How Akinci &MQ 9 fit into Indo Pak theatre?

[huanghong]

100 millon is not solely for drone costs. Numerous support systems are coming.

India is purchasing armed mq-9b drones because they have several advance features and self-defense capabilities not found in other drones, putting them one step ahead of their competitors in terms of technology.

In any case, the key reason for having this in Indian inventory is to keep an eye on the Indian Ocean to counter the Chinese Navy. Every penny spent on it is worthwhile because it has a flight endurance of over 40 hours and 7 hard points. No combat plane in the world can compare to the purposes of drones during surveillance activity with the teeth...

China's WING LOONG3
40 hours and 9 hardpoints

Chengdu Wing Loong-3 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[MMM-E]

India is purchasing armed mq-9b drones because they have several advance features and self-defense capabilities not found in other drones, putting them one step ahead of their competitors in terms of technology.

In any case, the key reason for having this in Indian inventory is to keep an eye on the Indian Ocean to counter the Chinese Navy. Every penny spent on it is worthwhile because it has a flight endurance of over 40 hours and 7 hard points. No combat plane in the world can compare to the purposes of drones during surveillance activity with the teeth...

MQ-9 SG is for surveillance in the Indian Ocean


but Indian Army can not do anything with pathetic MQ-9
and MQ-9 is a toy to compare with AKINCI in technology and fire power


MQ-9 Reaper ... USA
Hardpoints : 7 ... but center station not used
Engine : 900 hp
Range : 1.900 km
Endurance : 27 hours
Operational altitude : 25.000 feet

-- 12 km HELLFIRE Missile
-- 15 km GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided Bomb

max payload : 8 HELLFIRE Missiles ( range of 12 km )



AKINCI ... Turkiye
Hardpoints : 9
Engine : 2 x 750 hp ( 1.500 hp )
Range : 7.500 km
Endurance : 25 hours
Operational altitude : 30.000 feet

-- MURAD GaN based AESA Radar

-- 16 km UMTAS missile
-- 30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
-- 30 km IHA-122 supersonic missile
-- 40 km KUZGUN-KY missile
-- 80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition
-- 150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
-- 180+ km KUZGUN-TJ modular joint strike missile
-- 275 km SOM Cruise Missile
-- 25 km BOZDOGAN air to air missile
-- 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile

max payload : 8 TOLUN guided munitions , 4 KUZGUN and 8 MAM-L guided munitions

 

[MMM-E]

Imagine having an asset with AESA radar,EW and what not and that moves at only 0.2Mach ; it's a sitting duck and waste of resources.

1-- Pakistan is not weak Ukraine which lack Air Force
( Pakistan has strong Air Force and AD Systems to protect TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs )

2-- India is not military super power Russia
( Indian AKASH AD System can not stop AKINCI UCAVs .... not even close )



TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs for self defense in Pakistani soil

Indian Army will try enter Pakistan
and TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil


Thanks to superior fire power to destroy enemy Troops , Tanks , Howitzers , AFVs , IFVs , MLRS and Air Defense Systems

AKINCI UCAVs even can destroy Indian MQ-9 UCAVs and AH-64 Attack Helicopters

Send 1.000 Indian Tanks into Pakistan .. no problem
TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can find and destroy all of them

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Nahhhh .. learn about military before talking

1-- Pakistan is not weak Ukraine which lack Air Force
( Pakistan has strong Air Force and AD Systems to protect TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs )

2-- India is not military super power Russia
( Indian AKASH AD System can not stop AKINCI UCAVs .... not even close )



TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs for self defense in Pakistani soil

Indian Army will try enter Pakistan
and TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil


Thanks to superior fire power to destroy enemy Troops , Tanks , Howitzers , AFVs , IFVs , MLRS and Air Defense Systems

AKINCI UCAVs even can destroy Indian AH-64 Attack Helicopters

Send 1.000 Indian Tanks into Pakistan .. no problem
TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can find and destroy all of them

Indian Army will try enter Pakistan
and TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil

After reading this, you are not qualified for any reply from my side.

Your posts are just self-delectable.

 

[MMM-E]

Indian Army will try enter Pakistan
and TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil

After reading this, you are not qualified for any reply from my side.

Your posts are just self-delectable.

I dont care about your side and Indian Army which can not match with Turkish UCAVs

Turkiye will continue to arm Pakistan against India
American weapons MQ-9 , AH-64 , etc are easy targets and can not change balance of power

TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil
Reality is always Reality

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

I dont care about your side and Indian Army which can not match with Turkish UCAVs

Turkiye will continue to arm Pakistan against India
American weapons MQ-9 , AH-64 , etc are easy targets and can not change balance of power

TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs can turn all Indian Army into scrap of metal in Pakistani soil
Reality is always Reality

Sure sure...

 

[FuturePAF]

MQ-9 SG is for surveillance in the Indian Ocean


but Indian Army can not do anything with pathetic MQ-9
and MQ-9 is a toy to compare with AKINCI in technology and fire power


MQ-9 Reaper ... USA
Hardpoints : 7 ... but center station not used
Engine : 900 hp
Range : 1.900 km
Endurance : 27 hours
Operational altitude : 25.000 feet

-- 12 km HELLFIRE Missile
-- 15 km GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided Bomb

max payload : 8 HELLFIRE Missiles ( range of 12 km )



AKINCI ... Turkiye
Hardpoints : 9
Engine : 2 x 750 hp ( 1.500 hp )
Range : 7.500 km
Endurance : 25 hours
Operational altitude : 30.000 feet

-- MURAD GaN based AESA Radar

-- 16 km UMTAS missile
-- 30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
-- 30 km IHA-122 supersonic missile
-- 40 km KUZGUN-KY missile
-- 80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition
-- 150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
-- 180+ km KUZGUN-TJ modular joint strike missile
-- 275 km SOM Cruise Missile
-- 25 km BOZDOGAN air to air missile
-- 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile

max payload : 8 TOLUN guided munitions , 4 KUZGUN and 8 MAM-L guided munitions

Any plan to put sonar bouy pods on it and torpedos.

Seems this UAV is value for money as a replacement of smaller manned MPA.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

You know TB2s have completely disappeared from Russio-Ukraine theatre and its b/c they are expensive for countries to constantly resupply them.
PAF has made very poor choice to go for TB2 and Akinci

Imagine having an asset with AESA radar,EW and what not and that moves at only 0.2Mach ; it's a sitting duck and waste of resources.


So I will say again They are useful only in less contested air space & have zero chance of survival in Indo Pak theatre.
View attachment 939623

Do you think all the top strategists of the world are all fools regarding UAVs??? Who do you think pinpoint the HIMARS to take out the Russian assets en masse to such an extent that Russia is massing another 100K troops? By the by, how many years of the NATO standard air warfare experience do you have?

 

[MMM-E]

Sure sure...

Only Indian Army can pay $100 million for pathetic MQ-9
Keep dreaming with your useless MQ-9 armed with 8 HELLFIRE missiles ..( 12 km )
... so funny

AKINCI UCAVs can carry even 24 MAM-L laser guided munitions with range of 15 km

try to enter Pakistani soil and see what will happen
AKINCI UCAVs can hit all your Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS and AKASH Air Defense Systems

AKINCI UCAVs to fire 60 km ALPAGUT kamikaze Drones to hit even moving Tanks from safe distance

( IR / E/O seeker and 11kg warhead .. nowhere to hide .. nowhere to run )

80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance

180 km KUZGUN-TJ Missile with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance

150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile

150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile

soon AKINCI UCAV .. with MURAD AESA Radar and 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missiles to turn Indian MQ-9 UCAVs and AH-64 Attack Helicopters into scrap of metal

Great fire power to protect Pakistani soil ...

 

[LeGenD]

MQ-9 SG is for surveillance in the Indian Ocean


but Indian Army can not do anything with pathetic MQ-9
and MQ-9 is a toy to compare with AKINCI in technology and fire power


MQ-9 Reaper ... USA
Hardpoints : 7 ... but center station not used
Engine : 900 hp
Range : 1.900 km
Endurance : 27 hours
Operational altitude : 25.000 feet

-- 12 km HELLFIRE Missile
-- 15 km GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided Bomb

max payload : 8 HELLFIRE Missiles ( range of 12 km )

Engines = 1
Endurance (max) = 35 hours
Hardpoints = 7
Operational altitude (max) = 50000 feet
Payload capacity = 1361 kg
Speed (max) = 500 KM / hour

US was using this drone in war when Turkey wasn't producing any drone of note. MQ-9 Reaper specifications were really impressive for its time but it is no longer in production. MQ-9 Reaper's successor is called Mojave.

Mojave has 9 hardpoints and 1633 kg payload capacity. For perspective, Mojave can be armed with up to 16 hellfire missiles. But Mojave is configured to carry a variety of payloads.

MQ-9 class has excellent sensor technology. It is foolish to claim that it is a toy compared to Akinci in technology and firepower. Think before you make a claim.

MQ-9 SG is for surveillance in the Indian Ocean


but Indian Army can not do anything with pathetic MQ-9
and MQ-9 is a toy to compare with AKINCI in technology and fire power


MQ-9 Reaper ... USA
Hardpoints : 7 ... but center station not used
Engine : 900 hp
Range : 1.900 km
Endurance : 27 hours
Operational altitude : 25.000 feet

-- 12 km HELLFIRE Missile
-- 15 km GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided Bomb

max payload : 8 HELLFIRE Missiles ( range of 12 km )



AKINCI ... Turkiye
Hardpoints : 9
Engine : 2 x 750 hp ( 1.500 hp )
Range : 7.500 km
Endurance : 25 hours
Operational altitude : 30.000 feet

-- MURAD GaN based AESA Radar

-- 16 km UMTAS missile
-- 30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
-- 30 km IHA-122 supersonic missile
-- 40 km KUZGUN-KY missile
-- 80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition
-- 150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
-- 180+ km KUZGUN-TJ modular joint strike missile
-- 275 km SOM Cruise Missile
-- 25 km BOZDOGAN air to air missile
-- 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile

max payload : 8 TOLUN guided munitions , 4 KUZGUN and 8 MAM-L guided munitions

Engines = 2
Endurance (max) = 24 hours
Hardpoints = 9
Operational altitude (max) = 40000 feet
Speed (max) = 361 KM / hour

Bayraktar <br> Akıncı

With its unique fuselage and wing design Bayraktar Akinci platform is a strategic class platform which can carry various payloads. Bayraktar

baykartech.com

Keep in mind that the payload TYPE can significantly affect endurance, operational altitude, range, and speed of any drone.

Maximum performance is possible with ISR payload ONLY.

Indian Army can not enter Pakistan , if Pakistan has 100 TB-2 and AKINCI UCAVs

Absolutely.

TB-2 failed in Ukraine, and Akinci does not stand a chance against jet fighters.

These drones are useful as a force multiplier and can inflict damage, but you are over-expecting from this stuff.

 

[indushek]

The basic purpose of UAVs is to act as cheap yet Expendable assets
But these big items MQ 9 and Akinci basically defeat that basic purpose
of having UAVs
MQ 9 costs India 100Milliom USD and Akinci is also not a cheap asset.
Romania purchased simple TB2 drones with 16 Million USD per unit cost (support and weapons package included) now imagine how much Akinci will cost us! Clearly at least 30Million USD per Unit.
And Indo Pak theatre is becoming highly SAM &Fighter Jets contested
Akinci &MQ 9 have have zero chance of survival in this region.

US tried to Arm its MQ 9 with Sidewinder A2A Missiles to give some defence to MQ 9 against Fighter Jets but realized that this thing can't pull out even a 2-G manouver for self defence and abandoned the idea.

I am trying to figure out do these expensive birds really worth of our hard earned money?
This money would have been better spent on loitering munitions development & drone swarm technologies.
I believe our our military planners are really vulnerable to social media hype created around new weapons and go after them without comprehensive analysis of their use in our own environment.
Even TB2s were shot out of sky right at the start of war by Russia and it's loitering munitions who are better sustainable for long spanned war.

@SQ8
@PanzerKiel
@MastanKhan
And other knowledgeable members

Or Am I failing to correctly connect the dots?

The MQ 9 deal has been solely driven by the IN and the other two, they never had any interest in these birds. IA and IAF actually are more interested in Heron's, and just like IN brought 2 MQ 9 on lease a year or two back, about 4 Heron TP's seem to be on lease with these two.

The only reason IA and IAF might be getting 8 each, out of the 31 total planned is for the long Chinese border. Given our pathetic ISAR coverage with just 3 AEW planes, its said P8I's had to be brought in post Doklam. Am sure most of these will go there and not exactly on to Western border, as there are Heron Mk2 drones in service for Pakistani border I feel (if necessary, things are mostly calm for now).

While they might get armed, I don't see them getting any armed action. They are just too costly for such ops, instead there are local drones like Tapas that might get used if need comes. There is a news about a day or two ago, of some 100 drones order being planned. Here a small video for rudimentary idea, and again the purpose is not attack but ISAR. Yes they can be armed with missiles, to protect themselves but not against jets I feel.

So to basically answer your question, are these drones worth it? think yes. Before drones got this good endurance wise (MALE and HALE categories), one had to depend on flying AEW planes for ISAR. Each flight costs a lot, and a big team has to be trained and kept ready for continuous coverage of hot spots. A drone in comparison, just needs lesser personnel helping with the issues of pilot and AEW team's fatigue and overall costs, and provide continuous coverage. Now as civilians you and I have no cost comparisions, to see if this is the case but overall that must be the reason I feel (but I could be wrong too).

 

[kinsr]

Only Indian Army can pay $100 million for pathetic MQ-9
Keep dreaming with your useless MQ-9 armed with 8 HELLFIRE missiles ..( 12 km )
... so funny

AKINCI UCAVs can carry even 24 MAM-L laser guided munitions with range of 15 km
View attachment 939655


try to enter Pakistani soil and see what will happen
AKINCI UCAVs can hit all your Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS and AKASH Air Defense Systems

AKINCI UCAVs to fire 60 km ALPAGUT kamikaze Drones to hit even moving Tanks from safe distance

( IR / E/O seeker and 11kg warhead .. nowhere to hide .. nowhere to run )
View attachment 939654


80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance
View attachment 939653



180 km KUZGUN-TJ Missile with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance
View attachment 939647

150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile

View attachment 939650

150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile

View attachment 939649


soon AKINCI UCAV .. with MURAD AESA Radar and 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missiles to turn Indian MQ-9 UCAVs and AH-64 Attack Helicopters into scrap of metal
View attachment 939652


Great fire power to protect Pakistani soil ...

How do they perform under wide-band noise jamming or when gps is compromised?

Any idea?

Please educate me.. I'm new to this.

 

[migflug]

Only Indian Army can pay $100 million for pathetic MQ-9
Keep dreaming with your useless MQ-9 armed with 8 HELLFIRE missiles ..( 12 km )
... so funny

AKINCI UCAVs can carry even 24 MAM-L laser guided munitions with range of 15 km
View attachment 939655


try to enter Pakistani soil and see what will happen
AKINCI UCAVs can hit all your Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS and AKASH Air Defense Systems

AKINCI UCAVs to fire 60 km ALPAGUT kamikaze Drones to hit even moving Tanks from safe distance

( IR / E/O seeker and 11kg warhead .. nowhere to hide .. nowhere to run )
View attachment 939654


80 km TOLUN-IIR guided munition with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance
View attachment 939653



180 km KUZGUN-TJ Missile with IIR seeker to hit Indian Army Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , AKASH AD Systems from safe distance
View attachment 939647

150 km IHA-230 supersonic Missile

View attachment 939650

150 km CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile

View attachment 939649


soon AKINCI UCAV .. with MURAD AESA Radar and 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missiles to turn Indian MQ-9 UCAVs and AH-64 Attack Helicopters into scrap of metal
View attachment 939652


Great fire power to protect Pakistani soil ...

The newer version are quite good

 

[MIRauf]

......
I am trying to figure out do these expensive birds really worth of our hard earned money?
......

I was skimming the initial post, then I read this line and I stopped.

 

[MMM-E]

MQ-9 class has excellent sensor technology. It is foolish to claim that it is a toy compared to Akinci in technology and firepower. Think before you make a claim.

MQ-9 has operational altitude : 25.000 feet
AKINCI has operational altitude : 30.000 feet

MQ-9 has range of 3.611 km
AKINCI has range of 7.500 km


AKINCI has also great technology and sensor including

-- AESA Radar
-- SATCOM
-- Electronic Data Gathering ( ELINT / COMINT )
-- 6 multi-core Artificial Intelligence Computers



Maritime Configuration for the Indian Navy ....its okey
but pathetic MQ-9 for the Indian Army

12 km HELLFIRE Missiles ... nothing else
even short-medium range Air Defense Systems easly can shoot down MQ-9


on the other hand AKINCI UCAV armed with 30-40-60-80-150-180 ,275 km MAM-T , KUZGUN-KY , ALPAGUT , TOLUN-IIR , IHA-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , SOM to hit enemy Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Air Defense Systems from safe distance

even 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile


100 million USD for MQ-9 UCAV and only 12 km HELFIRE Missile ... so pathetic

MQ-9 is a toy to compare with AKINCI in fire power