Greek/Hellenic Armed Forces Thread - Pictures, News Articles and Discussions on all Greek/Hellenic Military Affairs.

[Foinikas]

I want to invite you to a server but I dont know ıf posting invite link is against forum rules

It's against the rules from what I know

 

[Trisolaran]

It's against the rules from what I know

I see.. Well ıf you have discord I'l take risk

 

[Foinikas]

I see.. Well ıf you have discord I'l take risk

I don't have. I've heard other people talk about it,but I don't use it :S

 

[Trisolaran]

I don't have. I've heard other people talk about it,but I don't use it :S

I suggest you open one, There is Greek-Turk debate servers

 

[Foinikas]

I suggest you open one, There is Greek-Turk debate servers

It's pointless. It will be the same "mine is bigger" discussions

 

[Foinikas]

Naval Group reveals new information about the FDI frigates,such as the development of a new,state-of-the-art ECM by Thales.

And more features here:

Greece's FDI HN frigates: Naval Group reveals new details - Naval News

Naval News obtained from Naval Group a new illustration that depicts in details the sensors which will equip the new Hellenic Navy (HN) defense and intervention frigates (FDI HN)...

www.navalnews.com

Greece’s FDI HN frigates: Naval Group reveals new details​

Naval News obtained from Naval Group a new illustration that depicts in details the sensors which will equip the new Hellenic Navy (HN) defense and intervention frigates (FDI HN) as well as changes in the equipment.​

Dimitris Mitsopoulos 09 May 2023

During DEFEA 2023 in Athens, Naval News met with Stéphane Fremont, Naval Group’s Vice President – Surface Combatant Programs. We discussed the new image in order to clarify some questions regarding the FDI HN configuration.
We recently confirmed officially that the three under-construction FDI HN frigates will be equipped with the SYLENA Mk1 decoy launching systems (DLS) something that we had already assumed because Naval Group will provide its new Counter Measure Launching Systems (CMLS) for CANTO anti-torpedo decoys. Both DLS, four SYLENA Mk1 and two CMLS, are now depicted in the new image.

Note that the Narwhal 20mm RWS has been replaced by the LIONFISH. Note also the large shield just behind the funnels and the Sylenna Mk1 decoy launching systems. Naval Group image.
The most striking changes in the illustration of the FDI HN are the addition of protection “shields” in specific places on board the ship. The first shield behind the RAM launcher, protects the SATCOM antenna from RAM missile launches. The second (and bigger) shield, is located behind the funnel. It has two roles: It protects the sensor from the funnel exhausts but it also avoids interference between the SATCOM antenna and SEAFIRE multi-function radar (and other antennas located on the PSIM).
We also note additional communication antennas on the mast as well as the sensor at the polemast, in addition to the SENTINEL R-ESM immediately above the BLUEGATE IFF sensors, as part also of the SENTINEL R-ESM, in order to cover low, main and higher band. Mr. Fremont clarified that “low band and higher bands, are two options that have not been selected yet by the Hellenic Navy. France has selected additionally the low band R-ESM but not the higher band which is still an option, however Thales knows better the details about SENTINEL”.

LIONFISH 20mm RWS in place of NARWHAL​

The LIONFISH 20mm RWS by Leonardo is clearly visible in the close up view of the FDI HN. Naval Group image.
The most significant change illustrated by the latest FDI HN rendering is in the armament. Specifically, the Nexter NARWHAL 20mm RWS are gone and replaced with the Leonardo LIONFISH 20mm RWS! Mr. Fremont confirmed that and said that this was requested by the HN despite the recent press release by Nexter mentioning that the company will provide its weapons for the Greek frigates.


We asked about the laser warning system (LWS or else L-ESM) that the Hellenic Navy will add on its FDI HN and the fact that we can notice such sensors on the hull. Mr. Fremont confirmed that and said that there should be eight (8) such sensors to cover the whole ship.


Furthermore regarding the “lack” of STRALES kit on the OTO 76mm gun or a sensor such as a Safran VAMPIR NG panoramic long-range IRST system on FDI design, Mr. Fremont clarified that both systems were not requested neither from France nor from Greece. Nevertheless, the 21-tube RAM launcher (and the OTO 76/62SR), Safran PASEO XLR and the asymmetrical warfare suite (Bertin Technologies TV and IR surveillance system) located on the PSIM provide full protection and coverage respectively. It is clarified though that there are discussions to add VAMPIR NG in the Gowind corvette proposal for the Hellenic Navy corvette program as well as two PASEO XLR instead of SPYNEL-X sensors which are fitted on the UAE Bani Yas-class (Gowind) corvette, in order to improve commonality.


Mr. Fremont revealed also that the Hellenic Navy will use Schiebel’s CAMCOPTER S-100 on board FDI HN which will be accommodated in a separate hangar from the MH-60R helicopter that Greece will procure; at least seven such helicopters will join the Navy in 2023-2025. Naval News has revealed in 2022 that four such systems will be procured by 2027. The FDI HN is adapted to integrate this specific UAS. Regarding the MH-60R, Fremont confirmed that the American helicopter will be fully integrated with the FDI HN. He told Naval News that “We can adapt to any kind of helicopter. Egypt, UAE and France are some examples of integration of different types of helicopters”. He added that the RAM launcher will be fully integrated as well and that Naval Group has done it already for UAE Bani Yas-class (Gowind) corvettes. Moreover, it was confirmed that VIKING Norsafe Hellas will provide the RHIB for FDI HN instead of Zodiac Milpro ECUME.

FDI Future evolutions​

Naval Group image.

Regarding the growth potential of the design, it was clarified that the FDI for France has very big growth potential such as the installation of DLS and an additional 16-cell Sylver VLS, systems that have been fitted to Greek counterparts, plus other systems such as R-ECM (jammer). The FDI is designed “with margin allocated for additional equipment” and that there is still important growth potential for Greek FDIs to improve their equipment. Also, he added that the FDI can be easily equipped with a state-of-the-art R-ECM system as its electric power supply system is designed to support it. It was a decision of France to postpone the acquisition of R-ECM because “there is completely new equipment on the FDI (first it was a budget issue) and second they wanted a solution well adapted to FDI. That’s why we studied a solution together with Thales that is enough of much to the SENTINEL R-ESM. It is no use to have a great R-ESM and old generation R-ECM. That’s why we try to keep state of the art technology on the FDI”. He also added that the new R-ECM system will come most likely from Elt Roma but Thales will be in charge of the software. So, the FDI will be fitted with advanced R-ECM systems! The new R-ECM is set to enter a test phase next year.

 

[Foinikas]

Greece's New FDI Frigates to Feature Advanced Decoy Launchers - Naval News

At DEFEA 2023, LACROIX formally confirms the Hellenic Navy's choice to equip its new defence and intervention frigates (FDI HN) with the SYLENA MK1 decoy launching systems and associated ammunition.

www.navalnews.com

Greece’s New FDI Frigates to Feature Decoy Launchers​

At DEFEA 2023, LACROIX formally confirms the Hellenic Navy's choice to equip its new defence and intervention frigates (FDI HN) with the SYLENA MK1 decoy launching systems and associated ammunition.​

Dimitris Mitsopoulos 09 May 2023

The following press release by Lacroix during DEFEA 2023 officially confirms that the three under-construction FDI HN frigates will be equipped with the SYLENA Mk1 decoy launching systems (DLS). Naval News had assumed that it will be this specific model of DLS since late 2022 already and not the SYLENA Mk2 model which carries additionally three (3) CANTO anti-torpedo decoys each, because FDI frigates will be equipped with the new Counter Measure Launching Systems (CMLS) by Naval Group; two CMLS will equip FDI carrying six (6) CANTO each. Therefore the installation of four SYLENA MK1 DLS was logical.
Incidentally, Greece’s FDI HN will be better equipped than their French counterparts: For now, the first two FDI for the French Navy (Marine Nationale) will be “fitted for but not with” decoy launching systems.

Lacroix Defence press release
The Defence entity of the Etienne Lacroix Group confirms with this new announcement, its real dynamic in the sector of naval self-protection, but also the credibility of its systems and specific effects, for the protection of 1st rank ships and navies around the world.
The three defence and intervention frigates (FDI) for the Greek Navy are designed and produced by Naval Group in Lorient. They will be delivered in 2025 for the first two units and in 2026 for the third, and will rapidly and durably reinforce the capabilities of the surface fleet of the Hellenic Navy.

“LACROIX is delighted with this choice and thanks the Hellenic Navy, as well as Naval Group and DGA (Direction Générale de l’Armement) program teams who have worked over the last 3 years to make it a reality. This is a strong signal of recognition for us and all the industries involved in this project, which underlines French excellence in the naval field.

For the LACROIX teams, this is a recognition of the quality of our SYLENA systems, and a strong signal of confidence in the effectiveness and credibility of our effects and solutions for the protection of New Generation Ships such as the FDI“. François Moulinier, COO of LACROIX Defence.

A Sylena MK1 4-launcher system, will therefore reinforce the protection and armament system planned for the FDI HN, by equipping them with anti-missile solutions (Infrared and Electro Magnetic of new generation, by using the technology known as corner reflectors).

A choice for a reinforced self-protection system, legitimised by the return of high-intensity combat, in view of the current context at the gates of Europe, with the disappearance of the Moskva in April 2022 reviving the subject of the self-protection of ships and the effectiveness of the technologies employed.

In addition, LACROIX teams are working on the Greek Air Force’s (Hellenic Air Force) programs for the overall protection of their fleet of fighter aircraft (including Mirage 2000 and F16), and of course for the acquisition program of 24 Rafales.

A well known aircraft from LACROIX pyrotechnician’s teams, since LACROIX specifically designed, in close collaboration with the French Ministry of the Armed Forces, the Rafale’s self-protection decoys against the latest generation of infrared threats.

LACROIX is proud to be one of the industrial players involved in the weapon system of this aircraft, which is one of the most efficient in the world.

The many projects and programmes of the Greek armed forces, and more generally at the international level, for equipping platforms of very high technical and operational value, constitute for us a cutting-edge challenge, demonstrating our agility and capacity for industrial adaptation in a troubled geopolitical context.

 

[Dante80]

Regarding the growth potential of the design, it was clarified that the FDI for France has very big growth potential such as the installation of DLS and an additional 16-cell Sylver VLS, systems that have been fitted to Greek counterparts, plus other systems such as R-ECM (jammer). The FDI is designed “with margin allocated for additional equipment” and that there is still important growth potential for Greek FDIs to improve their equipment. Also, he added that the FDI can be easily equipped with a state-of-the-art R-ECM system as its electric power supply system is designed to support it. It was a decision of France to postpone the acquisition of R-ECM because “there is completely new equipment on the FDI (first it was a budget issue) and second they wanted a solution well adapted to FDI. That’s why we studied a solution together with Thales that is enough of much to the SENTINEL R-ESM. It is no use to have a great R-ESM and old generation R-ECM. That’s why we try to keep state of the art technology on the FDI”. He also added that the new R-ECM system will come most likely from Elt Roma but Thales will be in charge of the software. So, the FDI will be fitted with advanced R-ECM systems! The new R-ECM is set to enter a test phase next year.

Yeah, this sounds a little too hopeful. Prose and all.

 

[Foinikas]

Naval Group has also released some new photos of the first FDI HN "Kimon" and has already started construction of the second one.

Yeah, this sounds a little too hopeful. Prose and all.

Why,what do you mean?

 

[Dante80]

Why,what do you mean?

I don't foresee the TRL of a new integrated R-ECM system being brought low enough fast enough to match the implied schedule expectations in said paragraph.

 

[Foinikas]

I don't foresee the TRL of a new integrated R-ECM system being brought low enough fast enough to match the implied schedule expectations in said paragraph.

I don't know,that's what they said. I read on Defence Review that Naval Group said Thales is working on a brand new ECM for the FDI that will also be installed in the Horizon class. They said the system will be probably ready by 2025,when we receive the first FDI HN frigate. We'll see. But it doesn't make sense that they would make a brand new class without a new ECM.

 

[BON PLAN]

Thank you for your well wishes.

I don't think we will face the same struggles as India did when they started building their own fighter jet. They had to contend with technological limitations and limited materials and systems at that time.

However, building an aircraft today has become comparatively easier due to various advancements. We now have advanced design and simulation tools such as computer-aided design (CAD) software and computational fluid dynamics (CFD). Additionally, advanced manufacturing techniques have emerged, allowing for more efficient production. Moreover, testing and validation have greatly improved with advanced techniques such as computer simulations and virtual testing.

As said, the frame is now quite "easy" to study and produce.
Engine tech is mastered by : USA, Russia, France, GB.
China status is not clear : It seems they are now able to produce a copy of Saturn AL-31 on their own, but far from west reliability, and it's now a quite old design.
India half failed after a +35 years effort (half failure because their engine is unning in full dry thrust but not on after burner, and is too heavy for the thrust).

Fighter engine is one of the few key technology according to the USA. It's not without reason. Sorry to be hard, but fine tune your MBT engine (BATU) before dreaming of a high perf turkish fighter engine.

 

[Foinikas]

ÎΡÎΧ, ÏεÏιÏεÏÏμενο ÏÏÏομαÏικÏ, αÏÏ Ïην ελληνική ÎÎΣ Ïε ÏÏνεÏγαÏία με Ïην Paramount Group - Î ÏήÏη

ΣÏμÏÏνία ÏÏÏαÏÎ·Î³Î¹ÎºÎ®Ï ÏÏνεÏγαÏÎ¯Î±Ï ÏÏÎγÏαÏαν Ïα ÎÎΣ (Îλληνικά ÎμÏνÏικά ΣÏÏÏήμαÏα) με Ïο Paramount Group (με ÎδÏα ÏÏη ÎÏÏια ÎÏÏική), ÏÏην DEFEA 2023, ÏÏÏε να γίνει ÏÏην Îλλάδα ÏαÏαγÏγή ÏεÏιÏεÏÏμενÏν ÏÏÏομαÏικÏν...

www.ptisidiastima.com

A strategic cooperation agreement was signed by EAS (Hellenic Defense Systems) with Paramount Group (headquartered in South Africa), at DEFEA 2023, in order to produce loitering munition in Greece. The model being promoted is called IRIX (from Irix, Homer's hawk), and is based on Paramount's N-Raven model, which was introduced last year. The N-Raven has a weight of 40 kg, a maximum speed of 180 kilometers per hour and the ability to stay in flight for 2 hours, while it can also be loaded with various sensors.

The agreement between the two companies includes the transfer of know-how and technology for the development of IRIX in Greece, but also the participation of EAS in the Research and Development process for the further upgrading and development of future systems. The two companies announced that they will seek the broad participation of Greek companies in the supply chain for the production of the system.

@Zarvan @Hack-Hook @aryobarzan @SalarHaqq @Akritas @Gomig-21 @Philip the Arab @Hydration @Ghostkiller

DEFEA 2023, o "Αρχύτας" της EAB, ελληνική προσπάθεια για μη επανδρωμένο - Πτήση & Διάστημα

Ένα πρόπλασμα με ιδιαίτερο ενδιαφέρον έδειξε η Ελληνική Αεροπορική Βιομηχανία (ΕΑΒ) με το μη επανδρωμένο “Αρχύτας” που σχεδιάζει. Το προπλασμα δεν είναι τελικό αλλά δίνει μια ιδέα της σχεδιαστικής γραμμής, με ανεστραμμένη ουρά σε σχήμα V, και ατρακτό υψηλοπτέρυγη με σχεδόν ενιαία επιφάνεια στο...

www.ptisidiastima.com

A prototype of particular interest was shown by the Hellenic Aviation Industry (EAB) with the unmanned "Archytas" that it is designing. The mock-up is not final but gives an idea of the design line, with an inverted V-shaped tail, and a high-wing fuselage with an almost uniform upper surface as the flying wing.

The specifications presented at the show were for a vehicle with a wingspan of 6.4 meters, a payload of 14 kg, a cruising speed of 120 kilometers per hour, a top speed of 158, a stall speed of 74 km. air is declared up to 4 hours. The aircraft is a vertical take-off with two propellers in the front and another two in the tail in a duct arrangement, while a propeller with a thermal engine in a push arrangement ensures the horizontal thrust.

 

[Foinikas]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1656694706284232709

 

[Akritas]

Let me repeat: the Greek FDIs in relation to the French ones, have a separate compartment as well as cabling channels to quickly install the ECM.