Gaza-Israel Conflict | October 2023

[Yawm al-qiyāma]

The source is directly from the highest levels of Hamas officials, the highest levels of Iran, Israel, USA, France ... who all deny Iran had any role in this and confirm it was a surprise Hamas attack which they did not inform anyone about.

What a BS prove it.

If you consider extremist salafist jihadists from around the world that Turkey led into Syria to topple the Government "muslims" then that's a reflection on you

Whats difference between poor shoeless Palestinian Arabs and poor shoeless Syrian Arabs, they’re both sunnies and they’re both oppressed and massacred. You label them trrsst just like the juice in order to justify their killings.

Clear sectarianism and lies. 2006 Lebanon War did not happen?

@waz @LeGenD

You have no other example than 2006 Lebanon battle? lmao

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714998901671960670

Meanwhile your proud 'sunni' nations are busy worshipping the Israelis in their embassies and trading with the killers of their fellow Sunnis in Gaza, do not compare yourself, even the Sunni Palestinians stuck in Gaza are sick of you:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714990203423588549

I am Turkish what we have done in past is similar what we’re going to do in the future. History repeats itself.

 

[ZeGerman]

They did not have a large Jewish population there pre 1947, in 1918 it was 8.1% it increased to 30% by 1946 due to immigrations and by 1948 they had pushed out nearly 1.1m people from the land. Today its 73% due to further immigration and not letting any of the indigenous population return.

I'm using a jewish source for sake of argument

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.or...h-population-of-israel-palestine-1517-present

israeli population plus those legally migrating meant 30+% living there.
Thus right to a two state solution according to pakistani posters defending pakistan being formed.

That is in 1946. Let alone now generations born and died in israel.
So can we move on from the “drive the jews in the sea/back to europe” nonsence?

 

[dBSPL]

And during the crusades they demolished Constantinople 200 years before the Turks took it in 1453

They weekend the Orthodox Church and empire Turks made easy pickings

Until the beginning of the nationalist movements, the Turks had an intricate-deep relationship with the eastern Christians. Armenians were the Turks' most important allies for more than 400 years. In return, they were able to re-enter Anatolia en masse after the Byzantine deportation of the Armenians, probably the first deportation in history, and their population grew to 150,000 in Istanbul when Turks city (thx to ottoman era), where they were forbidden to enter. Just before the 1071 Malazgirt victory, the alliance between Turks and Armenians began to develop. On ottoman era, the Serbs remained allies of the Ottoman army for centuries and indeed were the main actors in many of its great victories. On the other hand, the same is true with the Rums and most other Greeks who make up modern Greece. For example, the conquest of Cyprus was partly achieved with the help of the Orthodox. In return, the orthadox church was elevated to prominence and co-opted into the governing system. It is not only a matter of local government. Blood ties had also developed between dynastic lineages over the centuries. For example, Orhan I of the Ottoman dynasty married the daughter of the Byzantine emperor and even Fatih mehmed claimed to be Kaiser after the conquest of Constantinople because of this blood relation. lol... Anyway, all this is irrelevant to the thread. In short, I would like to say that before the nationalist movements, the Orthodox and Muslims have shared the same fate many times in history and sometimes they have even cooperated against threats from west.

 

[HGV]

No,I know about the 1982 counterattack and the change of the warfront,Iran took the initiative. I know all that,but most of the chemical weapons sold to Iraq,were sold mostly out of opportunistic reasons,not because they all wanted to support Saddam or to destroy Iran.

Those chemical weapons actually came from Europe (mostly from Germany, the US and the UK):

"The leftwing Berlin daily, die tageszeitung, said it had obtained a copy of part of the document handed by Baghdad to the UN earlier this month which supplied details of its weapons programmes. The extract included a list of foreign companies, of which more than half - 80 - were German.

The report also blew apart an unwritten agreement between the UN, governments and industry that companies which contributed, wittingly or unwittingly, to Iraq's arms build-up should not be named. The UN weapons inspection mission in New York spent several days purging the Iraqi declaration of company names.

Die tageszeitung cited 27 companies, including some of the best-known names in German industry such as Daimler-Benz (which merged with Chrysler of the US four years ago), MAN and Siemens."

Germany was 'key supplier' of Saddam supplier

Iraq has identified Germany as the country whose companies did most to help Baghdad in its drive to acquire weapons of mass destruction, said a German newspaper yesterday.

www.theguardian.com

USA? Yes,USA was pissed off at Iran. They didn't want them to win. But like Kissinger said,they thought more in the way of "too bad there can't be two losers in this war". Basically,it's like what they want with Ukraine right now. To destroy both Russia and Ukraine.

USA assisted Saddam's chemical attacks against Iran with a direct purpose to prevent Iran from gaining the upper hand in the war:

"In 1988, during the waning days of Iraq’s war with Iran, the United States learned through satellite imagery that Iran was about to gain a major strategic advantage by exploiting a hole in Iraqi defenses. U.S. intelligence officials conveyed the location of the Iranian troops to Iraq, fully aware that Hussein’s military would attack with chemical weapons, including sarin, a lethal nerve agent.

The intelligence included imagery and maps about Iranian troop movements, as well as the locations of Iranian logistics facilities and details about Iranian air defenses. The Iraqis used mustard gas and sarin prior to four major offensives in early 1988 that relied on U.S. satellite imagery, maps, and other intelligence. These attacks helped to tilt the war in Iraq’s favor and bring Iran to the negotiating table, and they ensured that the Reagan administration’s long-standing policy of securing an Iraqi victory would succeed.

U.S. officials have long denied acquiescing to Iraqi chemical attacks, insisting that Hussein’s government never announced he was going to use the weapons. But retired Air Force Col. Rick Francona, who was a military attaché in Baghdad during the 1988 strikes, paints a different picture.

“The Iraqis never told us that they intended to use nerve gas. They didn’t have to. We already knew,” he told Foreign Policy.

According to recently declassified CIA documents and interviews with former intelligence officials like Francona, the U.S. had firm evidence of Iraqi chemical attacks beginning in 1983. At the time, Iran was publicly alleging that illegal chemical attacks were carried out on its forces, and was building a case to present to the United Nations. But it lacked the evidence implicating Iraq, much of which was contained in top secret reports and memoranda sent to the most senior intelligence officials in the U.S. government. The CIA declined to comment for this story.

... the United States applied a cold calculus three decades ago to Hussein’s widespread use of chemical weapons against his enemies and his own people. The Reagan administration decided that it was better to let the attacks continue if they might turn the tide of the war. And even if they were discovered, the CIA wagered that international outrage and condemnation would be muted.

In the documents, the CIA said that Iran might not discover persuasive evidence of the weapons’ use — even though the agency possessed it.

The declassified CIA documents show that Casey and other top officials were repeatedly informed about Iraq’s chemical attacks and its plans for launching more. “If the Iraqis produce or acquire large new supplies of mustard agent, they almost certainly would use it against Iranian troops and towns near the border,” the CIA said in a top secret document.

But it was the express policy of Reagan to ensure an Iraqi victory in the war, whatever the cost."

Exclusive: CIA Files Prove America Helped Saddam as He Gassed Iran

The U.S. knew Hussein was launching some of the worst chemical attacks in history -- and still gave him a hand.

foreignpolicy.com

 

[Corax]

What’s your source, to me it seems more like Hamus got tricked by iranians and now they layback and watch the show.

What do you expect from iran who killed more Muslims in Syria then Israel have killed palestinians.

Shia in their history have never had a war against non-muslims its always against muslims.

I've said this before, muslims have killed more muslims in their entire history than the christians and jews combined. Look at most of the Middle East for the past 30 years, and today in Yemen, Sudan, Syria, Turkey, Afghanistan, Pakistan. When this is all over and forgotten, muslims will go back to killing each other, normal service will resume. Look at this thread even, half the time muslims are at each other's throats even on a place like this. You can curse the zionists and west all you want, but unless you change amongst yourselves, you're doomed. The west and zionists have their differences, but since WWII they have learnt that no matter what those differences are, it's no reason for war amongst themselves, and see how quickly they unite at a time of crisis. Compare that with the muslim world at a time of crisis.

 

[mulj]

Because the jews sought a place of refuge after the holocaust, and went to where they had religious and ancestral ties. As well as a large Middle east jewish population living there?
many also bought lands.

There was also no palestinian nation pre 1947. It was british mandate.
Arabs living in british controlled middle east got PLENTY land.

And now we have a situation where generations of israelis grew up and rooted there. Demanding their forced expulsion is just asking for ethnic cleansing.


and lastly, you really want to justify ethnic cleansing based on borders from generations back? How about we apply the same on Constantinople and the many areas christianity and christians were expelled from by force or under duress?
Shall i start to bring “hamas style freedom fighting” to any random muslim i see on the street?

Can you muslims not think of a solution that does not mean genocide or ethnic cleansing of the “non-believer” for a change??

Can you christian atheist secular agnostic or whatever westerners are, offer solution which is not based on theft, robery and mass crimes against native populations?

 

[Mirzali Khan]

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[PradoTLC]

Good move by Bassem.
the guy is usually an asshole but it's nice to see him doing some good moves.

I like bassem.. he fcuks Sisi real good

 

[aziqbal]

I've said this before, muslims have killed more muslims in their entire history than the christians and jews combined. Look at most of the Middle East for the past 30 years, and today in Yemen, Sudan, Syria, Turkey, Afghanistan, Pakistan. When this is all over and forgotten, muslims will go back to killing each other, normal service will resume. Look at this thread even, half the time muslims are at each other's throats even on a place like this. You can curse the zionists and west all you want, but unless you change amongst yourselves, you're doomed. The west and zionists have their differences, but since WWII they have learnt that no matter what those differences are, it's no reason for war amongst themselves, and see how quickly they unite at a time of crisis. Compare that with the muslim world at a time of crisis.

No that is a lie just like the 40 beheaded babies

Europeans have been killing each other long before Muslims

And in WW1 and WW2 you killed 100 million of each other

And In Ukraine you are about to killing 100 million

Enslaved 40 million blacks of which 4 million died

And because are inherently dirty people who don’t wash and clean themselves you took disgusting disease to the Native Americans and 65 million died

And when no killing each other you are killing People in Africa and Middle East

Another words your Satan

 

[HGV]

What a BS proof it.

I don't wish to engage with a sectarian scumbag like yourself, but here is my final word to provide proof that Hamas led this operation and did not inform its allies in advance:

You are insulting Palestinians by suggesting they were 'tricked' by Iran. Now, enjoy your sectarian life while your proud Sunni regime serves as a base for American nuclear weapons and proudly engages in large amounts of economic trade with the Zionists while doing nothing while Sunnis in Palestine are massacred.

 

[Foinikas]

Those chemical weapons actually came from Europe (mostly from Germany, the US and the UK):

"The leftwing Berlin daily, die tageszeitung, said it had obtained a copy of part of the document handed by Baghdad to the UN earlier this month which supplied details of its weapons programmes. The extract included a list of foreign companies, of which more than half - 80 - were German.

The report also blew apart an unwritten agreement between the UN, governments and industry that companies which contributed, wittingly or unwittingly, to Iraq's arms build-up should not be named. The UN weapons inspection mission in New York spent several days purging the Iraqi declaration of company names.

Die tageszeitung cited 27 companies, including some of the best-known names in German industry such as Daimler-Benz (which merged with Chrysler of the US four years ago), MAN and Siemens."

Germany was 'key supplier' of Saddam supplier

Iraq has identified Germany as the country whose companies did most to help Baghdad in its drive to acquire weapons of mass destruction, said a German newspaper yesterday.

www.theguardian.com

USA assisted Saddam's chemical attacks against Iran with a direct purpose to prevent Iran from gaining the upper hand in the war:

"In 1988, during the waning days of Iraq’s war with Iran, the United States learned through satellite imagery that Iran was about to gain a major strategic advantage by exploiting a hole in Iraqi defenses. U.S. intelligence officials conveyed the location of the Iranian troops to Iraq, fully aware that Hussein’s military would attack with chemical weapons, including sarin, a lethal nerve agent.

The intelligence included imagery and maps about Iranian troop movements, as well as the locations of Iranian logistics facilities and details about Iranian air defenses. The Iraqis used mustard gas and sarin prior to four major offensives in early 1988 that relied on U.S. satellite imagery, maps, and other intelligence. These attacks helped to tilt the war in Iraq’s favor and bring Iran to the negotiating table, and they ensured that the Reagan administration’s long-standing policy of securing an Iraqi victory would succeed.

U.S. officials have long denied acquiescing to Iraqi chemical attacks, insisting that Hussein’s government never announced he was going to use the weapons. But retired Air Force Col. Rick Francona, who was a military attaché in Baghdad during the 1988 strikes, paints a different picture.

“The Iraqis never told us that they intended to use nerve gas. They didn’t have to. We already knew,” he told Foreign Policy.

According to recently declassified CIA documents and interviews with former intelligence officials like Francona, the U.S. had firm evidence of Iraqi chemical attacks beginning in 1983. At the time, Iran was publicly alleging that illegal chemical attacks were carried out on its forces, and was building a case to present to the United Nations. But it lacked the evidence implicating Iraq, much of which was contained in top secret reports and memoranda sent to the most senior intelligence officials in the U.S. government. The CIA declined to comment for this story.

... the United States applied a cold calculus three decades ago to Hussein’s widespread use of chemical weapons against his enemies and his own people. The Reagan administration decided that it was better to let the attacks continue if they might turn the tide of the war. And even if they were discovered, the CIA wagered that international outrage and condemnation would be muted.

In the documents, the CIA said that Iran might not discover persuasive evidence of the weapons’ use — even though the agency possessed it.

The declassified CIA documents show that Casey and other top officials were repeatedly informed about Iraq’s chemical attacks and its plans for launching more. “If the Iraqis produce or acquire large new supplies of mustard agent, they almost certainly would use it against Iranian troops and towns near the border,” the CIA said in a top secret document.

But it was the express policy of Reagan to ensure an Iraqi victory in the war, whatever the cost."

Exclusive: CIA Files Prove America Helped Saddam as He Gassed Iran

The U.S. knew Hussein was launching some of the worst chemical attacks in history -- and still gave him a hand.

foreignpolicy.com

I found them!

 

[RayKalm]

I've said this before, muslims have killed more muslims in their entire history than the christians and jews combined. Look at most of the Middle East for the past 30 years, and today in Yemen, Sudan, Syria, Turkey, Afghanistan, Pakistan. When this is all over and forgotten, muslims will go back to killing each other, normal service will resume. Look at this thread even, half the time muslims are at each other's throats even on a place like this. You can curse the zionists and west all you want, but unless you change amongst yourselves, you're doomed. The west and zionists have their differences, but since WWII they have learnt that no matter what those differences are, it's no reason for war amongst themselves, and see how quickly they unite at a time of crisis. Compare that with the muslim world at a time of crisis.

That's what makes Islam even more remarkable - and a strong understanding of why God chose to release Islam in the Middle East and its surroundings.

If we can be this racist and have this much hatred for one another (see Somalians, Afghans, Kurds, Turks, Persians, Lebanese-Arabs, Gulf Arabs, Moroccans, Algerians, Azerbaijanis, Egyptians, etc.), then imagine what would we have been had there been no Islamic expansion? I reckon the situation and hatred between us would be much, much, much worse. And we would have been much weaker than we already are in this modern era. Islam is much more of a blessing than you'd imagine.

 

[Foinikas]

And because are inherently dirty people who don’t wash and clean themselves you took disgusting disease to the Native Americans and 65 million died

I find this comment racist and idiotic. I can't understand how you were once a PDF "think tank".

 

[Corax]

No that is a lie just like the 40 beheaded babies

Europeans have been killing each other long before Muslims

And in WW1 and WW2 you killed 100 million of each other

Enslaved 40 million blacks of which 4 million died

And because are inherently dirty people who don’t wash and clean themselves you took disgusting disease to the Native Americans and 65 million died

And when no killing each other you are killing People in Africa and Middle East

Another words your Satan

You clearly didn't read my post. I said SINCE WWII, the west has not had a major war AMONGST ITSELF. They are far more united today than the muslim world. For sure, they have done their fair share of pillaging and raping themselves and the rest of the world, just like muslims and every other human culture you can think of.

 

[mulj]

I've said this before, muslims have killed more muslims in their entire history than the christians and jews combined. Look at most of the Middle East for the past 30 years, and today in Yemen, Sudan, Syria, Turkey, Afghanistan, Pakistan. When this is all over and forgotten, muslims will go back to killing each other, normal service will resume. Look at this thread even, half the time muslims are at each other's throats even on a place like this. You can curse the zionists and west all you want, but unless you change amongst yourselves, you're doomed. The west and zionists have their differences, but since WWII they have learnt that no matter what those differences are, it's no reason for war amongst themselves, and see how quickly they unite at a time of crisis. Compare that with the muslim world at a time of crisis.

This is unpopular truth, almost all western countries jumped to assist in crime while we could not gather for at least harsh diplomatic response, sad reality and enemy is aware of this weakness, we never recovered from chalifate abolishing, some supranational institution for muslims is necessity but not like OIC, that one is useless.