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Greece-Turkey: towards a Rafale-Sukhoi confrontation?

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Moscow officially proposes to Ankara to acquire its Su-57 and Su-35 in export version, but also its help to complete the TF-X program

The Russian friend
On March 12, 2021, the Russian Federal Service for Technical Cooperation announced its desire to sell fighter aircraft to Turkey, and not the least of these are the two flagships of the Russian fighter industry, the Su-35 and the Su-57. In addition, the service has also submitted an offer of technical support to complete the development of the Turkish fighter TAI TF-X (Turkish Fighter - Experimental). Following its purchase of the Russian S-400 long-range anti-aircraft system, its eviction from the JSF (Joint Strike Fighter) F-35 program, and its involvement in the Libyan conflict, Turkey is now isolated under embargo. NATO even speaks of a "major problem of cooperation".



The Felon in ambush
A fifth-generation fighter-bomber, the fearsome Su-57 "Felon", of which 76 have been ordered, should equip three Russian combat regiments by 2028. It will also benefit from the support of winged drones such as the S-70, or the Molniya developed by Kronstadt, which it will carry in its hold. It would thus offer more than an alternative to the F-35, of which Turkey was expecting around 100. The Su-35 multirole would be offered in the immediate future, thus providing a gap-filler solution for the out-of-breath F-16C/Ds. These aircraft constitute a major threat to Athens. Recall that at the MAKS exhibition in Moscow in 2019, Recept Tayip Erdogan had been particularly seduced by the aerial demonstrations of Sukhoi fighters. But he also seeks to train a new generation of pilots, since many air force cadres had participated in the attempted putsch in 2016. An attempt on which Moscow had alerted Erdogan from its inception.



TF-X dormant
Presented with great fanfare at the 2019 Paris Air Show, the fifth-generation TF-X demonstrator, which is due to make its first flight in 2025, is now at a standstill. BAE Systems, the main partner since 2015 has stopped all cooperation under pressure from Washington. TAI, its manufacturer, has neither the engineering nor the DTIB to pursue this program independently. Hence the Russian proposal for a joint development of this aircraft that will replace the entire fleet of F-16s of the Türk Hava Kuvvetleri. This partnership, already proposed in 2019, would include the Rostec group, which would supply the engines and the design linked to the stealth of the aircraft. The TAI group would be in charge of the avionics and weapons. The offer is certainly attractive for a highly symbolic program, but its realization would precipitate Turkey's divorce from NATO, and most likely its exclusion. Moscow is therefore seeking to make a double move here...
 
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TURKEY should not lay all its eggs in twin engine basket. Single engine fighter is a must have to guarentee better availability rate because IAF su30 availablity rate per unit is less then half of PAF f16.
 
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There is no source of the news?

Seem that many deliberate false and manipulative claims were used, as if they had come out of the Russian information and public relations office.

An event that did not happen is presenting as if it had happened.

I am not even mentioning the technical difficulties, political obstacles, and false time lapses, which are ignored in post. Everyone does not have to be a defense expert who knows all developments and events on a global scale.
 
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Russian weapons have not performed well in the hands Middle Eastern people when they have fought with the Israelis (and their "Western" weapons). Greece is getting some nasty new "Western" weapons.
If one has the option might be worth a shot trying Chinese weapons.
 
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No way Russia sell Su-35 to Turkey. Turkey can cause trouble in Tatarstan which is Muslim land occupied by Russia. S-400 sale is sufficient to trigger CAATSA against Turkey.
 
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There is no source of the news?

Seem that many deliberate false and manipulative claims were used, as if they had come out of the Russian information and public relations office.

An event that did not happen is presenting as if it had happened.

I am not even mentioning the technical difficulties, political obstacles, and false time lapses, which are ignored in post. Everyone does not have to be a defense expert who knows all developments and events on a global scale.
Source is Air & Cosmos international
 
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Moscow officially proposes to Ankara to acquire its Su-57 and Su-35 in export version, but also its help to complete the TF-X program

The Russian friend
On March 12, 2021, the Russian Federal Service for Technical Cooperation announced its desire to sell fighter aircraft to Turkey, and not the least of these are the two flagships of the Russian fighter industry, the Su-35 and the Su-57. In addition, the service has also submitted an offer of technical support to complete the development of the Turkish fighter TAI TF-X (Turkish Fighter - Experimental). Following its purchase of the Russian S-400 long-range anti-aircraft system, its eviction from the JSF (Joint Strike Fighter) F-35 program, and its involvement in the Libyan conflict, Turkey is now isolated under embargo. NATO even speaks of a "major problem of cooperation".



The Felon in ambush
A fifth-generation fighter-bomber, the fearsome Su-57 "Felon", of which 76 have been ordered, should equip three Russian combat regiments by 2028. It will also benefit from the support of winged drones such as the S-70, or the Molniya developed by Kronstadt, which it will carry in its hold. It would thus offer more than an alternative to the F-35, of which Turkey was expecting around 100. The Su-35 multirole would be offered in the immediate future, thus providing a gap-filler solution for the out-of-breath F-16C/Ds. These aircraft constitute a major threat to Athens. Recall that at the MAKS exhibition in Moscow in 2019, Recept Tayip Erdogan had been particularly seduced by the aerial demonstrations of Sukhoi fighters. But he also seeks to train a new generation of pilots, since many air force cadres had participated in the attempted putsch in 2016. An attempt on which Moscow had alerted Erdogan from its inception.



TF-X dormant
Presented with great fanfare at the 2019 Paris Air Show, the fifth-generation TF-X demonstrator, which is due to make its first flight in 2025, is now at a standstill. BAE Systems, the main partner since 2015 has stopped all cooperation under pressure from Washington. TAI, its manufacturer, has neither the engineering nor the DTIB to pursue this program independently. Hence the Russian proposal for a joint development of this aircraft that will replace the entire fleet of F-16s of the Türk Hava Kuvvetleri. This partnership, already proposed in 2019, would include the Rostec group, which would supply the engines and the design linked to the stealth of the aircraft. The TAI group would be in charge of the avionics and weapons. The offer is certainly attractive for a highly symbolic program, but its realization would precipitate Turkey's divorce from NATO, and most likely its exclusion. Moscow is therefore seeking to make a double move here...
OH SU57, SU57, DEFINITELY SU57, TURKEY SHOULD TOTALLY OPT FOR THE SU57! rafale pigeons wouldn't know what hit 'em...
 
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S400+su 57 combo is best for Turkey n Russia until tfx is fully develop
 
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Russia won't sell Su-57 until there is enough Su-57 in Russian air force, and that's not until 10 years from now considering only 1 serial Su-57 had ever been built. Su-35 is too expensive for Turkey to buy. Turkey may buy MiG-29M/M2 which are same size class as Rafale. Egypt and Algeria bought MiG-29M/M2.
 
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Turkey is not going to buy Russian jets, they have no reason nor incentive to do so. Buying the S-400 had a clearly purpose, buying a Russian jet has none.

The Turks are more interested in their own projects, as well as getting back into the F-35 program. I fully expect the Turks to take whatever tech they can from the s-400 and abandon it to get back into the F-35 program in the next coming years.
 
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Turkey is not going to buy Russian jets, they have no reason nor incentive to do so. Buying the S-400 had a clearly purpose, buying a Russian jet has none.

The Turks are more interested in their own projects, as well as getting back into the F-35 program. I fully expect the Turks to take whatever tech they can from the s-400 and abandon it to get back into the F-35 program in the next coming years.

They are gonna have to buy from someone somewhere fairly soon. Their F-16 are fairly old from the 90s. They ain't gonna last much longer. Under CAATSA they cannot buy new F-16 for replacement.
 
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They are gonna have to buy from someone somewhere fairly soon. Their F-16 are fairly old from the 90s. They ain't gonna last much longer. Under CAATSA they cannot buy new F-16 for replacement.
Stop replying to me, this is the last time I'm going to say this.
 
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