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Gaza-Israel Conflict | October 2023

But the situation was not like that. First of all,Greeks had a bigger space to live. They had mountains and forests to hide. They had a huge merchant fleet that was converted to a war fleet for the revolution. And back then there weren't drones and aircraft to bomb the heck out of everything.

Greece was full of muslims that would do whatever the empire wanted, So empire always had reach, mountains or not. But yes, mountains help.

Drones and modern tech work both ways. Israel is getting bombed from 1,000 km away. This is unprecedented. Pals has longer range rockets than Italy and Germany and Poland, turkey. Believe it or not, and it's because these countries are prohibited from having rockets above 350 km range.

How long before Palestinians can drop a 500kg bomb with pinpoint accuracy? 20 years? 30 years? How long before Yemen is able to build a nuke? there comes a time when the very weak will be able to impose a nation ending attack. And the strong will still have the comfort of being 50 times stronger but does it help you when you are destroyed just once. You cant kill the same Palestinian 50 times.

The problem is that Palestinians are confined in a flat space,isolated from the world and bombed from ground,air and sea. They have little money and equipment and most of the world only supports them in words. Also,while the strongest countries in the world back in the early 19th century wanted to weaken the Ottoman Empire,the strongest countries of the world want to actually strengthen Israel now. Except Russia and China who do nothing.

Yes, thats why I said it will take a global power to support them before they get their own country. Just like greece and everyone else needed. Currently there isn't one.
 
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They're bombing everywhere because that's what they always do. As for Hamas being everywhere,yeah they pretty much appear in various parts of the city,various buildings and from underground tunnels. But does that mean the IDF should bomb everything? No. And there's actually videos of them aborting a bombing because they spoted children or civilians there.
But still,they've bombed so much,that children and civilians have been killed by the thousands.
The problem is the language you and others use compared to Hamas and Israel shows the dishonesty, you call Hamas B@stards and Terrorists but you don't use the same language for Israel and its Atrocities , that in itself shows the bias, and Hamas is Terrorist only because few old White people gather in a building and decided to call them Terrorists, they do that out of their own convenience. Hamas Actions of Attacking civilians was wrong under Islam, they should've been careful to avoid Civilians deaths, they claim to be Muslims so they should be extra careful which they were or weren't only time will tell when we know the full truth, for now we do know Civilians die from Israel side that in itself is enough for me to condemn their crime.
I've never seen any footage of IAF calling off bombing because there are Children, their own politicians are on record boosting and cheering for bombing Children, how can you not see the videos, dude no one can claim ignorance in this age of information, their PM (Human filth Natanyahu) invoke the Amalakyte on Palestinians, just go read your own bible and its Reference to the people and that will tell you what Hamas and Palestinians are dealing with, Israeli govt is religiously motivated hate filled Genocidal maniacs. There is no other way to describe them, As for Israeli civilians yes there are many hate filled scums but many of them are good, many of them don't know or see the pictures or videos of Gaza, just like when Allied forces open Ashwitz camp for common German citizens to watch what Nazi's were doing they were all horrified, I bet if any Israeli who is not hate filled religiously motivated bigot see those dead kids or women will condemn the IAF and their Govt response despite the fact that they lost their own citizen, the response from Israel is just pure psychotic.

I don't know about 40 beheaded babies,but there were some babies killed in Hamas' attack. And some clearly executed. Now,if all those amount to 40 babies,I don't know. But there were babies killed. It's in the footage released by the army.

As for air vents,some might be air vents,but some holes were WAY TOO BIG to be air vents. Don't think that because Jews are like that,Hamas is not a bad and selfish terrorist organization that will hesitate using civilians as human shields.
Again, claims like 40 beheaded babies were pushed to gain sympathy and do propaganda, if you believe everything IAF or Israel Govt say than Bless your heart and our conversation will not go anywhere, similar to that if a Hamas leader comes and say no civilian died in their Attack I will throw that claim in trash as well, we saw civilians died, and kids also died along with women, and yes people from all over the place are condemning it.
Dude this BS claim of Human shield should not be used, everyone use Human shield and build their military bases and than people surround those bases, I live in Tampa and there is a huge Air force base McDill, surrounded by Civilians, in case of World war Russia may argue its a legitimate target but civilians will die, should we then support that? NO... Israel knows that Gaza is densely populated and if they already know Hamas is under ground than what's the point of bombing the residential homes ? knowing damn well that it will kill civilians, why not send Special forces with air support ? They are bombing for 30+ days, no Military does that not even Russians did that with Ukraine.

I don't know about this,haven't read anything,I've missed dozens of pages of the thread.
Its already posted from Israel's official accounts.

But Hamas did attack Israel. Their retaliation is extreme and looks more of an attempt to kick out most of the Palestinians from Gaza.
Of course Hamas attacked Israel, what you expect them to do? as I said, Oct 7th didn't happen in isolation there were attacks, small incidents that leads up to that day, I am here in US for 3 years and every year in Ramadan I see Israel attacking Al-Aqsa, so many illegal settlements, multiple times Gaza is been bombed, Journalists shot dead, medical workers shot dead, kids killed and arrested, every nation has their limits USA lost their limit on 9/11 and they bombed so many civilian targets, so why its so hard for people to comprehend that people of Gaza has their own limits for only how long they can bear the violence, brutal treatment and imprisonment, and hence we saw the Oct 7th, I wish that didn't happen but I also wished that Israel treated Palestinians like humans, give them their due right to have the state of their own country, did not walled the whole Gaza, control their basic utilities or shot and killed their kids and young, or put them in jail, but did Israel did any of that ? no... when your own dies you have right to go crazy but others are dying they should just stay peaceful why ?

Took little kids and 85 year-old women as hostages. Took foreign workers as hostages too.
Compared the condition of two Israeli old women who are released conditions with those who are in Israeli prison, and you will have your Answer. If Hamas killed Hostages I will called them out and call them barbaric, but Israeli hostage herself has some nice things to say about Hamas treatment of them.

there is a saying in Urdu, " Shah se Zayda Shah ke Wafadar " roughly meaning More Loyal to Shah than Shah himself ... Don't be more loyal to Israel than Israel or Israeli's themselves.
 
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Well I think the situation is not as black and white as people think it is. Again, Islamically Attack civilians is prohibited under any circumstance, so yes Hamas even if they kill 20 or 50 civilians would be considered wrong, whether they fall into the trap of Israel or not time will tell.

A lot of people here are who supports Israel have no issue putting themselves into Israel's shoes to think, lots of Americans I talked to ask me what if Indians killed 1400 of your Pakistani civilians, what would you want Pakistan to do? my answer is always the same and have 2 parts..

1) I would want retaliation but a proportionate response, and will not support Pakistan Army or its response if its dropping bombs on Civilians just because Indian Military presence is there.

2) Anyone who thinks any attack happen in isolation is either navie or dumb, there is always a chain of events that leads to a big event, even 9/11 didn't happen out of nowhere but if you study there was many incidents (small) that all leads to that big attack, hence this 7th Oct attack was not a surprised or isolated incident, Israel has been bombing Gaza and building illegal settlements in WB for years, and no one including UN did anything about it, Hamas is seeing Gaza is attacked again and again and again, and they have to respond because if they don't that Gaza will not rally behind them, for Gaza and by extend Hamas there is no good option, they can surrender and still be killed or they fight back in that they will still be killed but with huge civilian price, Hamas and people of Gaza were put in that position by Israel and world to make such drastic measures to shook the world to its core, and guess what? They did just that... see how the world is now openly talking about Palestinian State.

My issue with people like you, Sammule and other who supports the Israel's bombing of Gaza and justifying it is that how can a human being with a heart and soul, can see the images of fathers and mothers bringing their toddlers in plastic bags in pieces, which can be avoided for sure and not condemn that Genocide, America fought to the tooth in Falujha going from house to house despite knowing that every house is booby trapped and yet they fought hard, they could've just leveled the entire city, America could bombed Abbotabad as well claiming a AQ commander their enemy number 1 is living there, and they send Special forces, there are many ways Israel could've responded to the Oct 7 attack but it all comes back to the same point, when will Israel address the incidents and events that all leads to Oct 7 Attack ? So far I saw nothing from Israel or America or UK, If a nobody like me can understand this simple fact than how can govt who got brilliant minds at their disposal with unlimited resources can understand that we need to fight a solution for this conflict and stop Israel from breaking International laws, stop them from illegal taking over land, indiscriminate bombings of Gaza, bombing of UN shelters or killing journalists or arresting young kids, the day when the world had enough of Israel and start treating them the same way they treat others, there will be no Oct 7's.

This is the peaceful West Bank which is supposed to be the ideal Palestinian government. Israel has settlements all over the place, in another words West Bank is unofficially annexed by Israel. We all know they want to annex Gaza, finish PIJ and Hamas and take it over. The rest is just propaganda.

israeli_settlements_map.gif
 
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Pakistan hosts the largest IDP's in modern history, TTP dug up their positions in Tribal areas but they rarely have stopped civilians from leaving cause they were confident that Pakistan Army or Air force wont be able to defeat them, you know why we were successful in pushing and almost eliminating them from Pakistan, while Americans were failing in Afghanistan, because Pakistan was Fighting on its own soil and fighting for its own survival, we did not invade anyone despite the fact that TTP got its resources from ANA and by extend RAW/America who were sitting comfortably in Afghanistan and keeping a blind eye on TTP.
@RescueRanger can you explain him about how difficult it was for PA to host and organized the largest internally displaced people and then relocating them?
@PanzerKiel you can pitch in as well.
Sir, no point trying to explain, what you will find is that they already have the answer, the chose to remain ignorant. We used to have an American here called Solomon who would often feign such ignorance, its like shouting in the wind. :-)
 
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How long before Palestinians can drop a 500kg bomb with pinpoint accuracy? 20 years? 30 years? How long before Yemen is able to build a nuke? there comes a time when the very weak will be able to impose a nation ending attack. And the strong will still have the comfort of being 50 times stronger but does it help you when you are destroyed just once. You cant kill the same Palestinian 50 times.
Look how Palestinians started in 1948. How they ended up after the war. How their borders were diminished after 1967 and how their land kept getting smaller and smaller since the '80s. Now,not only are they divided,weaker and have way less land and allies,but they are at the verge of losing Gaza.

So...what 20 or 30 years? There might not be a Palestinian Authority in 20 years.
 
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By no means it's a majority
It's very very small minority
JVP: Jewish Voice for Peace alone have 1000+ nominated members, plus 2500 activists this number doesn't include local chapters and partner networks. So lets not discount them as if it were a NOTHING, that would be disingenuous.
 
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Basically haan. :lol:. Trust me.
War crime hai yaar yeh tu, yeh Goray kia jaane humari Struggle English bolne aur likhne ki, chalo khair hai post ko Jaan o Maal ke sadqa mai daal dete hai, Dollars mai Sadqa nikalte hue buhat dil dukhta hai.
 
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Sir, no point trying to explain, what you will find is that they already have the answer, the chose to remain ignorant. We used to have an American here called Solomon who would often feign such ignorance, its like shouting in the wind. :-)

Because they all know the muslims are weak. Noone takes the side of the weak, you need Iman for that. If we were strong they would be screaming genocide genocide.

Maybe its the time for Muslims to look inwards. Looking at the Muslim world i don't have much hope.
 
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Look how Palestinians started in 1948. How they ended up after the war. How their borders were diminished after 1967 and how their land kept getting smaller and smaller since the '80s. Now,not only are they divided,weaker and have way less land and allies,but they are at the verge of losing Gaza.

So...what 20 or 30 years? There might not be a Palestinian Authority in 20 years.
They lost Gaza and all territory long ago. It cant get worse for them. being driven out will be a blessing for them. 3 million in the UK, 2 million in Germany, and 2 million in France is a much better deal. Knowing this the western powers will not allow Israel to just kick the out. Under this scenario it wont be long before ether are more Palestinians in the Eu than greeks, Czechs, Bulgarians, Austrians. swedes, Belgians. So west cant allow this.

West is in big trouble because of what is has done in the middle east. They should have given the jews an island in the Indian Ocean off the coast of Africa or some pacific island. The brits just didnt predict that ether would be 7 million Palestinians in 2023. They thought muslims are like native Americans or some aboriginal tribe. Big mistake. Also big mistake in thinking all muslims would accept the borders drawn in London in 1918. Yes they bought eh gulf Arabs and saudis, but they can buy everyone so the conflict continues

Judging by the damage they can cause Pals are not weaker now than 40 years ago.
 
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