How and why is Bangladesh better off than Pakistan today?

[mb444]

Well Pakistan cannot be compared to BD as the former is multi-ethnic and the latter is mainly of a single-ethnic group. Look round the world and the single-ethnic countries do better than multi-ethnic ones economically.

Pakistan had those 24 years between 1947-1971 where it was able to use BD resources to enrich itself. No surprise that after BD left in 1971, Pakistan has mainly done poorly and is behind BD now in all indicators apart from military strength but the 2 countries have different needs in terms of military power. Pakistan is somewhat disadvantaged economically over BD as it has to spend far more on the military over BD due to it's relations with India over Kashmir.

Pakistan needs to get rid of its feudal system, better educate its population and carry out major economic reforms as otherwise it will be left behind India significantly by as early as 2030, let alone BD which is powering ahead economically at rates only seen before in East Asia.

Whilst homogenious population may help in gelling a country together it is simply a single compotent a portfolio of factors that make a country successful.

If we look at most successful countries i think what they have done is created an identity that integrates all stratas of their society together from the american dream in USA to the British indentity to bind the four home countries of UK.

Ethnicity obviously helps but its not the critical factors. In subcontinental case religion trumps ethnicities as history shows.

This thread alongside few others comparing BD and pakistan has turned to why comparitively BD is doing better and how pakistan faced all these geo political issues thus their failure is not their fault. The condescension that BD has sacrificed her sovereignty for economics beggers belief given that BD sells most of its goods to the west, buys mostly from china, sends its manpower export to the gulf and malaysia and its economy is mostly powered by its internal dynamics.

Pakistan faced challenges but pakistan also benefited by illigally keeping back Bangladesh portion of currency reserves in 1971 whilst BD accepted its share of united pakistans liability, stole all the deposit of cash from Bangladeshi citizens held in pakistani controlled banks and through the afgan and subsequent war on terror received billions and billions of aid.

Pakistans actions and policy descisions have resulted in their current situation as it the case for BD. I wish they would stop bitching and coming up with excuses.

BD challenges are greater than PKs. It faces continuous floods and other climate change issues, it has a huge and growing population with a small amount of land, its surrounded by combustible enemy states, have absorbed refugees in multiple waves and has minimal natural resources.

The only difference between BD and PK comes down to self perception. The former knows it has to work to punch at its weight class the latter continues to expect to punch above its weight class without doing any work to aquire such capacity.

BD and PK are different paths. For historical reasons we look back but we must stop this as it will only pull us back. We need to look ahead and seek to learn and emulate the dynamism of countries like china and indonesia.

 

[PakShaheen79]

Obvious reasons are corruption and nepotism. Rest factors are actually our strength. Miltablishment must stop its experimentation with our politics. We don't need more gems like Nawaz and Altaf. It was discoveries of these 2 entities which led Pakistan into a downward spiral in the 1990s and then again in the 2010's after Mush sccumbed to US pressure and gave NRO to PPP/PMLN. Recovery is still possible. Despite COVID-19, PKR recovered nearly 7% (or 11 Rupees ) during the last 7 months from Rs. 168/1 USD to Rs. 156/1 USD. Month on month basis exports have remained higher than imports which led to this recovery. All we need is consistency, working judiciary and watchful military. Pakistan's comparison to BD or any other South Asian state is misplaced due to the single fact that we have been fighting a war on 2 fronts since last 2 decades now. Something BD can't even imagine fighting.

 

[Michael Corleone]

i am surprised its only 41 billion.

1 billion was stolen lol

Well it didn't have Afghanistan as it's neighbor for one

Buuuurma

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

Well it didn't have Afghanistan as it's neighbor for one

Afghanistan gives majority Pakistanis their Pashtun roots, which racially sets them apart from India

 

[Michael Corleone]

It doesn't mean that Pak will be behind forever, Pak just needs 10 years of
Imran Khan.

Pak can't afford to have corrupt traitors like Nawaz and Zardari ever again.

Next election he will lose unless he follows hasina’s path and becomes the villain himself. South Asians don’t deserve democracy

Obvious reasons are corruption and nepotism. Rest factors are actually our strength. Miltablishment must stop its experimentation with our politics. We don't need more gems like Nawaz and Altaf. It was discoveries of these 2 entities which led Pakistan into a downward spiral in the 1990s and then again in the 2010's after Mush sccumbed to US pressure and gave NRO to PPP/PMLN. Recovery is still possible. Despite COVID-19, PKR recovered nearly 7% (or 11 Rupees ) during the last 7 months from Rs. 168/1 USD to Rs. 156/1 USD. Month on month basis exports have remained higher than imports which led to this recovery. All we need is consistency, working judiciary and watchful military. Pakistan's comparison to BD or any other South Asian state is misplaced due to the single fact that we have been fighting a war on 2 fronts since last 2 decades now. Something BD can't even imagine fighting.

We don’t have to, it’s not easy crossing rivers

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

Next election he will lose unless he follows hasina’s path and becomes the villain himself. South Asians don’t deserve democracy

PLease give us a deep dive and breakdown of this statement

 

[Michael Corleone]

PLease give us a deep dive and breakdown of this statement

Pakistan has never had one person win consistently enough to make a difference by next election people will be fed up with him and if he wins the opposition will not accept it creating mess... army will have to come in
he needs to do exactly what Hasina did to secure her power in bd.
SA doesn’t deserve democracy, need I explain more

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

Pakistan has never had one person win consistently enough to make a difference by next election people will be fed up with him and if he wins the opposition will not accept it creating mess... army will have to come in
he needs to do exactly what Hasina did to secure her power in bd.
SA doesn’t deserve democracy, need I explain more

how many terms do you need from a single person for a low income non-developed country to surge forward?

 

[BoggedDown]

Most of the Pakistanis or outside world does not know the real picture of Bangladesh. Though it is true Bangladesh has come along a long way since its inception specially in the field of poverty elevation, mother and child health care as well as job creation in the field of garment and textile as well other sector of low scale manufacturing. But its has gone backward in many areas specially good governance, democracy and human rights, as well as rule of law. It got problem of pervasive corruption and money laundering with ruling class and powerful elites, ever increasing economic disparity and ecological degradation, and single party autocracy with pseudo democracy facade. All path of peaceful power transfer through democratic process is in halt and opposition and decadence opinions are severely crushed. In fact rise of BJP government in India has shielded Bangladesh from outside criticism as a service it got support from current government in battling ongoing insurgencies in north eastern states. In fact current Bangladesh army and intelligence service is highly compromised with active Indian army infiltration and a significant portion of commercial telecom services are under Indian entity ownership. Bangladesh is also in a strategic battle arena for influence and market share between two Asian power China and India. In fact it is in crossroad with very fine balance and it seems history is repeating itself of year 1975. It may end very bloody like in 1975. The day current prime minister die naturally or God forbit violently, the day Bangladesh may plunge in civil war like situation. The turmoil afterward it may follow may reverse all these development stories you hear will vanish in thin air.

 

[UKBengali]

e 2 count

Whilst homogenious population may help in gelling a country together it is simply a single compotent a portfolio of factors that make a country successful.

If we look at most successful countries i think what they have done is created an identity that integrates all stratas of their society together from the american dream in USA to the British indentity to bind the four home countries of UK.

Ethnicity obviously helps but its not the critical factors. In subcontinental case religion trumps ethnicities as history shows.

This thread alongside few others comparing BD and pakistan has turned to why comparitively BD is doing better and how pakistan faced all these geo political issues thus their failure is not their fault. The condescension that BD has sacrificed her sovereignty for economics beggers belief given that BD sells most of its goods to the west, buys mostly from china, sends its manpower export to the gulf and malaysia and its economy is mostly powered by its internal dynamics.

Pakistan faced challenges but pakistan also benefited by illigally keeping back Bangladesh portion of currency reserves in 1971 whilst BD accepted its share of united pakistans liability, stole all the deposit of cash from Bangladeshi citizens held in pakistani controlled banks and through the afgan and subsequent war on terror received billions and billions of aid.

Pakistans actions and policy descisions have resulted in their current situation as it the case for BD. I wish they would stop bitching and coming up with excuses.

BD challenges are greater than PKs. It faces continuous floods and other climate change issues, it has a huge and growing population with a small amount of land, its surrounded by combustible enemy states, have absorbed refugees in multiple waves and has minimal natural resources.

The only difference between BD and PK comes down to self perception. The former knows it has to work to punch at its weight class the latter continues to expect to punch above its weight class without doing any work to aquire such capacity.

BD and PK are different paths. For historical reasons we look back but we must stop this as it will only pull us back. We need to look ahead and seek to learn and emulate the dynamism of countries like china and indonesia.

USA is composed of immigrants and accepted the English language and so not comparable.

UK is dominated by the English as they make up more than 80% of the population.

Look at all the really successful Asian economies after WW2 like Japan, S Korea, Taiwan and Singapore and they are all very homogenous.

India and Pakistan to a lesser extent will have to accept a less successful economy as the price to pay for having so many ethnic groups in a single country.

It is no accident that BD is powering ahead as its one dominant ethnic group makes the rules and we do not have gridlock between different ethnicities as so often happens in India and Pakistan.

Yes BD has the floods issue that affects its economy but this is not on the same level as Pakistan which is forced to spend several times more of its GDP on defence than BD has to every year. Saying that, Pakistan does have other advantages like it's greater natural resources and land-link with China but it has so far benefitted little from this.

As for the reference to the nostalgia that some Pakistanis have of the 1960s, there was only an economic boom in West Pakistan(Pakistan) and not East Pakistan(BD) as it was mainly BD jute and tea resources being spent in West and nothing intrinsically good about the running of Pakistan's economy at the time.

 

[SpaceMan18]

USA is composed of immigrants and accepted the English language and so not comparable.

UK is dominated by the English as they make up more than 80% of the population.

Look at all the really successful Asian economies after WW2 like Japan, S Korea, Taiwan and Singapore and they are all very homogenous.

India and Pakistan to a lesser extent will have to accept a less successful economy as the price to pay for having so many ethnic groups in a single country.

It is no accident that BD is powering ahead as its one dominant ethnic group makes the rules and we do not have gridlock between different ethnicities as so often happens in India and Pakistan.

Yes BD has the floods issue that affects its economy but this is not on the same level as Pakistan which is forced to spend several times more of its GDP on defence than BD has to every year. Saying that, Pakistan does have other advantages like it's greater natural resources and land-link with China but it has so far benefitted little from this.

As for the reference to the nostalgia that some Pakistanis have of the 1960s, there was only an economic boom in West Pakistan(Pakistan) and not East Pakistan(BD) as it was mainly BD jute and tea resources being spent in West and nothing intrinsically good about the running of Pakistan's economy at the time.

BD has a higher chance to become developed , it's just sad that we have corruption and lack of leadership.
Bangladesh has access to the oceans which is good,yes climate change is an issue but again it's an issue for all not just Bangladesh

 

[Jobless Jack]

I dont like this kind of threads

sooner or later

Pakistan is and will be natural ally

Its matter of time.

let by gones be bygones.

look to the future

 

[BoggedDown]

There is very much false notion in Bangladesh educated lot peddled by Indian propaganda and left minded intergenic that West Pakistan has sucked resources of East Pakistan for wests development. They forget that the reign was only for 20 years in comparison British rule over Indian subcontinent which included East Pakistan as well over 200 years, so how much they have sucked, no one ever questions. Also only resources East Pakistan produced during 1947-1991 is jute and tea of which total value may not exceed more than few billion dollar. On the other hand it got rice from West Pakistan which is its staple food. The value of jute was already in decline since second world war due to invention of man made fibers. So if you do the math it does not really add up. Also development of West was only for dams and canals and it was with World bank loans not with resources from East.


The major problem with Pakistan development was Afghan war, where Pakistan took part enthusiastically with mission to stop spread of evil of Soviet communism. After collapse of Soviet Union, the South East Asia and South Asia reap the benefit of globalization which followed with it in shape of outsourcing jobs, economic liberalization and capital inflows. But Pakistan missed the boat due to sever impact of aftermath of the Afghan war in shape of influx of refugees, guns and drugs. Also due to insecurity coming out of India-Pakistan rivalry as well nuclear compulsion which lead to heavy investment in defense sector leading to less space in economic development.

 

[mb444]

There is very much false notion in Bangladesh educated lot peddled by Indian propaganda and left minded intergenic that West Pakistan has sucked resources of East Pakistan for wests development. They forget that the reign was only for 20 years in comparison British rule over Indian subcontinent which included East Pakistan as well over 200 years, so how much they have sucked, no one ever questions. Also only resources East Pakistan produced during 1947-1991 is jute and tea of which total value may not exceed more than few billion dollar. On the other hand it got rice from West Pakistan which is its staple food. The value of jute was already in decline since second world war due to invention of man made fibers. So if you do the math it does not really add up. Also development of West was only for dams and canals and it was with World bank loans not with resources from East.


The major problem with Pakistan development was Afghan war, where Pakistan took part enthusiastically with mission to stop spread of evil of Soviet communism. After collapse of Soviet Union, the South East Asia and South Asia reap the benefit of globalization which followed with it in shape of outsourcing jobs, economic liberalization and capital inflows. But Pakistan missed the boat due to sever impact of aftermath of the Afghan war in shape of influx of refugees, guns and drugs. Also due to insecurity coming out of India-Pakistan rivalry as well nuclear compulsion which lead to heavy investment in defense sector leading to less space in economic development.

Bangladesh picked up its share of joint pakistans liabilities in loans but pakistan robbed bangladesh by refusing to date to split the assests. I fail to see how PK supposedly want good relationship with bangladesh and continue to rob it.

Bangladesh got rice from the west???? Was it given free???

Did Pakistan develop itself with Bangladesh resources..... an incontrovertible fact.... PK to date has failed to publish full data on relative contribution to the united pakistan exchequer and expenditure by wings.....

The last time this was done was in 1948/49 i think.... after that looting began until 1970...

Happy to be corrected.

 

[UKBengali]

Bangladesh picked up its share of joint pakistans liabilities in loans but pakistan robbed bangladesh by refusing to date to split the assests. I fail to see how PK supposedly want good relationship with bangladesh and continue to rob it.

Bangladesh got rice from the west???? Was it given free???

Did Pakistan develop itself with Bangladesh resources..... an incontrovertible fact.... PK to date has failed to publish full data on relative contribution to the united pakistan exchequer and expenditure by wings.....

The last time this was done was in 1948/49 i think.... after that looting began until 1970...

Hapoy to be corrected.

They have published this data and it is clear that Pakistan become richer at the expense of BD between 1947-1971.

Pakistan's economy is expected to grow 1.5% this year while BD will get near 6%, with a 1% lower population growth. Says it all really.