Frustrated doctors explaining their frustration

[litman]

good. pak is no place for educated people . it is for corrupt mediocre people who know how to to badmashi through whatever their profession they are in.
stop or reduce pay of the military personnel, police, railway, wapda, teachers, etc and lets see how many of them perform their duties on just "sahib or sahiba" titles.
in pak who gets respect? meter reader, patwari, thanedar, politician, senior fauji, chuadhry etc. pak is no place for talented honest people. every talented person who has done hardwork and wants to further progress in their profession must leave the country. and majority of them leave the country.

leave the country lol. does she know how tough it is to get a job in other countries. these people are dellusional

i have met many pakistani doctors who have cleared their exams for US and england and they all are far more professional and well settled then their counter parts in pakistan

 

[Death Professor]

i have met many pakistani doctors who have cleared their exams for US and england and they all are far more professional and well settled then their counter parts in pakistan

You do realize the cream has no problem settling anywhere, they don't cry, they just do. These are just the leftovers, the lowest of all the bunch. Just looking at this clip one can assume how "educated" they are.

 

[litman]

in developed countries the system is well established. there are rules for everything. there are limited number of working hours and limited work load. they have got all the facilities. there are laws for everything. laws for the patients and laws for the doctors. ethics committee exists in hospitals to look after these things. as doctors are among the most talented and hardworking people in almost all the countries they are paid accordingly while in pakistan no such thing exists. no medicines, no equipment, huge patient workload, corruption in the administration, financial issues, even doctors have to pay rishwat to clerks to get their pays, no respect , uneducated patients some even bring weapons in hospitals etc. such a system only brings negativity out of the doctors and they either leave the country or they have opt to become wolves to live in this jungle . the theory of the survival of the fittest comes into play . the government health care system is rotten just like any other organization in this country. it is at the rock bottom with no hopes for improvement.

You do realize the cream has no problem settling anywhere, they don't cry, they just do. These are just the leftovers, the lowest of all the bunch. Just looking at this clip one can assume how "educated" they are.

seems to be far more educated than those sitting in our parliament. this is the dilemma in pakistan. educated people are on the streets doing protests for their rights and the idiots are the top. remember what some pti jahil from kpk said last week that these doctors and engineers used to sell pakoras in bazaar. this is the level of respect for the educated lot of the country.
the cream doesnt waste single day in pakistan. they immediately go abroad the day they complete their house job. the leftovers (still far more educated and talented then rest of the pakistani population) try their luck in pakistan due to many reasons like family issues , financial issues but when they get chitrol in this system they also try to look for jobs abroad.

 

[alee92nawaz]

He's an anchor or a paid for patwari? And let's see how many of these docs can go out? Not many lol. They aren't wanted outside. Even in gulf

 

[litman]

http://www.pakalumni.com/profiles/b...-largest-source-of-foreign-doctors-in-america
https://www.geo.tv/latest/48715-pakistan-becomes-largest-exporter-of-young-doctors-to-uk
that's good. 3rd largest in US. largest exporter of young doctors to UK. it means problem doesnt lie with our medical education but with the system

 

[Sabretooth]

What happened to the Hippocratic Oath?
I say let them leave Pakistan so they can find out how much they are worth abroad. Recently GCC kicked out doctors for un-recognized M.Phil qualification. They are mere TMOs. Who do they think they are? They should be thankful that they still get jobs. Wearing overall and stethoscope doesn't make one superior.

 

[Max]

stop or reduce pay of the military personnel, police, railway, wapda, teachers, etc and lets see how many of them perform their duties on just "sahib or sahiba" titles.

No one reduced or stopped their pay, they are protesting against new ordinance bcoz it will stop their badmashi and they will have to work hard.

As for Forces, Their salaries are also very low, but they can't protest, if any man in uniform protest its mutiny. Give these doctors a military uniform and if they protest, arrest them and charge them with mutiny and high treason like security forces.

 

[litman]

No one reduced or stopped their pay, they are protesting against new ordinance bcoz it will stop their badmashi and they will have to work hard.

As for Forces, Their salaries are also very low, but they can't protest, if any man in uniform protest its mutiny. Give these doctors a military uniform and if they protest, arrest them and charge them with mutiny and high treason like security forces.

then why the pay of military personnel was doubled about 10 years ago. yes give the doctors military uniform and arrest them if they dont do their duties but then pay them according to their qualification. that means at least 1.5 lac starting pay .professionals dont come for free. if you need good professionals then the government needs to give them benefits..
as far as work hard is concerned can you tell me a single profession where a highly qualified individual works 36 hours straight. gets 12 hours off and then again the cycle begins. doctors in pakistan already work more then any other professionals. they are trained to work hard right from their early school days. who becomes a doctor in pakistan? a kid who gets into top three positions since class 1 to 12 . then entry tests of medical colleges. the 5 years of severe hardwork and tough house job of 1 year. that means 6 brutal years and after doing all that what this system offers them? nothing. as i said before this is a rotten system and if any skilled person belonging to any field has the resources and chances to go abroad for a better future he should.

https://www.careerexplorer.com/careers/doctor/salary/
see the difference between pakistan and developed countries.



The average salary for a doctor in the United States is around $105,968 per year.

Avg Salary
This is 288% above the national average. ● Updated in 2018.


$68,922BOTTOM 20%
$105,968MEDIAN
$352,975TOP 20%

68922 / 12= 5743.5 x 156= 895,986 pak rs per month. this is what US is paying to its doctors. then the work load, working environment, laws for both doctors and patients are also there.
no good professional works for free.

 

[Max]

then why the pay of military personnel was doubled about 10 years ago. yes give the doctors military uniform and arrest them if they dont do their duties but then pay them according to their qualification. that means at least 1.5 lac starting pay .professionals dont come for free. if you need good professionals then the government needs to give them benefits..
as far as work hard is concerned can you tell me a single profession where a highly qualified individual works 36 hours straight. gets 12 hours off and then again the cycle begins. doctors in pakistan already work more then any other professionals. they are trained to work hard right from their early school days. who becomes a doctor in pakistan? a kid who gets into top three positions since class 1 to 12 . then entry tests of medical colleges. the 5 years of severe hardwork and tough house job of 1 year. that means 6 brutal years and after doing all that what this system offers them? nothing. as i said before this is a rotten system and if any skilled person belonging to any field has the resources and chances to go abroad for a better future he should.

So military personal become millionaire and billionaire after that increase. as far as i know this was the case for rest of the country as well, i remember Zardari once raise 50% salaries... but doctors are still poor.

a Sepoy gets BPS-5, Havaldar/ASI gets BPS-9 even the clerk or receptionist in health department with qualification of intermediate get BPS-12 salary.

As for their qualifications, no one doubt that they are bright people, but they should not leave their duties to protest an ordinance, should not close OPDs and emergencies to put pressure on Govt. this is not the civilized way.

On duty protest should be banned, if they want to protest, they should do after their duty.

 

[litman]

What happened to the Hippocratic Oath?
I say let them leave Pakistan so they can find out how much they are worth abroad. Recently GCC kicked out doctors for un-recognized M.Phil qualification. They are mere TMOs. Who do they think they are? They should be thankful that they still get jobs. Wearing overall and stethoscope doesn't make one superior.

just getting admission in any decent medical college in pakistan and then graduating from them means that the individual is among the top 1 % in this country as far as talent is concerned. i am not talking about private medical colleges here.

So military personal become millionaire and billionaire after that increase. as far as i know this was the case for rest of the country as well, i remember Zardari once raise 50% salaries... but doctors are still poor.

a Sepoy gets BPS-5, Havaldar/ASI gets BPS-9 even the clerk or receptionist in health department with qualification of intermediate get BPS-12 salary.

As for their qualifications, no one doubt that they are bright people, but they should not leave their duties to protest an ordinance, should not close OPDs and emergencies to put pressure on Govt. this is not the civilized way.

On duty protest should be banned, if they want to protest, they should do after their duty.

no body works for free. its simple. its the job of the government to take care of its masses. only those will work on low pay who dont have other options and their quality of work will also be very low. the corruption has devoured every institute in this country. we will see more dissatisfaction and protests . the people at the helm of the affairs in this country have always been corrupt, disloyal and incompetent and pti is no exception.

 

[Majid Awan]

these doctor want to earn 3lakh per month on first year of training like in europe but other professions here are working on 12000 per month during internship and some people have to work without any pay during their first year of internship ,we cannot give such salary to them as our economy is much weaker than west.I think we should increase number of seats for medical students from somalia,sudan and other african countries as well as war affected regions so that we can fill vacancies of such leaving doctors and also it will increase money flow in Pakistan

3 lake?. Bhai here house officer (intrrni) get 45k pkr. FMGs after spending huge amount and passing all required exams don't even get that 45k and do you even know working hours? After all this attendants always complain,fight and even abuse when they don't get facilities,because they see a doctor's face not administration's. So they put all their grudges on doctors. Get your facts straight before commenting on something you don't know. Respect.

 

[Yaseen1]

i not said they are receiving this amount but I meant that this amount is given in u.k and these doctors are threatening to go to u.k or other western countries which means that they want same money here in Pakistan

3 lake?. Bhai here house officer (intrrni) get 45k pkr. FMGs after spending huge amount and passing all required exams don't even get that 45k and do you even know working hours? After all this attendants always complain,fight and even abuse when they don't get facilities,because they see a doctor's face not administration's. So they put all their grudges on doctors. Get your facts straight before commenting on something you don't know. Respect.

 

[Majid Awan]

What happened to the Hippocratic Oath?
I say let them leave Pakistan so they can find out how much they are worth abroad. Recently GCC kicked out doctors for un-recognized M.Phil qualification. They are mere TMOs. Who do they think they are? They should be thankful that they still get jobs. Wearing overall and stethoscope doesn't make one superior.

Do you even know what is MTI? Read about it then be a keyboard worrier sir. People gonna get more crazy on Doctors after this ordinance. Baki rahi bat foreign ki to wo koi mushkil kam nai he just an exam like pmdc and NLE gonna make these doctors far more capable then just passing any license exam abroad phir dekhna moun utha kar.

i not said they are receiving this amount but I meant that this amount is given in u.k and these doctors are threatening to go to u.k or other western countries which means that they want same money here in Pakistan

Sir it's not about pay, it's about practicing medicine in an environment where all medical facilities are available at the spot. All medical ward related machinery,even ECG machines are not available sometimes or doesn't work properly. It's my personal experience. I personally know many FMGs doing rotations without single penny in return.

 

[Baz]

good. pak is no place for educated people . it is for corrupt mediocre people who know how to to badmashi through whatever their profession they are in.
stop or reduce pay of the military personnel, police, railway, wapda, teachers, etc and lets see how many of them perform their duties on just "sahib or sahiba" titles.
in pak who gets respect? meter reader, patwari, thanedar, politician, senior fauji, chuadhry etc. pak is no place for talented honest people. every talented person who has done hardwork and wants to further progress in their profession must leave the country. and majority of them leave the country.


i have met many pakistani doctors who have cleared their exams for US and england and they all are far more professional and well settled then their counter parts in pakistan

What a lame argument. You think there are no lazy arses in western countries? You think people don't abuse their power any where else in the world? The difference is such incidents are tightly controlled and not shown on TV like a live circus. Just because the corrupt people have ruined the institutions does not mean that we lack highly talented honest people in the country. So just STFU

 

[Yaseen1]

Do you even know what is MTI? Read about it then be a keyboard worrier sir. People gonna get more crazy on Doctors after this ordinance. Baki rahi bat foreign ki to wo koi mushkil kam nai he just an exam like pmdc and NLE gonna make these doctors far more capable then just passing any license exam abroad phir dekhna moun utha kar.


Sir it's not about pay, it's about practicing medicine in an environment where all medical facilities are available at the spot. All medical ward related machinery,even ECG machines are not available sometimes or doesn't work properly. It's my personal experience. I personally know many FMGs doing rotations without single penny in return.

I agree there is shortage of equipment and medicine,our govt officers and bureaucracy are major hurdle in our low spending on health and education.I wish time come when we also pay 3lakh to trainee doctors but for this our economy should become strong and unnecessary expenses done on bureaucracy and govt secretaries who even use govt facilities after retirement should be ended.Doctors are no doubt our asset and we should respect them but they should also ensure quality and minimum standards are met for treatment of patients.If anyone want to become very rich he should do business as medical doctor is not a field to become billionaire, it is no doubt good earning profession but not for becoming super rich.

in developed countries the system is well established. there are rules for everything. there are limited number of working hours and limited work load. they have got all the facilities. there are laws for everything. laws for the patients and laws for the doctors. ethics committee exists in hospitals to look after these things. as doctors are among the most talented and hardworking people in almost all the countries they are paid accordingly while in pakistan no such thing exists. no medicines, no equipment, huge patient workload, corruption in the administration, financial issues, even doctors have to pay rishwat to clerks to get their pays, no respect , uneducated patients some even bring weapons in hospitals etc. such a system only brings negativity out of the doctors and they either leave the country or they have opt to become wolves to live in this jungle . the theory of the survival of the fittest comes into play . the government health care system is rotten just like any other organization in this country. it is at the rock bottom with no hopes for improvement.


seems to be far more educated than those sitting in our parliament. this is the dilemma in pakistan. educated people are on the streets doing protests for their rights and the idiots are the top. remember what some pti jahil from kpk said last week that these doctors and engineers used to sell pakoras in bazaar. this is the level of respect for the educated lot of the country.
the cream doesnt waste single day in pakistan. they immediately go abroad the day they complete their house job. the leftovers (still far more educated and talented then rest of the pakistani population) try their luck in pakistan due to many reasons like family issues , financial issues but when they get chitrol in this system they also try to look for jobs abroad.

In u.k almost half of pay of doctor is cut for taxation to govt but here in Pakistan private hospital doctors not pay such taxes and earning huge money.You will never find much doctors becoming billionaire even in u.k, the are paid well and remain in upper middle class.If anyone want to become much rich he should go for business