How do we improve people-to-people relations between China and Pakistan?

[Chinese-Dragon]

What do you think guys?

Due to some recent events (notably the fake marriage scam) there have been many posters on this forum and elsewhere who have tried to assert their agenda, which is to try and hurt ties between China and Pakistan. Which might have been less of a problem if people-to-people relations had been stronger to begin with.

The bottom line for me is that CPEC is a done deal, the BRI is a done deal, there is no turning back now. Whatever problems there are in the Sino-Pakistani bilateral relationship need to be solved, there is no other way in my opinion, we have to keep moving forward.

The elephant in the room (as far as I can tell) is religion, Chinese tend to assign a much lower importance to religion compared to Pakistanis who conversely tend to assign a much higher level of importance to their religion. There are many exceptions of course (I know a few Chinese who are very religious), but this tends to be the general rule across both populations.

In my personal life I have friends who have different religious beliefs than mine (I am agnostic/atheist), I've never considered it to be a problem, I'm sure most people here can relate to that, getting along well with people who have different beliefs to yourself. So for individuals it probably doesn't matter much.

But if we are talking about overall people-to-people relations between China and Pakistan, does it matter? And is there anything that can be done to bridge the gap? How about cultural differences, and for example the fact that Chinese diets tend to contain a lot of pork? Personally I have had really good experiences with Pakistani cuisine such as Lahore chicken and I don't see any problems from this side at least.

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts, hopefully we can keep this thread free from trolling.

 

[waz]

What do you think guys?

Due to some recent events (notably the fake marriage scam) there have been many posters on this forum and elsewhere who have tried to assert their agenda, which is to try and hurt ties between China and Pakistan. Which might have been less of a problem if people-to-people relations had been stronger to begin with.

The bottom line for me is that CPEC is a done deal, the BRI is a done deal, there is no turning back now. Whatever problems there are in the Sino-Pakistani bilateral relationship need to be solved, there is no other way in my opinion, we have to keep moving forward.

The elephant in the room (as far as I can tell) is religion, Chinese tend to assign a much lower importance to religion compared to Pakistanis who conversely tend to assign a much higher level of importance to their religion. There are many exceptions of course (I know a few Chinese who are very religious), but this tends to be the general rule across both populations.

In my personal life I have friends who have different religious beliefs than mine (I am agnostic/atheist), I've never considered it to be a problem, I'm sure most people here can relate to that, getting along well with people who have different beliefs to yourself. So for individuals it probably doesn't matter much.

But if we are talking about overall people-to-people relations between China and Pakistan, does it matter? And is there anything that can be done to bridge the gap? How about cultural differences, and for example the fact that Chinese diets tend to contain a lot of pork? Personally I have had really good experiences with Pakistani cuisine such as Lahore chicken and I don't see any problems from this side at least.

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts, hopefully we can keep this thread free from trolling.

The bottom line is people need to visit each other's countries and facilitate exchanges between schools, business folk, government workers and just tourism in general. Ties can only be fostered by person to person contact.
Also a few posters won't even make a dent on Sino/Pak ties.

 

[war&peace]

Some people will always be there who are negative, zealously emotional and would always opt the hardline stance. We should ignore them as long as majority and the govts are pro-Pak-China relations. Furthermore, we should always condemn the criminals regardless of their nationality. What we saw from some Chinese members was to defend the criminals by saying that no crime has happened and this is all fake news which was disappointing and created the heated debate.
Rest people exchange should happen but in a curated and careful way so that criminals cannot take advantage of innocent people and China has much larger population so naturally has a larger number of criminals as well.
Also, media should interact and people should learn each other's languages and visit tourist places. Even live in the other country for some time to understand the nature & culture of the people. I have started to learn about Chinese culture & history and I find it very interesting and mostly positive.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Also a few posters won't even make a dent on Sino/Pak ties.

I agree with that. My worry is a bit more about media houses, political personalities and social media. I was born in Hong Kong, I know how media houses and political personalities can easily whip up a frenzy in the pursuit of attention and profits (or political advantage). And the things they publish can spread like wildfire on social media.

Fake news is going crazy nowadays, even developed countries like USA can experience significant violence, shootings and even pipe bombs being sent to CNN because of it. Not to mention how such a large proportion of the US population can believe that Obama was both not an American and a Muslim despite having zero evidence. Just look at the current US President to see the direction of this trend.

The situation is a bit crazy across the globe. And I am concerned that China and Pakistan's "rivals" will exploit the situation by trying to portray it as an Atheist vs Muslim issue. Which can bring up a lot of anger on both sides.

 

[war&peace]

@Chinese-Dragon I honestly have a plan to visit and stay in China for six months and travel to different parts and interact with people, learn about their fascinating culture & traditions in person and not just from books and videos. We are already collaborating with Chinese companies for manufacturing of our hardware..security cameras, and recording systems.

 

[WAJsal]

Promote tourism and CPEC will help...I used to live in Islamabad where we have a lot of Chinese and I played Basketball and other sports with them, mostly Basketball, and we get a lot of Chinese tourists where I spent my early childhood (Hunza and Ghizer area). Anyways the point is we aren't doing as bad as people might think, we have language barrier and our culture isn't really very similar, regardless I'd say we are doing well with our relationship with Chinese govt and Chinese people. Currently I have many Chinese friends who regularly come and play and I have many in my area, all are friendly and always seems to have that childhood vibe to them, at least the ones I've come across.
One thing we need to do is to get our people and especially media to calm down and not to present a generalised bad image and to hype up small things for views. General public here have a very positive image of the Chinese people, such hate and negativity is present in every society.

 

[war&peace]

I agree with that. My worry is a bit more about media houses, political personalities and social media. I was born in Hong Kong, I know how media houses and political personalities can easily whip up a frenzy in the pursuit of attention and profits (or political advantage). And the things they publish can spread like wildfire on social media.

Fake news is going crazy nowadays, even developed countries like USA can experience significant violence, shootings and even pipe bombs being sent to CNN because of it. Not to mention how such a large proportion of the US population can believe that Obama was both not an American and a Muslim despite having zero evidence. Just look at the current US President to see the direction of this trend.

The situation is a bit crazy across the globe. And I am concerned that China and Pakistan's "rivals" will exploit the situation by trying to portray it as an Atheist vs Muslim issue. Which can bring up a lot of anger on both sides.

Pakistan has a lot of free media and some are really very critical of the govt and the state and some even promote anti state narrative because we are a democracy so we cannot exercise the same controls like CPC has on media in China. But on the whole people reject such narrative and they are either pro Pak-China friendship or simply neutral and not so much interested in political affairs. And then there is a corrupt elite whose strings are pulled by their foreign handlers and they won't let any opportunity to slip of slandering Pak-China relationship. With CPEC nearing the completion, their cries with increase but as soon as CPEC becomes fully functional and common man starts to get benefits, their propaganda will die and none will pay any heed to them.

 

[Well.wisher]

By creating good quality products in china sent to Pakistan.

 

[WAJsal]

By creating good quality products in china sent to Pakistan.

Bhai terey ko kisney bola 2 number China key handfree khareed, thora kharcha karley.

 

[bananarepublic]

By creating good quality products in china sent to Pakistan.

They sell products according to the people
Good quality products for good people kachra products for kachra people

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

What we saw from some Chinese members was to defend the criminals by saying that no crime has happened and this is all fake news which was disappointing and created the heated debate.

I understand that and I can see why it would upset people, it is a very sensitive issue to be sure. Personally I felt a bit defensive in those arguments, in hindsight I should have probably tried to listen more to the opposite side.

Anyways the point is we aren't doing as bad as people might think, we have language barrier and our culture isn't really very similar, regardless I'd say we are doing well with our relationship with Chinese govt and Chinese people.

The language barrier is quite a big thing in my opinion. From my experience (and especially in regards to those traveling overseas) a lot of Chinese people can be very self-conscious and worry that foreigners will make fun of their poorly spoken English and their accent. So they just find it easier to speak Chinese to people they already know.

Most of the Chinese members on this forum have pretty good written English, and/or live and study overseas, so it's not really representative of regular Chinese people.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

The bottom line is people need to visit each other's countries and facilitate exchanges between schools, business folk, government workers and just tourism in general. Ties can only be fostered by person to person contact.
Also a few posters won't even make a dent on Sino/Pak ties.

The few posters do raise valid arguments

 

[Fledgingwings]

Languages!

 

[masterchief_mirza]

The real problem is not some items of fake news or hyperbole spouted on an internet forum. China and Pakistan are well aware that politically their interests are aligned for short and long term. The overwhelming majority of Chinese and Pakistani people, whether religious , atheist or somewhere in between, fully appreciate the great strategic and localised benefits we have brought to one another's nations over the years - long may it continue. The REAL threat is the American-Indian nexus that operates with impunity out of Afghanistan. There is a fully fledged effort underway to sabotage CPEC via terrorism, 3rd gen and asymmetric warfare. Pakistan and China need each other more than ever to counter these threats. Our nations should actually educate both our peoples on these ground realities. Any anti-China or anti-Pak propaganda should be clearly exposed as such and immediately countered, without stifling sensible and constructive debate though. Nothing wrong with healthy debate that may allow both our nations to actually learn from one another's geopolitical experiences, as our histories are quite different and we each have plenty to learn from the other. This is the true basis of long term, unshakeable and ironclad fraternity. I see great opportunity for both our nation's - we must but reach out and seize it.

 

[waz]

The few posters do raise valid arguments

As do the many counter ones, hence an exchange of views. But anyway that should be left on other thread.