Greatest Persians in history

[Surenas]

Your retardation has no limits it seems.

He was the grandson of Uzun Hasan. His other side was Sheihk Junayd, who was also related to Uzun Hasan. His father Sheykh Haydar was born to Uzun Hasan's sister.

Safavids were Persian Kurds, not Turks. Don't falsificate history.

 

[Serpentine]

Era

In your logic, should we erase him from our history ? are you ready to do same to many of Turkic dynasties came and go in Iran ?

He lived here, he learned local languages(Turkish and Greek), he called Rumi(Anatolian) and greatly effected our history, pretty close your Turkic rulers huh

Those rulers were born an raised in Iran,developed and admired Iranian culture,don't you agree with me? A very brief look on Safavid era makes you understand.

But was Molana spreadinig Turkish culture?Learning a language does not mean one becomes part of that culture.

Some Ottoman kings knew Persian, but we don't consider them as part of our history.Is that clear enough?
I don't care what you or your countrymen may think of Molana at the end, what matters for me is what the whole world thinks of him and believe me,no one considers him a part of Turkish history.

 

[Surenas]

Vladmir Minorsky:

''From the evidence available at the present time, it is certain that the Safavid family was of indigineous Iranian stock, and not of Turkish ancestry as it is sometimes claimed. It is probable that the family originated in Persian Kurdistan, and later moved to Azerbaijan, where they adopted the Azari form of Turkish spoken there, and eventually settled in the small town of Ardabil sometimes during the eleventh century.''

 

[ASQ-1918]

What part of my post you didn't understood? He was grandson of Uzun Hasan.

Yes I know they claim that Safiaddin, who established the Safaviyya order was supposedly a Kurd, but this nothing else than myth. Safiaddin has been referred to as "Sain Turk" in his conversations with his teacher from Gilan.

I already answered the claim by Vladimir Minorsky above. It is a well known fact that Vladimir Minorsky was extremely pro-Kurdish, make a quick research about him, he even wrote made-up history of Kurds.

 

[Surenas]

Ismail was born to Martha and Shaykh Haydar on July 17, 1487 in Ardabil. His father, Haydar, was the sheikh of the Safaviyya Sufi order and a direct descendant of its Kurdish founder, Safi-ad-din Ardabili (1252–1334). Ismail was the last in line of hereditary Grand Masters of the Safaviyah Sufi order, prior to his ascent to a ruling dynasty. As a boy only a year old, he lost his father, the leader of a growing Qizilbash Shi'i community in Iranian Azerbaijan, who died in battle. His mother, Martha, was the daughter of Uzun Hasan by his Pontic Greek wife Theodora, better known as Despina Khatun.[13] Theodora was the daughter of Emperor John IV of Trebizond. (She had married Uzun Hassan in a deal to protect Trebizond from the Ottomans.[14]) Ismail grew up bilingual, speaking Persian and Azeri.[15][16]

Ismail I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[ASQ-1918]

Do you read other posts? I explained about Safiaddin, this is only claimed by Vladimir Minorsky. While Safavid manuscripts talk of Safiaddin as "Saint Turk". Morover, Shah Ismail was related to Uzun Hasan from both sides.

Another lie: "Ismail grew up bilingual, speaking Persian and Azeri".

He learned Persian during his stay in Gilan. His native language was Azerbaijani Turkish.

 

[Surenas]

Ismail did not identify himself as an "Azeri" or a "king of Azerbaijan". He identified himself as a "Safawi" and as a hereditary grandmaster of that movement. His first battles were meant to revenge his father. After defeating the Turkoman confederations, he realized the power vacuum and declared himself king of all of Iran. Read Minorsky or Savory. c) In a very short time, he established himself as the "King of Iran", and he was recognized as such by his Ottoman and Uzbek enemies.

 

[Targon]

So you still think there was some kind of Iranian nationality and those Turkic rulers were fighting and dying for it, for just a moment be a men and stand with your claims instead of ignoring, you remembered to answer when you had something you can say.

Rumi was not born in Anatolia, he was not learned Turkish in his early life and started to learn it in his later life when he settled in Anatolia, but his son, Sultan Veled had poems in Turkish even though his Turkish was not perfect.

 

[Surenas]

Sultan Waled:

Sultan Walad admits to his poor knowledge of Greek and Turkish.[6]
For example in his Ebteda-Nama, Sultan Walad admits twice in Persian after some of the lines in Greek/Turkish[7]:
بگذر از گفت ترکی و رومی
که از این اصطلاح محرومی
گوی از پارسی و تازی
که در این دو همی خوش تازی
Translation:
Let go of the languages of Greek (Rumi) and Turkish (Turki) Because you lack knowledge in these two, Thus speak in Persian and Arabic, Since in these two, you recite very well.
And also elsewhere in Ghazal in his Diwan, he writes:: If I knew Turkish, I would have brought one to a thousand. But when you listen to Persian, I tell the secrets much better.[8]

According to Mehmed Fuad Koprulu, the Turkish poems are: Written in a very crude and primitive manner and with a very defective and rudimentary versification replete with zihaf (pronouncing long vowels short) and imalā (pronouncing a short vowel long). Also according to Mehmed Fuad Koprulu: Sultan Walad’s motivation in writing Turkish poetry, just as it was with composing and reciting Persian poetry, was to raise the religious consciousness of the people of Anatolia, to guide them and instill in them a sense of the greatness of Mawlana and The fact he occasionally resorted to Turkish derives from his fear that a large majority who did not undesrand Persian, would be deprived of these teaching.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Ismail did not identify himself as an "Azeri" or a "king of Azerbaijan". He identified himself as a "Safawi" and as a hereditary grandmaster of that movement. His first battles were meant to revenge his father. After defeating the Turkoman confederations, he realized the power vacuum and declared himself king of all of Iran. Read Minorsky or Savory. c) In a very short time, he established himself as the "King of Iran", and he was recognized as such by his Ottoman and Uzbek enemies.

Are you seriously trying to teach me the history about Safavids and Shah Ismail? Your lack of knowledge on all historical matters comes out quickly btw, because you don't even make any research about it.

He couldn't had done that because "Azeri" name exists only since 1930s, before that we were referred to by various names (and identified) as Oghuz, Turkman, Tarakama, Turk, Tatar. He identified himself as Turkman in certain poems, if you wish, I can post that. And I don't think anyone claims that Shah Ismail based his state on ethnicity, but the great extent of usage of Azerbaijani Turkish within Safavid state would be obvious for anyone who read a bit about them. Shah Ismail's poetry is a good enough example of how much he valued his native language over Persian.

And your zero clue about Safavids comes forward. The tribes which supported Safavi sheikhs were all the same Turkomans, so Turkomans fought Turkomans.

 

[Targon]

So what ? I also said hes Turkish was not perfect, but he wrote in Turkish and he was complaining about not knowing Turkish very well.

For the god's sake you're screaming like "I'm a coward, I'm a stupid nationalist, I have no answer"

 

[Surenas]

Azerbaijan propaganda. ^

He was born in Iran, fought for Iran and named himself the King of Iran. So, its very simple; he is an Iranian, and I'm proud to say that.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

The only thing you can not find in history, is certainty. The question is "If history is that much important, why US leads the world?"

 

[ASQ-1918]

He was born in Iran, fought for Iran and named himself the King of Iran. So, its very simple; he is an Iranian, and I'm proud to say that.

He was born in Aq-Qoyunlu territority and was a relative of the Aq-Qoyunlu dynastic family, the first title he claimed was "Shah of Azerbaijan" in 1501 following the capture of Tabriz, he claimed "Shah of Iran" title later, he fought following the way of his father and grandfather with his Turkic Qizilbash supporters, not for Iran, which as an entity did not exist during those times.

 

[tyrant]

He was born in Aq-Qoyunlu territority and was a relative of the Aq-Qoyunlu dynastic family, the first title he claimed was "Shah of Azerbaijan" in 1501 following the capture of Tabriz, he claimed "Shah of Iran" title later, he fought following the way of his father and grandfather with his Turkic Qizilbash supporters, not for Iran, which as an entity did not exist during those times.

A question:
Why did he call himself an Iranian word "shah", instead of a Turkish word "Sultan" or a Mogul word "khan"?

Second question:
For the future generations, is Khamenei a Turkish guy or a Persian guy or an Iranian guy?

My point is "Ismail I" was someone like Khamenei, of Azeri descent but not devoted to Azeris but to Iran-Shiism.