_Brahmans

Prior to 1857, the majority of Sepoys in Bengal Presidency were Kanyakubja Brahmins from Awadh and Bhumihar Brahmins from Eastern UP and Western Bihar. Infact, these Brahmin Sepoys (along with Mahars and Madras sepoys) won battles for East India Company prior to 1857 which paved way for the British Raj.

All of those employed were from kingdoms ruled by muslim rulers.

Lol. We Dravida (As u call us) or Southerners are the only relic of anything historic related to Hinduism standing to this day. Without Southern India you guys wouldnt have anything to call yourself or a place to pray onto.

Say thank you? My a$$. Reflecting the root of the problem is the first step onto salvation, which thankfully many from your community have realised. Brahmins were meritious. Agreed. But how many non Brahmins did they educate? Did they help? Did they do anything for Hindu unity? Nothing. They even ostrasized Brahmins who did not follow untouchability, not so different from current age Muslims do to those who dont follow Islamic teachings. They had the opportunity for leadership, education, eradication of social ills. They lost everything. They self served themselves.

Say Thank you to me, Southern Kings(non brahmins and we used non brahmin preists too in those days) for safeguarding the Hindu tradition, its science, temples, culture and what not that you call urself urs today.

I am done with you. What I stated is fact. If you cant digest it then fine.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

I know how Brahmins were converted in kashmir. Infact in Kashmir an Brahmin convert to Muslim Minister along with the King played havoc in conversion of people in Kashmir.

Precisely.

But the topic in general was about Bengal Brahmins, which I have less knowledge of.

Oh ok. But even there are some issues.

Man see the pre & post colonial top Indian Admininstrators.

Yes. Especially Bengali Hindus.
But ...
i. But in hindsight you cannot blame them much (I guess). The Nawab rule was just over and these people must have been grateful to the British. Just like the Sikhs supported the Brits during the 1857 revolt.
ii. Most of the Hindu social reformers (from Bengal) actually came from among the Brahmins then. @Rain Man correct me if I am wrong. I think the Brahmos, widow remarriage etc - the initiative for social reform was pioneered. Credit should be given here in that case.

They being educated in all eras could have used to educate, unite Hindus and could have come themselves as leaders. But that was not to be.

True. But this is a deep psychological issue. Even I have felt this. Forget uniting together. When Brahmins are hit hard, they just leave the place in droves in search for safer pastures. Physically fighting back is quite taboo. That should be rectified. Parsuram (He was Brahmin right?) was an exception.

They were very mindful of their place in caste hierarchy, practised untouchability (various other non brahmins castes practised that too) etc etc.

This is very localized. In some case very strong. In Tamil Nadu they were very strong, but elsewhere I can't say much. But then all of this was both a boon and a curse for them too. Like we even today are too loathe to fight back.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Yes. Especially Bengali Hindus.
But ...
i. But in hindsight you cannot blame them much (I guess). The Nawab rule was just over and these people must have been grateful to the British. Just like the Sikhs supported the Brits during the 1857 revolt.
ii. Most of the Hindu social reformers (from Bengal) actually came from among the Brahmins then. @Rain Man correct me if I am wrong. I think the Brahmos, widow remarriage etc - the initiative for social reform was pioneered. Credit should be given here in that case.

True. But this is a deep psychological issue. Even I have felt this. Forget uniting together. When Brahmins are hit hard, they just leave the place in droves in search for safer pastures. Physically fighting back is quite taboo. That should be rectified. Parsuram (He was Brahmin right?) was an exception.

Rajaram Mohan Roy was a Bengali. As I said before, the initial leaders of social reformers and Independence activists were Brahmins. Subramanya Bharathi down south is a Brahmin himself. They brought about change. They were considered far left then

I dont want to restrict my timeline to Nawab time. Its just along ages they could have been leaders of an unifying Hindu religion. Atleast 4 mutts by Adi Sankara could have served as focal points for Hindu unity. But there was no effort by them which is my grouse. Even when old social reformers like Adi, Ragavendra tried to eradicate ills, they were opposed by none other than by brethens.

However past is past, and future can be corrected. Peshwas too are brahmins and warriors.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

future can be corrected. Peshwas too are brahmins and warriors.

Yes, very true.

 

[dray]

Maa Durga as the main Hindu goddess was not invented during the British rule, she has been worshiped all over India in different names for ages.
"The first grand worship of Goddess Durga in recorded history is said to have been celebrated in the late 1500s. Folklores say the landlords, or zamindar, of Dinajpur and Malda initiated the first Durga Puja in Bengal. According to another source, Raja Kangshanarayan of Taherpur or Bhabananda Mazumdar of Nadiya organized the first Sharadiya or Autumn Durga Puja in Bengal in 1606".

The "Modern Durga Pujo"...as the writer calls it, are predominantly community pujo or 'baroyari pujo' (the way we call it), and not those 'zamindari pujo', and 'baroyari pujo' barely had anything to do with British Raj. Later Durga pujo was made very popular and the biggest festival of Bengal by none other than Swami Vivekananda.

https://www.thoughtco.com/the-history-and-origin-of-durga-puja-1770159

This article was written with some kind of agenda....British might have patronized their loyal zamindars' Durga pujo at some point in history, but they certainly didn't create it.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Maa Durga as the main Hindu goddess was not invented during the British rule, she has been worshiped all over India in different names for ages.
"The first grand worship of Goddess Durga in recorded history is said to have been celebrated in the late 1500s. Folklores say the landlords, or zamindar, of Dinajpur and Malda initiated the first Durga Puja in Bengal. According to another source, Raja Kangshanarayan of Taherpur or Bhabananda Mazumdar of Nadiya organized the first Sharadiya or Autumn Durga Puja in Bengal in 1606".

The "Modern Durga Pujo"...as the writer calls it, are predominantly community pujo or 'baroyari pujo' (the way we call it), and not those 'zamindari pujo', and 'baroyari pujo' barely had anything to do with British Raj. Later Durga pujo was made very popular and the biggest festival of Bengal by none other than Swami Vivekananda.

https://www.thoughtco.com/the-history-and-origin-of-durga-puja-1770159

This article was written with some kind of agenda....British might have patronized their loyal zamindars' Durga pujo at some point in history, but they certainly didn't create it.

Yes, that was precisely what I was thinking.

Even my grandfather used to chant the Durga Gauri Amba mantra in the morning.

 

[dray]

Yes, that was precisely what I was thinking.

Even my grandfather used to chant the Durga Gauri Amba mantra in the morning.

We have only 3 primary goddesses, Durga, Laxmi, and Saraswati. And Durga is known and worshiped in many names, Amba, Gauri, Vaishnodevi, Kamakhya, even our Maa Kali...all are one.

 

[jetray]

Am not talking that it shouldnt be famous. But the reason for that if this story is true which isnt likely as Daniyal writes BS which I failed to take notice of the author.

Granted Hindus werent united. But you cant deny who reaped the benefits and who formed the backbone of British adminstration along with the rich Muslims.

some so called selfish elitists call it as survival tactics and their response would be why suffer when you live a good life under servitude at the expense of others. I would put it as lack of spine and self respect. India always has been plagued by such ppl. ppl always put themselves first instead of ignoring the fact that sticking together as a large group will delivers better benefits in the long run. No wonder a small british contingent could run over the entire country.

Even now countries get respect & fear based on how united they are. A lousy country like NK or one run by radicals will generate more fear than a country like India bcos India has no will power to do or implement what they say.

Haha
Look who's talking!!!

BBC isn't an angel either>>>

View attachment 409051

Why only BBC, even now isnt the rogue mallya throwing gauntlet to come and get him. Why dint India threaten to cut down trade or impose restrictions on british companies ? simply bcos b***** in parliament dont want to lose their so called privileges or stashed wealth. This problem happens bcos these are not true representatives of ppl but simply elitist scum who have grabbed the power.

Democracy works better when the class which represents majority of the ppl are represented by themselves. Indian ppl has simply failed to elect their representatives.

 

[The_Showstopper]

Is it?
One off instance?
Really?
I can post a lot more evidence against BBC but then I will be picked up for derailing this thread. Lol


Btw your link shows this>>>>



View attachment 409088

Well dear, they have deleted it after getting caught pants down. I've posted a picture which is a screenshot of the news article. Have you even gone through the link I provided you with regarding the numerous times this news portal have posted multiple fake news within a short period of time. In its long history of presenting news BBC must have presented a wrong inadvertently/wilfully but when you look at both comparatively, postcard will win hands down in presenting fake misleading news.