German Tornado jets deployed for Anti-ISIS-Mission not capable to do RECCE

[Vergennes]

How embarrassing is that.


@Taygibay @flamer84 @mike2000 is back @Abingdonboy @Bundeswehr

The aircrafts will be replaced by 1 Tornado in January.
-
„Operation Counter Daesh“: Erste Tornados für Syrien nicht tauglich : Augen geradeaus

 

[Taygibay]

We said it often enough here that the Bundeswehr was not battle-ready.
Just one more proof!

Sad out, Tay.

 

[yugocrosrb95]

Oh Germany... You can't have an army without paying a dime, don't be like Serbia.

 

[Jäger]

It's very pathetic but our defense minister wants to spend 6.6 billion dollars to fix our military. Hopefully they fix the problem soon

 

[mike2000 is back]

@Bundeswehr WTH is this?? Is this a joke? Germany is Europe's leading economic power FOR GODS SAKE.
Cant allow only France and Britain to share all the burden.

 

[Jäger]

@Bundeswehr WTH is this?? Is this a joke? Germany is Europe's leading economic power FOR GODS SAKE.
Cant allow only France and Britain to share all the burden.

In my previous comment it is very pathetic, hopefully our Government gets on its feet and does something

 

[mike2000 is back]

We said it often enough here that the Bundeswehr was not battle-ready.
Just one more proof!

Sad out, Tay.

LOL At the image.

Well, to be honest,Historical guilt is also to blame i believe.

 

[yugocrosrb95]

@Bundeswehr WTH is this?? Is this a joke? Germany is Europe's leading economic power FOR GODS SAKE.
Cant allow only France and Britain to share all the burden.

I heard that they will invest a lot of money to fix it and thankfully Russia is acting like a prick, looking at history, Germany has a beastly potential alone, in full gear just against Russians it would able to withstand, entire europe against Russia, bye bye Putin.

 

[Jäger]

I heard that they will invest a lot of money to fix it and thankfully Russia is acting like a prick, looking at history, Germany has a beastly potential alone, in full gear just against Russians it would able to withstand, entire europe against Russia, bye bye Putin.

Yes we are planning 6.6 billion dollar to fix our military

 

[Jacob Martin]

How embarrassing is that.


@Taygibay @flamer84 @mike2000 is back @Abingdonboy @Bundeswehr

The aircrafts will be replaced by 1 Tornado in January.
-
„Operation Counter Daesh“: Erste Tornados für Syrien nicht tauglich : Augen geradeaus

Sorry I do not read German so couldn't read the article. But how is this so? AFAIK the Luftwaffe Tornados have done recon missions in several conflicts, including Bosnia and Kosovo. The ECR version has built-in recon capability. Have they been withdrawn from service?

 

[Taygibay]

But how is this so?

They wrongly sent 2 non ASSTA 3 upgraded units that cannot do full spectrum w/RecceLite use,
serving an excuse that they never intended that full capacity before January anyway which
sort of make things OK since other coalition assets already provide what those would have?
I guess? *sigh*

On the political aspect, I wouldn't mind if Deutschland led economics and we led diplotactic actions.
Until a broader mindset surfaces, concentrating economy as De/UK, FP as Fr/De and war as UK/Fr
while the rest do support and the EU moves quicker for it would be fine by me! It's gotta be stated OfC.

Good evening guys, Tay.

 

[Khafee]

They wrongly sent 2 non ASSTA 3 upgraded units that cannot do full spectrum RecceLite use,
serving an excuse that they never intended that full capacity before January anyway which
sort of make things OK since other coalition assets already provide what those would have?
I guess?

On the political aspect, I wouldn't mind if Deutschland led economics and we led diplotactic actions.
Until a broader mindset surfaces, concentrating economy as De/UK, FP as Fr/De and war as UK/Fr
while the rest do support and the EU moves quicker for it would be fine by me! It's gotta be stated OfC.

Good evening guys, Tay.

Maybe the other aircrafts were nearing maintenance, and IF deployed, would not be able to stay in theater for long?

 

[Taygibay]

Sure Khafee man but then, either cannibalize from immobilized ones and make it work ...

The ASSTA 3 upgrade saw its first delivery in late 2012 early 2013 IIRC with all 85 surviving
Tornadoes in the Luftwaffe to get it and/or succeeding 3.1 standard and 2 can't be spared?​

Or simply provide another capacity instead?

In any case, not NRF rated huh?

GN bro, Tay.

 

[Penguin]

They wrongly sent 2 non ASSTA 3 upgraded units that cannot do full spectrum w/RecceLite use,
serving an excuse that they never intended that full capacity before January anyway which
sort of make things OK since other coalition assets already provide what those would have?
I guess? *sigh*

On the political aspect, I wouldn't mind if Deutschland led economics and we led diplotactic actions.
Until a broader mindset surfaces, concentrating economy as De/UK, FP as Fr/De and war as UK/Fr
while the rest do support and the EU moves quicker for it would be fine by me! It's gotta be stated OfC.

Good evening guys, Tay.

Panavia Tornado
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
...
Some Tornado variants carry different avionics and equipment, depending on their mission. The Tornado ECR is devoted to Suppression of Enemy Air Defences (SEAD) missions, operated by Germany and Italy. The Tornado ECR is equipped with an emitter-locator system (ELS) to spot radar use.[68] German ECRs have a Honeywell infrared imaging system for reconnaissance flights.[69]
...
Tornado ECR
Operated by Germany and Italy, the ECR is a Tornado variant devoted to Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD) missions. It was first delivered on 21 May 1990. The ECR has sensors to detect radar usage and is equipped with anti-radiation AGM-88 HARM missiles.[68] The Luftwaffe's 35 ECRs were delivered new, while Italy received 16 converted IDSs. Italian Tornado ECRs differ from the Luftwaffe aircraft as they lack built-in reconnaissance capability and use RecceLite reconnaissance pods, also only Luftwaffe ECRs are equipped with RB199 Mk.105 engine, which has a slightly higher thrust rating.[40] The German ECRs do not carry a cannon.[220] The RAF uses the IDS version in the SEAD role instead of the ECR. It also modified several of its Tornado F.3s to undertake the mission.[221]

Sounds to me that on German ECRs the RecceLite pods are in addition to onboard recce equipment that the Italian ECRs apparently lack. So, what is so crucial about the use of the RecceLite pods? What capability does that offer that the German ECR's onboard equipment can't provide?

Honeywell Scanner Receiver Unit

he scanner receiver unit (SRU) is an infrared line scanner developed for the German Airforce Electronic Combat and Reconnaissance (ECR) Tornado. Its unique, variably sampled sensor array provides horizon-to-horizon coverage without bow tie distortion, normally associated with line scanners at long slant ranges, thus obviating the need for supplementary sensors. A serial input enables an external processor to calculate and provide a number of 'mapping' parameters. These effectively steer the SRU, determining where and how many samples are to be taken within the scanned field of view. This programmable field of view feature enables a standoff capability for heavily defended areas such as airfields. Now in service with the German Airforce, SRU acceptance was not without teething problems, all of which have been rectified. While the effects were not directly associated with the SRU itself, the solutions were applied to the SRU to assure compatibility within different systems; the main improvement being the incorporation of a correction signal derived from the spin mirror and coupled into the sampling clock to eliminate image break up caused by variations in spin mirror rotation due to external influences. In the infrared imaging system developed for the ECR Tornado, the SRU is coupled to a recorder using dry silver film, which provides for on board development and viewing. Honeywell is now in the final phase of developing a highly integrated Reconnaissance Management Unit for the German Airforce Reconnaissance Program, to facilitate use of digital tape recorder technology. This development will extend the SRU's capabilities and ensure its use into the next century.

Deploying the Honeywell Scanner Receiver Unit | (1996) | Pye | Publications | Spie
SPIE | Proceeding | Deploying the Honeywell Scanner Receiver Unit

Product Name:RECCELITE
Title:Tactical Reconnaissance Pod

Reccelite Day/Night electro-optical reconnaissance pod is available for missions 24 hours a day to provide real-time imagery collection and data transfer via data link communications.

• Stabilized turret
• IR and visual channels in simultaneous collection
• Image collection in all directions:
  • Horizon to Horizon
  • Forward-Backward
  • Side Looking
  • Vertical
• Real-time data link communication to ground station
• Solid-state recorder on board
• Operating options for high, medium and low altitudes
• Shares the Litening targeting pod ILS infrastructure
• Long range data and video down-link (option)

http://www.rafael.co.il/Marketing/334-915-en/Marketing.aspx


AHA! There's the answer ;-)

The ECR is equipped with an emitter-locator system (ELS) which is designed to locate enemy radar sites. The ECR is equipped with the AGM-88 HARM. Initally the Luftwaffe ECRs were equipped with a Honeywell infra-red imaging system for reconnaissance, however operational experience lead to the removal of this system as it was considered impractical for one aircraft to be tasked with both Suppresion of Enemy Air Defences (SEAD) and reconnaissance.

On Target Aviation - Lechfeld 2008

Therefor, without the pod, ECR is in reality a dedicated SEAD platform.

One should not expect a fish to be able to climbs a tree, like a monkey.

 

[Khafee]

Sounds to me that on German ECRs the RecceLite pods are in addition to onboard recce equipment that the Italian ECRs apparently lack. So, what is so crucial about the use of the RecceLite pods? What capability does that offer that the German ECR's onboard equipment can't provide?


Deploying the Honeywell Scanner Receiver Unit | (1996) | Pye | Publications | Spie
SPIE | Proceeding | Deploying the Honeywell Scanner Receiver Unit


http://www.rafael.co.il/Marketing/334-915-en/Marketing.aspx


AHA! There's the answer ;-)


On Target Aviation - Lechfeld 2008

Therefor, without the pod, ECR is in reality a dedicated SEAD platform.

One should not expect a fish to be able to climbs a tree, like a monkey.[/QUOTE]

@Taygibay Monsieur, what do you make of this?