Hamza Abbassi backtracks from statement in support of Ahmadis after causing uproar

[Spring Onion]

There are two things:

1) Qadyanis as non Muslims: Done and dusted, people need to move on both Qadyanis and Muslims. Overwhelming majority of Pakistanis both Sunnis and Shia take them as non Muslims.
2) The rights of Qadyanis: This is the most important issue. They are the citizens of Pakistan by birth, and its the state responsibility to protect their rights. No individual or group should create law and order situation in their vested interests to harm the community and if such situation arise, state needs to ensure that justice is severed and is seen dispatched as well.

That is the main point.

By the way can any Pakistani member living near rabwah tell us that any Muslim can enter rabwah state of ahmedia without fear

It never ceases to amaze how usually rational sounding members of the forum state - "Of course the Ahmedis are non-Muslims and thus they can be declared so by the state." There is a difference between your personal beliefs to which you are entitled and the state which must not discriminate so as to actually choose the religious subscription of any of its citizens. I do realize that Ahmedis in India were declared Muslim by the Kerala High Court in 1970 - that has not stopped the All India Muslim Law Board from considering them heretics but a state definitely can't do that. That's just absurd. So Indian Ahmedis can perform Haj but Pakistani Ahmedis can't?

Ahmedis can perform their huj in qadyan aka India which is their birth place I am amazed that why till this day India never declare qadyan in India as the most scared place of qadyanis/ahmedia.

as far as the State can declare anyone or not well my dear enjoy it is the fruit of democracy and thus parliament can pass such laws.

On the other hand it is not personal belief either finality of prophethood is clearly stated in the the Quran.

 

[Pakistani E]

The problem here is that Ahmedis are not willing to accept that they are minority hence they say they do not need minority rights. The problem here is that AHmedis want us Muslims to go against the finality of prophethood of our Last Prophet of Islam Muhammad (PBUH).

So crux of the debate is that accepting Ghulam Ahmed mirza means we the Muslims have to go against our beloved Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) which is not at all going to happen.

And do you know that Ahmedis call everyone kafir who does not accept Ghulam mirza.


and oh BTW Khatm-e-Nabuwat koi debatable topic ha hee nahi so why should we even debate it in the first place?




This is NOT OPINION. You Ahmedia literally are insulting our Last Prophet of Islam, Muhammad (PBUH). So please do not try to hide behind such excuse of difference of opinion. The difference of opinion would be if you disagree with our beliefs but you are trying to amend words of Quran and asking for accepting your Ghulam Ahmed mirza

Your opinion.

 

[Jackdaws]

That is the main point.

By the way can any Pakistani member living near rabwah tell us that any Muslim can enter rabwah state of ahmedia without fear



Ahmedis can perform their huj in qadyan aka India which is their birth place I am amazed that why till this day India never declare qadyan in India as the most scared place of qadyanis/ahmedia.

as far as the State can declare anyone or not well my dear enjoy it is the fruit of democracy and thus parliament can pass such laws.

On the other hand it is not personal belief either finality of prophethood is clearly stated in the the Quran.

That is exactly my point. The state - whether India or Pak should not be deciding which is the most sacred place of a community - the person practicing that variant of the faith must decide for himself/herself.

 

[Spring Onion]

Your opinion.

My opinion is clear

You are citizen of Pakistan and our bothers and sister and nobody should kill you neither harass you.

And at the same time I cannot compromise the finality of Prophethood.

That is exactly my point. The state - whether India or Pak should not be deciding which is the most sacred place of a community - the person practicing that variant of the faith must decide for himself/herself.

Non-Muslims cannot perform Hujj. How hard it is for you to understand?

 

[Jackdaws]

My opinion is clear

You are citizen of Pakistan and our bothers and sister and nobody should kill you neither harass you.

And at the same time I cannot compromise the finality of Prophethood.



Non-Muslims cannot perform Hujj. How hard it is for you to understand?

Of course they can't. But clearly if you are an Ahmedi and hold an Indian passport you can and if you are an Ahmedi and hold a Pakistani passport then you can't. Or if you are an Ahmedi and hold any passport except from Pakistan - then you can.

 

[Maj.Osmani]

Of course they can't. But clearly if you are an Ahmedi and hold an Indian passport you can and if you are an Ahmedi and hold a Pakistani passport then you can't. Or if you are an Ahmedi and hold any passport except from Pakistan - then you can.

Ahmadis are officially banned from entering the country[2] and from performing the pilgrimage to Mecca.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya_in_Saudi_Arabia

 

[Spring Onion]

Of course they can't. But clearly if you are an Ahmedi and hold an Indian passport you can and if you are an Ahmedi and hold a Pakistani passport then you can't. Or if you are an Ahmedi and hold any passport except from Pakistan - then you can.

India a land of hindutva can do anything to abuse Islam. India is no authority over Islam

 

[Jackdaws]

Ahmadis are officially banned from entering the country[2] and from performing the pilgrimage to Mecca.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya_in_Saudi_Arabia

Clearly not an enforced ban as the article itself states that many Ahmedis perform Hajj

 

[Maj.Osmani]

Clearly not an enforced ban as the article itself states that many Ahmedis perform Hajj

because Indian passport / constitution declares them Muslims thats why and please this is pure Pakistani issue so lay off.

 

[Jackdaws]

India a land of hindutva can do anything to abuse Islam. India is no authority over Islam

I doubt any state has an authority over Islam or over any religion. But let's not digress.

 

[Maj.Osmani]

@Jackdaws

@Icarus @Manticore
Sir this person is trolling and discussing pure Pakistani matter and despite our efforts to make him understand He keep resort on ranting Kindly check him.
Regards,

 

[Jackdaws]

because Indian passport / constitution declares them Muslims thats why and please this is pure Pakistani issue so lay off.

OK - forget the Indian passport. If they are British, American or Australian or EU passport holders - even then no one will stop them. Correct?

 

[Maj.Osmani]

OK - forget the Indian passport. If they are British, American or Australian or EU passport holders - even then no one will stop them. Correct?

These are all non muslim states no muslim country allows them or issues a passport to perform Hajj. No non Muslim can enter holy cities.

 

[Jackdaws]

@Jackdaws

@Icarus @Manticore
Sir this person is trolling and discussing pure Pakistani matter and despite our efforts to make him understand He keep resort on ranting Kindly check him.
Regards,

These are all non muslim states no musim country allow them or issue them a passport to perform Hajj. No non Muslim can enter holy cities.

I regret you think I am trolling; I am not. I have never insulted your religion or your nation in any of my posts. I was merely airing my opinion which is clearly at odds with yours. I have lived as a person belonging to a minority ethnicity and as one belonging to a majority. I do believe that there will always be discrimination in societies - but when a state begins to discriminate then that is a recipe for disaster. That's all.

 

[Maj.Osmani]

I regret you think I am trolling; I am not. I have never insulted your religion or your nation in any of my posts. I was merely airing my opinion which is clearly at odds with yours. I have lived as a person belonging to a minority ethnicity and as one belonging to a majority. I do believe that there will always be discrimination in societies - but when a state begins to discriminate then that is a recipe for disaster. That's all.

This is not you problem and don't talk about discrimination In your country people from minority being killed in suspicion of eating cattle go and advocate their rights first don't lecture me.

Dalit Children burnt alive, Dalits not allowed to enter Mandirs...Muslim man killed / lynched publicly. Mobs + BSF killing Muslims for cattle trade...