HAL Hands Over Tejas Jets To IAF

[sancho]

I am judging from its development history. 35 years...

Which is why your judgment is wrong, because it's based not on the right infos. The fact today is, that with the handing over, the IAF has to induct LCA into operational service, the only question is in what technical standard, since THAT is the point that is uncertain so far.


Where you also are mistaken is what was revolutionary, because it's not the integration of foreign parts, but the (stupid) idea to not take them and develop radar, engine and other core parts alone, without any base to start them on. Not even China dared to do something like that (for good reasons and which is why J10 and J17 are successfully developed today), which alone tells you how "revolutionary" or ambitious, as DRDO officials like to call it, the program was.
It worked in some fields, like FBW flight control systems, composite materials, proper 4th gen avionics and EW, but it badly failed at engines and radar. The things you mentioned are only the result of the failed revolutionary parts, but if they had taken these choices from the start, just as China does with Russian engines on all their fighter projects, the LCA program wouldn't had suffered so badly and actually could had been developed in a pretty good time. But the silly focus on "revolutionary" things, was the reasons for the delays, of an otherwise pretty good fighter program.

Bottom line is, yes the program was badly managed, but the fighter will be inducted at least in IOC 2 standard this year and the minute it will be inducted in FOC standard, it will be a pretty decend 4th gen fighter for IAF's low end and offers the base for the Indian aviation industry, which is what the whole program was about.

 

[Superboy]

NO foc is pending then will have ifr probe and new quartz radome.

So it's not in service even thought it's SP?

 

[sancho]

So it's not in service even thought it's SP?

As I told you before, induction into service starts only with a useful number of fighters and this is only the hand over of produced fighters to the customer, while opertional service, starts only after the fighters are fully tested and certified. That's the same procedure in IAF for other fighters (IAF has more MKIs currently, than they have inducted into squadron service) and the same procedure in other forces all around the world.

 

[500]

Sure, just like the Lavi was a F-16 with Delta wings. Please live up to your title instead of licking around to suit your alliances.

Indeed Lavi was a F-16 with delta wings.

It has to move. It has a diverter inside that has to move as F-16 goes in and out of supersonic speed. Only DSI DiverterLESS supersonic intake has no diverter no moving part because it is part of the fuselage, not a separate system.

Nothing moves there sweetie, nor inside nor outside.

 

[Sine Nomine]

Indeed Lavi was a F-16 with delta wings.

And J-10 is a lavi with AL-31F...

 

[SQ8]

Indeed Lavi was a F-16 with delta wings.
.

I can wonder how sad the likes of those that worked on the aircraft would feel. Who worked tireless to incorporate composites and worked on RCS reduction.. Of those that designed its man machine interface. But then again, its an insult coming from Israel's own son.. so it would hurt more.

 

[rockstarIN]

I see no reason why IAF is not happy with LCA. Iaf loves the mirage 2000 Even before mlu which is going on now. LCA MK1 is much similar to mirage 2000 early jet, even I this IOC.2 standard.

 

[ni8mare]

Don't compare tejas, it will take another 5 years to get inducted and please don't bring the LSP FOC stuff as it counts as zilch. Unless an aircraft is serving in the front line force, it is not considered as inducted.

What I stated was the obvious fact, what you replied was an evndent trolling attempt.

lol.............it already started inducting ........and will take 2 years to get a full sqn

i will bookmark this .....for future reference

 

[longewala]

What are you trying to prove/say bro?

That seven years after "induction", they were still planning basic stuff like modern oxygen or ecm systems, and still lack a two-seater trainer variant

Yes and pigs fly.

You would know. You have been flying one for seven years.

What matters is the difficult part is done. 20 years of effort, despite sanctions and despite starting from scratch, we have a jet that is better than the m2k and mig_29s that were top of the range just 15 years back, that us better than the block-3 of the rival jf-17 and simply outclasses the existing blocks.

All we need is to ramp up to 16 per year and we will have about 70-80 mark 1 jets by 2020, and will have achieved parity with the paf fleet of say 120 jf-17s which would be a generation behind in terms of airframe, engine, radar or electronics

 

[Dazzler]

Which is why your judgment is wrong, because it's based not on the right infos. The fact today is, that with the handing over, the IAF has to induct LCA into operational service, the only question is in what technical standard, since THAT is the point that is uncertain so far.


Where you also are mistaken is what was revolutionary, because it's not the integration of foreign parts, but the (stupid) idea to not take them and develop radar, engine and other core parts alone, without any base to start them on. Not even China dared to do something like that (for good reasons and which is why J10 and J17 are successfully developed today), which alone tells you how "revolutionary" or ambitious, as DRDO officials like to call it, the program was.
It worked in some fields, like FBW flight control systems, composite materials, proper 4th gen avionics and EW, but it badly failed at engines and radar. The things you mentioned are only the result of the failed revolutionary parts, but if they had taken these choices from the start, just as China does with Russian engines on all their fighter projects, the LCA program wouldn't had suffered so badly and actually could had been developed in a pretty good time. But the silly focus on "revolutionary" things, was the reasons for the delays, of an otherwise pretty good fighter program.

Bottom line is, yes the program was badly managed, but the fighter will be inducted at least in IOC 2 standard this year and the minute it will be inducted in FOC standard, it will be a pretty decend 4th gen fighter for IAF's low end and offers the base for the Indian aviation industry, which is what the whole program was about.

You ran full circle and came back to what I have maintained. It all boils down to SWAT analysis if you will. But your gov and military establishment are too high on ego and low on reality. Making an engine without having any prior knowhow was the biggest caveat in understanding ones strengths and weaknesses. An example of pure bad management that costs your nation dearly. The fact is that neither Russians nor French trust your indigenous manufacturing capabilities and the postponed Rafale deal is a testament to this fact.

 

[Superboy]

1 Tejas was handed over, so why the title says Tejas plural?

 

[Tshering22]

Not at all, the LCA was nowhere near ready 7 years ago. It is what it is, corruption is hardly a factor moreso technical issues.

Sir ji, corruption was singlemost important reason why we messed it up big time.

I distinctly remember the first announcement in January 2008 that by year end it would get its IOC; I had read it from a cafe in Colombia at that point of time.

It is 7 years late and has cost us almost a dozen precious pilots in air crashes.

Corruption and defense contracts are like hand in glove you cannot have one without the other !

I know mate. But in our country it crosses all the limits.

In US, Europe, East Asia and even Southeast, at least they get the platforms in time. Here we don't even start doing something before a few pathetic ministers have made a few thousand crores. And still nothing happens. Until now at least.

 

[sancho]

You ran full circle and came back to what I have maintained.

Not at all, contrary to you claims which were based on nothing but bias on "past performance", I pointed to the current reality of the project that you are ignoring, which is that the fighter will be inducted within this or at least next year.
Just as I showed you the reality about what is the revolutionary part of the project, which you ignored as well in your statements.

So if you want comment on something, you should at least put things in the right perspective and then get to a conclusion!

The fact is that neither Russians nor French trust your indigenous manufacturing capabilities and the postponed Rafale deal is a testament to this fact.

Another telling show of ignoring realities!

If the Russians would not trust Indian manufacturing, why are they offering joint production of their helicopter and civil airliners from India for other export markets? Why are they allowing parts of the Su 30 produced in India, to be offered for Su 30 export customers?
If the French would not trust Indian manufacturing, why are they keen to divert wing production for export Rafales to Reliance, IRST / FSO production to Samtel, Damocles LDP, parts of the AESA and avionics to BEL, large parts of the M88 engine to HAL?
If the world don't trust India as a manufacturing hub, why is the ammount of production parts diverted to India from Airbus, Boeing, BAE, Sikorsky, LM, Rafael, AW, Rolls Royce, GE... growing every year?

 

[Superboy]

Wrong IAF has been handed 2 LSP LCA one SP1 and one SP 2 LCA.

SP2 is handed over? The article says first SP I assume SP 1 not SP 2

Here it is I quote.

Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) has handed over the First Series Production (SP1) of Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), Tejas, to the Indian Air Force (IAF) on Tuesday.

SP2 won't be out until next year IMO.

 

[Superboy]

SP2 by month end dear .

Really?