how much of Urdu is Sanskrit based and persian based?

[SHAMK9]

its simple.. if urdi language and culture were strong they would been influencing other language and cultures and others been crying. its always superior culture and language that inflluence inferior one.

if pakistanis open their border for indians. punjabicised hindi will butcher urdu of pakistan. resistance is futile pakistanis

Lmao, whata hell is punjabicised hindi? before 'butchering' other's languages, try to keep yours alive

 

[INDIC]

Lmao, whata hell is punjabicised hindi? before 'butchering' other's languages, try to keep yours alive

Hindi filmon mein Punjabi gaane hote hain, jise sun poora Pakistan jhoomta hai.

 

[jatt+gutts]

Lmao.


Even you Punjabi Indians use foreign vocab in your Punjabi.

You guys say Bhagwan Rakha or Raab Rakha?

Clown.

never heard that... we say suker ya rabb da. we do have some foreign words in our language here n there. but they are few unlike urdu which is khichri language

 

[jatt+gutts]

Lmao, whata hell is punjabicised hindi? before 'butchering' other's languages, try to keep yours alive

punjabi is alive and thriving. punjabicised hindi is the one they speak at delhi and bollywood movies of nowdays. many a times they speak in punjabi and they dont even realise it.

plus every other song now a days is in punjabised hindi and even shows have names like nachh leh instead of naaach lo

 

[Joe Shearer]

i heard from my uncle that dere is a marked difference between sanskrit we see in present form and between the vedic sanskrit.... vedic sanskrit he says is highly complex and difficult to learn.... is he right???

so may be before vedic sanskrit dere might have existed a much more complex form of sanskrit.... whose documented proofs we dnt have

Classical Sanskrit, as codified by Panini, observed strict rules, and observed them strictly. You could not deviate from that form, wherever in south Asia and in cultural (not political, not geographical) India you were.

Vedic Sanskrit - what some linguists prefer to describe as Indo-Aryan - was rather more free-flowing, and disregarded rules of grammar that were composed in later years. This can't be described as breaking those rules, because they simply did not exist at the time Vedic Sanskrit was being used to compose Vedic hymns and other parts of the Vedas.

The language which preceded Vedic Sanskrit is already known. It is called Indo-Iranian, and the two descending language systems were Vedic Sanskrit and various forms of Iranian, eastern, western and Avestan, which was different from eastern and western. Modern Persian descends from eastern Iranian (I think; this is not my subject area, and I only know that eastern Iranian was the language of the Scythians, and some tribes originally numbered in the Vedas as being part of the Indo-Aryan speaking family, are found later to have shifted to speaking eastern Iranian. Obviously the similarities between eastern Iranian and Vedic Sanskrit must have been as close, if not closer, than the ties between Avestan and Vedic Sanskrit.

Vedic Sanskrit may be considered difficult to learn compared to Classical Sanskrit because the classic form was strictly governed by the rules of grammar. There are scholars in western universities who 'know' the reconstructed Indo-Iranian language.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Large numbers very common words in Prakrit languages, and in today's Indic languages (e.g. nouns for eye, fish, sun, moon, field etc; verbs like walk, run, sing etc) are derived from Sanskrit roots. So it would be fair to say that Prakrit is a derivative of Sanskrit.

Panini's contribution was in systematizing the grammar.

It would be rather unfair and misleading to say this. Prakrit is derived not from Classical Sanskrit, post-Paninian Sanskrit, but from the older form, Vedic Sanskrit or Indo-Aryan. Prakrit existed in some forms prior to Classical Sanskrit. Prakrit was in no way derived from Panini's version; it is just that seeing the similarities in words in the two, and assuming that Classical Sanskrit was the form that existed from time immemorial, it is easy to slip into the mistake of thinking that two parallel constructions were one descended from the other.

@joe: You keep on saying that most of indian languages are originated from prakrit, then why common man on street only knows about sanskrit and nothing about prakrit?

Whose job or livelihood is it to publicise Prakrit?

 

[Joe Shearer]

It's best to leave this thread
Indian ego is just....

I don't understand. Where does an 'Indian' ego come into all this?

 

[Rig Vedic]

It would be rather unfair and misleading to say this. Prakrit is derived not from Classical Sanskrit, post-Paninian Sanskrit, but from the older form, Vedic Sanskrit or Indo-Aryan. Prakrit existed in some forms prior to Classical Sanskrit. Prakrit was in no way derived from Panini's version; it is just that seeing the similarities in words in the two, and assuming that Classical Sanskrit was the form that existed from time immemorial, it is easy to slip into the mistake of thinking that two parallel constructions were one descended from the other.

That remark was related to the roots of the vocabulary, the rules of grammar (standardized by Panini) were not in the picture.

 

[abvgroup]

Hmmm I do not know. Ok I'll try one last time.

If Northern Pakistan is mentioned in the Vedas, can you say what are the names and their present day names.

moronic indian, look at the list. most rivers are in northern half of pakistan, you stupid indian nationalists are so delusional

Northwestern Rivers (western tributaries of the Indus):

Trstama (Gilgit)
Susartu
Anitabha (listed once, in 5.53.9, with the Afghan rivers Rasa (Avestan Rangha/Raŋh&#257, Kubha, Krumu, Sarayu (Avest. Harōiiu)
Rasa (on the upper Indus (often a mythical river, Avestan Rangha, Scythian Rha)
Svetya
Kubha (Kabul), Greek Kophēn
Krumu (Kurrum)
Gomati (Gomal)
Sarayu (modern Hari River of Herat)
Mehatnu (along with the Gomati and Krumu)
Suvastu (Swat) in RV 8.19.37)
Gauri (Panjkora)
Kusava (Kunar)

The Indus and its minor eastern tributaries:

Sindhu (Indus; (sindhu also means "stream" generically)
Susoma (Sohan)
Arjikiya (Haro)?

Central Rivers (rivers of the Punjab):

Vitasta (Jhelum)
Asikni (Chenab)
Parusni (Ravi)
Vipas (Beas)
Sutudri (Sutlej)
Marudvrdha

East-central Rivers (rivers of Haryana):

Sarasvati (References to the Sarasvati river in the Rigveda are identified with the present-day Ghaggar River, although the Arghandāb River (a tributary of Helmand River) as a possible locus of early Rigvedic references has been discussed.)
Drsadvati, Apaya (RV 3.23.4, Mahabharata Apaga.)

you moron. have you seen a pure saraswat brahmin in your life . We are 10 times better looking than u.
btw kashmiri pandits are dardic too

I have you moron, you look exactly the same as other indians and not dardic people lol. You are part of the Dravidian race yet you are so ashamed of it

 

[Joe Shearer]

That remark was related to the roots of the vocabulary, the rules of grammar (standardized by Panini) were not in the picture.

Oh, I see. In that case, you are right, in that both the verbs and the nouns, and other parts of speech, the vocabulary were derived from Sanskrit.

moronic indian, look at the list. most rivers are in northern half of pakistan, you stupid indian nationalists are so delusional

Northwestern Rivers (western tributaries of the Indus):

Trstama (Gilgit)
Susartu
Anitabha (listed once, in 5.53.9, with the Afghan rivers Rasa (Avestan Rangha/Raŋh&#257, Kubha, Krumu, Sarayu (Avest. Harōiiu)
Rasa (on the upper Indus (often a mythical river, Avestan Rangha, Scythian Rha)
Svetya
Kubha (Kabul), Greek Kophēn
Krumu (Kurrum)
Gomati (Gomal)
Sarayu (modern Hari River of Herat)
Mehatnu (along with the Gomati and Krumu)
Suvastu (Swat) in RV 8.19.37)
Gauri (Panjkora)
Kusava (Kunar)

The Indus and its minor eastern tributaries:

Sindhu (Indus; (sindhu also means "stream" generically)
Susoma (Sohan)
Arjikiya (Haro)?

Central Rivers (rivers of the Punjab):

Vitasta (Jhelum)
Asikni (Chenab)
Parusni (Ravi)
Vipas (Beas)
Sutudri (Sutlej)
Marudvrdha

East-central Rivers (rivers of Haryana):

Sarasvati (References to the Sarasvati river in the Rigveda are identified with the present-day Ghaggar River, although the Arghandāb River (a tributary of Helmand River) as a possible locus of early Rigvedic references has been discussed.)
Drsadvati, Apaya (RV 3.23.4, Mahabharata Apaga.)



I have you moron, you look exactly the same as other indians and not dardic people lol. You are part of the Dravidian race yet you are so ashamed of it

If you would keep some control over your adjectives, it would be most obliging. I realise that your argument does not gell unless you add a moron to it, remark on our looks and assign us to the Dravidian race which doesn't exist, but even such a powerful argument fails to raise your comments out of the gutter.

Kindly retain some shreds of dignity and self-respect.

 

[abvgroup]

Oh, I see. In that case, you are right, in that both the verbs and the nouns, and other parts of speech, the vocabulary were derived from Sanskrit.



If you would keep some control over your adjectives, it would be most obliging. I realise that your argument does not gell unless you add a moron to it, remark on our looks and assign us to the Dravidian race which doesn't exist, but even such a powerful argument fails to raise your comments out of the gutter.

Kindly retain some shreds of dignity and self-respect.

I would respect you if you indians stop pretending to be some blue eyed aryans, which you are not at all, look at yourselves in the mirror for once. you indians make such a big fool out of yourselves all the time. you have no dignity at all yourselves

 

[Joe Shearer]

I would respect you if you indians stop pretending to be some blue eyed aryans, which you are not at all, look at yourselves in the mirror for once. you indians make such a big fool out of yourselves all the time. you have no dignity at all yourselves

If any Indian pretends to be some blue eyed aryan, itself an utterly proposition, does that give you the right to turn abusive about all Indians?

 

[abvgroup]

If any Indian pretends to be some blue eyed aryan, itself an utterly proposition, does that give you the right to turn abusive about all Indians?

Most indian nationalists pretend to be aryans, the only indians I respect are actually the ones who call themselves Dravidians, because that is what indians are

 

[Rig Vedic]

It may be that the Rig Veda does not reflect the conditions in the Indic civilization of that time as a whole.

For example, the pre-eminent Kshatriya dynasty of ancient India were the Ikshwakus, the "solar warrior" dynasty. However, that finds only a very peripheral mention in the Rig Veda. The Ikshwakus were based in the central Gangetic valley, going by the Ramayana.

But the Puru clan figures prominently in the Rig Veda. The Purus were settled along the Saraswati, were expanding westwards, and in the process coming into conflict with possibly Iranic clans in the Punjab.

 

[neokautilya2]

moronic indian, look at the list. most rivers are in northern half of pakistan, you stupid indian nationalists are so delusional

Northwestern Rivers (western tributaries of the Indus):

Trstama (Gilgit)
Susartu
Anitabha (listed once, in 5.53.9, with the Afghan rivers Rasa (Avestan Rangha/Raŋh&#257, Kubha, Krumu, Sarayu (Avest. Harōiiu)
Rasa (on the upper Indus (often a mythical river, Avestan Rangha, Scythian Rha)
Svetya
Kubha (Kabul), Greek Kophēn
Krumu (Kurrum)
Gomati (Gomal)
Sarayu (modern Hari River of Herat)
Mehatnu (along with the Gomati and Krumu)
Suvastu (Swat) in RV 8.19.37)
Gauri (Panjkora)
Kusava (Kunar)

The Indus and its minor eastern tributaries:

Sindhu (Indus; (sindhu also means "stream" generically)
Susoma (Sohan)
Arjikiya (Haro)?

Central Rivers (rivers of the Punjab):

Vitasta (Jhelum)
Asikni (Chenab)
Parusni (Ravi)
Vipas (Beas)
Sutudri (Sutlej)
Marudvrdha

East-central Rivers (rivers of Haryana):

Sarasvati (References to the Sarasvati river in the Rigveda are identified with the present-day Ghaggar River, although the Arghandāb River (a tributary of Helmand River) as a possible locus of early Rigvedic references has been discussed.)
Drsadvati, Apaya (RV 3.23.4, Mahabharata Apaga.)



I have you moron, you look exactly the same as other indians and not dardic people lol. You are part of the Dravidian race yet you are so ashamed of it

ha ha ha ..

we are not ashamed of weder we are dravidians , aryans , black , brown or white

the racism u ppl show will make even a brahmins head fall in shame