Ghaggar-Hakra believed to be mythical Rig Veda Sarasvati river proven false

[Shabaz Sharif]

Which Indian civilization are you people referring to. Please name this civilization and when did it exist.

It can not be Indus valley civilization as it has been proven that the existing river Ghagar-Hakra is not and can not be the Rig Vedic River Sarasvati.

It has been proven scientifically that rivers Ghagar-Hakra or Sarsuti did not originate from the High glacial mountains and were rain-fed rivers.

Mahabharata clearly states that the Rig Vedic River Sarasvati did not fade out at Vinasana and flowed east towards a forest in the UP whereas, Ghagar-Hakra flowed south west and that too not to the sea as it was a seasonal rain-fed river.

Therefore, those who said that Indus valley was Sarasvati civilization, have been proved wrong. As there was no Sarasvati civilization, which was being popularly identified as Indian civilization, which Indian civilization are you talking about.

The fact is that there was no Indian civilization as there was no united India except as Robert Kaplan states i.e. during the times of Mauryas, Muslims and the British.

Only the Meluhha had a civilization which the British termed as Indus valley civilization and the Meluhhans themselves renamed their country as Pakistan in 1947.

Got it @INDIC.

Also remember how ignorant Indians say Hindi/Indian punjabi dont have arabic/persian words. These guys have been brainwashed from early age. Remind me of Pakistanis who believe they have arab ancestors and urdu is only influenced by Persia.

 

[t_for_talli]

And what? Sanskrit origen is Pakistan, panini was born near Rawalpindi. No one deny any of this. Indian civilization which extend to Afghanistan is product of recent Hindutvas rewriting history.



Chanakya who was responsible for Mauryan empire was born in Pakistan. They didn't conquer all of South India that mean Tamils are not part of Indian Civilization right?

Culture is not a materialistic thing that you can claim or own
Its a part of your life
So I dont see and similarity between IVC/Vedas/Sanskrit and present day Pakistanis.....but it is embedded in daily life of a Hindu Indian
Go through my signature for more clarity

 

[INDIC]

Which Indian civilization are you people referring to. Please name this civilization and when did it exist.

It can not be Indus valley civilization as it has been proven that the existing river Ghagar-Hakra is not and can not be the Rig Vedic River Sarasvati.

Many components from Indus valley civilization still exist in the modern Indian culture. Indian civilization meant the civilization of the historical India.

It has been proven scientifically that rivers Ghagar-Hakra or Sarsuti did not originate from the High glacial mountains and were rain-fed rivers.

Satellite imaging proved that some great river flowed across that bed somewhere in the past.

Mahabharata clearly states that the Rig Vedic River Sarasvati did not fade out at Vinasana and flowed east towards a forest in the UP whereas, Ghagar-Hakra flowed south west and that too not to the sea as it was a seasonal rain-fed river.

Look for the location of Naimisha forest, its near Gomati river in Central UP. Any river originating between Satluj and Yamuna can't flow through Naimisha forest. I believe they are referring to separate rivers with common names or mythical river flowing underground.

Therefore, those who said that Indus valley was Sarasvati civilization, have been proved wrong. As there was no Sarasvati civilization, which was being popularly identified as Indian civilization, which Indian civilization are you talking about.

The fact is that there was no Indian civilization as there was no united India except as Robert Kaplan states i.e. during the times of Mauryas, Muslims and the British.

Only the Meluhha had a civilization which the British termed as Indus valley civilization and the Meluhhans themselves renamed their country as Pakistan in 1947.

Got it @INDIC.

Even Greece was divided into number of states, does that mean there was no Greek Civilization.

 

[INDIC]

for this i will have to go back to my religion of NOAH and his sons with detail which u may not like and will contiounsly deny.

I am asking about the religion of Indus valley civilization, how do you know it was monoatheist.

india/hindu/hindi/hundustan/hind all these names are given to u ......
and there is no such indian civilization ..its proven today .......

But you forgot to mention the most ancient name Bharat which is still the official name of India. China, Egpyt, Greece names are also given by foreigners.

 

[INDIC]

I cant hate something which doesnt exist.

Ancient Pakistani civilization.

 

[Nassr]

Culture is not a materialistic thing that you can claim or own
Its a part of your life
So I dont see and similarity between IVC/Vedas/Sanskrit and present day Pakistanis.....but it is embedded in daily life of a Hindu Indian
Go through my signature for more clarity

I do not know how have you related the IVC with Vedas and Sanskrit. IVC predated the Vedas and the Sanskrit at least by more than a thousand years. Do you know that Vedas highlighted a rural culture whereas IVC was an urban civilization. Harappa and Mohenjodaro were large cities of their times with a population between 50,000 to 70,000. Name any city mentioned in Vedas which mention cities having such a large population. Though the language of IVC has not been deciphered so far, but it is clear that it was certainly not Sanskrit.

If Indian Hindus copy and follow some cultural aspects from another country it does not mean that the culture becomes Indian. Currently Indian youth follow many aspects of American culture, would it mean that after a period of time you can start claiming American culture as India. Please grow up and find out who you people actually were, instead of claiming something which never belonged to you in the first place.

Please seek your Indian identity from within the Republic of India.

 

[Nassr]

Many components from Indus valley civilization still exist in the modern Indian culture. Indian civilization meant the civilization of the historical India.




Satellite imaging proved that some great river flowed across that bed somewhere in the past.



Look for the location of Naimisha forest, its near Gomati river in Central UP. Any river originating between Satluj and Yamuna can't flow through Naimisha forest. I believe they are referring to separate rivers with common names or mythical river flowing underground.



Even Greece was divided into number of states, does that mean there was no Greek Civilization.

You do copy and follow some aspects related to Indus valley civilization which predated Vedic or Hindu culture as you now copy many aspects related to American culture. Tell me something new.

Historical India as you refer to was divided in numerous sovereign states and differing cultures and languages. The IVC predated all this when there was no historical India. And in any case, Historical India was situated east of Indus river, therefore the Indus valley civilization was never part of India in the first place.

The subsequent studies conduct with enhanced resolution satellite imageries discounted and negated the aspects which were highlighted in the 1970s study of claiming Ghagar-Hakra as Rig Vedic Sarasvati.

Mahabharata is very clear when it talks about the Tirthas located along the holy Rig Vedic River Sarasvati when it describes the journey of mighty Baladeva along the course of Sarasvati, who also visits the Vinasana. It also describes the eastward course of Sarasvati and there is no reference of an underground river. Please read Mahabharata before challenging its content and making such comments.

Greeks did consist of many states, however there was no India when the IVC existed and the people of IVC were known as Meluhha and not Indians. Many Indian scholars equate Meluhha with Malechha which means a foreigner. When the Meluhhans were foreigners for Vedics or Hindus, how could the current or old India claim a foreign civilization as their own.

Indians also call their country Bharat. According to Mahabharata as well as the numerous puranas and diverse Indian history, Bharat Empire included the whole territory of the subcontinent, including parts of present day Pakistan, Afghanistan, China, Iran, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Turkmenistan, North-west Tibet, Nepal and Bangladesh and there are some who state that Bharat means the whole world.

Which Bharat did you refer to when India was also named Bharat and which civilization do you refer to; the one followed by Pakistan, Afghanistan, China, Iran, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Turkmenistan, North-west Tibet, Nepal and Bangladesh or the whole earth.

Contrarily, the people of Meluhha, having their own civilization, only wanted to rename their own country and called it Pakistan.

Please find your own identity.

 

[INDIC]

You do copy and follow some aspects related to Indus valley civilization which predated Vedic or Hindu culture as you now copy many aspects related to American culture. Tell me something new.

Are you claiming that modern Indian population don't share ancestry with people of IVC.

Historical India as you refer to was divided in numerous sovereign states and differing cultures and languages. The IVC predated all this when there was no historical India. And in any case, Historical India was situated east of Indus river, therefore the Indus valley civilization was never part of India in the first place.

Indic people of Sindh, Punjab and those who once lived in Gandhara. I was using the term Indian civilization. Mlechha was the term used for tribes living in the north of Gandhara.

The subsequent studies conduct with enhanced resolution satellite imageries discounted and negated the aspects which were highlighted in the 1970s study of claiming Ghagar-Hakra as Rig Vedic Sarasvati.

Can you provide me those studies, were those new studies satellite remote sensing.

Mahabharata is very clear when it talks about the Tirthas located along the holy Rig Vedic River Sarasvati when it describes the journey of mighty Baladeva along the course of Sarasvati, who also visits the Vinasana. It also describes the eastward course of Sarasvati and there is no reference of an underground river. Please read Mahabharata before challenging its content and making such comments.

Saraswati of Triveni is also holy but Naimisha forest's location lies in North-central UP, it was impossible for any river originating between Satluj & Yamuna to directly flow there. It can be a mythical river which was kept alive in legends after Saraswati dried up. Do you know Brahmaputra in Bangladesh is also called Jamuna.

Greeks did consist of many states, however there was no India when the IVC existed and the people of IVC were known as Meluhha and not Indians. Many Indian scholars equate Meluhha with Malechha which means a foreigner. When the Meluhhans were foreigners for Vedics or Hindus, how could the current or old India claim a foreign civilization as their own.

Same was with Greeks but they had an identity of being Hellenic, we had the identity of Bharat. The Persian/Arabic name Yunan originated from the word Ionia which is now in Turkey.

Indians also call their country Bharat. According to Mahabharata as well as the numerous puranas and diverse Indian history, Bharat Empire included the whole territory of the subcontinent, including parts of present day Pakistan, Afghanistan, China, Iran, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Turkmenistan, North-west Tibet, Nepal and Bangladesh and there are some who state that Bharat means the whole world.

Which Bharat did you refer to when India was also named Bharat and which civilization do you refer to; the one followed by Pakistan, Afghanistan, China, Iran, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Turkmenistan, North-west Tibet, Nepal and Bangladesh or the whole earth.

For ancient Indians, Bharat was their world but the term was for people who were the part of Indian civilization. This one is the particular verse from Vishnu purana.

उत्तरं यत्समुद्रस्य हिमाद्रेश्चैव दक्षिणम् ।
वर्षं तद् भारतं नाम भारती यत्र संततिः ।।

uttaraṃ yatsamudrasya himādreścaiva dakṣiṇam
varṣaṃ tadbhārataṃ nāma bhāratī yatra santatiḥ

"The country (varṣam) that lies north of the ocean and south of the snowy mountains is called Bhārat; there dwell the descendants of Bharata."

Contrarily, the people of Meluhha, having their own civilization, only wanted to rename their own country and called it Pakistan.

Please find your own identity.

The people of Meluhha were Dravidians but every skin color obsessed Pakistanis don't want to correlate himself with Dravidians.

Why do Pakistani historians call the conquest of Sindh as the first Muslim Conquest of India. Why did Allama Iqbal had referred himself as Indian in his poems. Why the people of Hazara region are called Hindko.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

this is the IVC map, spread across modern day India and Pakistan.
*each star is a Indus valley site.
*coloured areas represent the total area where Indus valley civilisation located.

 

[INDIC]

I do not know how have you related the IVC with Vedas and Sanskrit. IVC predated the Vedas and the Sanskrit at least by more than a thousand years. Do you know that Vedas highlighted a rural culture whereas IVC was an urban civilization. Harappa and Mohenjodaro were large cities of their times with a population between 50,000 to 70,000. Name any city mentioned in Vedas which mention cities having such a large population. Though the language of IVC has not been deciphered so far, but it is clear that it was certainly not Sanskrit.

Indians are related to Meluhha by ancestry, land and the cultural inheritance to the modern Indian culture.

 

[Nassr]

@INDIC and @Agnostic_Indian

Intellectually, your worth is similar to street pushers and therefore you are not worth any further discussion.

 

[INDIC]

@INDIC and @Agnostic_Indian

Intellectually, your worth is similar to street pushers and therefore you are not worth any further discussion.

Can you tell me why you included East Bengal in your modern Meluhha named Pakistan.

Can you answer another question, why all Muslim historians says conquest of Sindh was the first Muslim victory in India, Balochistan was conquered before Sindh, but Sindh is still referred as the first Muslim conquest in Pakistan's history.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Thank God Arabia was not included. Bengal is nothing for people with extraordinary imagination.

Can you tell me why you included East Bengal in your modern Meluhha named Pakistan.

Can you answer another question, why all Muslim historians says conquest of Sindh was the first Muslim victory in India, Balochistan was conquered before Sindh, but Sindh is still referred as the first Muslim conquest in Pakistan's history.

 

[INDIC]

Thank God Arabia was not included. Bengal is nothing for people with extraordinary imagination.

Pakistan got created because of Bengali Muslims and Muslim elite of Uttar Pradesh. Punjab was under Unionist Party who only in the last sided for Pakistan, NWFP was Congress stronghold, Balochistan's largest princely state Kalat's own assembly passed a resolution not to join Pakistan.

 

[INDIC]

List of Indus Valley Civilization sites - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia