France’s fakement on Pakistani JF-17 Thunders

[DANGER-ZONE]

let go guys....age of m2k is over.
This the era of jf-17 in third world countries INSHALLAH.

 

[ramu]

Pak media or the GOP did not say a word about this cancellation........whay is that?

This is in essence selective censorship or self imposed blockage of news that show Pakistan foreign affairs in bad light.

 

[DMLA]

let go guys....age of m2k is over.
This the era of jf-17 in third world countries INSHALLAH.

"m2k" was never used by the third world at large. I guess Egypt is the only nation among m2k users who are looking at the jf-17 and it is "NOT" to replace m2k.

I am sure jf-17 will find many takers in the third world. And I would also assert that "french avionics/ weapons" are not what they would want considering the $10-15 million price escalation which would have resulted from such inclusion on the baseline jf-17 price. I think the deal was for PAF jf-17's primarily.

I am also quite certain that "possible competition" would not have been the reason for the deal being put off as there are no birds being made by france which might fall in the category of jf-17.

 

[graphican]

No they are done. But the author may have been referring to future sales by Dassault like the Rafale.

Or the replacement of their own Mirage with newer versions and letting old mirage go to 3rd world countries. There has been a preservative that French might have stopped this deal anticipating that countries who are currently operating Mirage would leave them out to 3rd world countries and would upgrade to Rafael.

 

[Ghareeb_Da_Baal]

This is in essence selective censorship or self imposed blockage of news that show Pakistan foreign affairs in bad light.

we dont have censorship like that ! I am sure there is a good reason & soon enough we will figure it out! maybe we finally got so sick of their skirts that we are like whatever!
In any case, time for more R&D .........

 

[Dark Angel]

Pakistani JF-17 Thunders are already flying without the French parts. The new parts would have enhanced the capability of the aircraft. The PAF has learned its lessons from various US embargoes and now uses a plethora of equipment from various countries for the enhancements. Islamabad does not depend on any one country. The JF-17 Thunder is built from scratch on exact Pakistani needs and most of the equipment, frame and electronics are indigenous. France like the US has never been a reliable supplier for Pakistan. In the 70s the French canceled a Nuclear processing plant that had been signed between the two countries. is there an Israeli connection to this “hold”? Some blame France’s latest chicanery on the Jewish origins of President Sarkozy who has taken all of France to the right of center–abandoning traditional French neutrality on many issues. France has vehemently opposed Turkey’s admission to the EU tying it to Israel’s admittance.

Three is a disjunction between private and public French posturing. Islamabad is used to French double-dealing, duplicity, and equivocation. This latest sleight-of-hand scurvy trick is typical of France’s subterfuge and deceitful fakement. The recent French turpitude on putting a $1.6 billion deal for Pakistan “on hold” is being seen as silly surreptitious trickery by Sarkozy and gang to secure the lucrative Bharati (aka Indian) deal first and put then pressure on Pakistan to force Islamabad to buy the Augustas rather than the German 214 Submarines.

France sells arms to anyone and everyone. This new found streak of logic-chopping insta-conscience may have been nurtured to please Delhi–secure the $2.2 billion deal with with Bharat to upgrade its aging and archaic fleet of Mirage 2000 fighters–and then approve the Pakistani parts.

In a carefully crafted tergiversation France said that it had put the Pakistan deal “It’s a deal that’s not ready from the Pakistani side,” the source said, without giving further details. “For now, the state of the dossier doesn’t allow us to carry on with it.”

A consortium made up of French company ATE, arms group Thales (TCFP.PA) and missile manufacturer MBDA was supposed to produce the equipment, Le Monde said. Thales declined to comment. Reuters

Not ready from the Pakistani side? What does that mean. There is no check attached with the dossier? What does “state of the dossier” mean? Are the kicbacks not working?–or is it a tactic to place pressure on Pakistan to deal with those that killed the French Engineers working on the Augustas in Karachi.

Analysts beleive that pettifoggery may be linked to slowing down Pakistan’s indigenous plane capability which will directly impact the sale of French Mirages to the third world. Paris may be looking to better safeguards on its technology and a better price from Pakistan.

The French ruse may also be a tickler for Delhi’s MCRC $10 billion deal. With Delhi’s relations with Washington at their lowest ebb, and souring, the French team may be working to get their foot in the door on the $10 sale of aircraft to Bharat.

New Delhi: The France government held up its 1.6 billion dollars sale of arms to Pakistan, reportedly under pressure from India.

The military hardware was to be used for Pakistan’s JF-17 combat aircraft. The sale of electronics and missiles, under the first part of a six billion euro deal, was signed with Islamabad.

Paris is said to be concerned over whether Pakistan would be able to pay-off the huge deal amount or not. And, also worried over the safety of the sophisticated technology.

However, experts are not willing to accept India would be able to exert pressue on France to hold the deal for long.

“I don’t really know how much pressure India can really exert on France because in the past we have seen that America has tremendous influence on their policies,” said Hamid Gul, former DG of ISI.

“Americans have supplied us already. They have committed to supply us 18 F-16 aircraft. Any aircraft that France can put out it can be outmatched by what the Americans can do.”

“We have very good relations in this field with China and we have developed JF-17 Thunder. We don’t see any immediate possibility of war. Therefore we have time in which we can develop technology,” he added. IBN and agencies.

In 2008 Pakistan Navy under chief of naval staff Admiral Muhammad Afzal Tahir made efforts for including German 214 Class submarines in its fleet and owing to Navy’s persistent efforts, the government had approved plans for acquisition of these submarines to be built at Karachi Shipyard under transfer of technology programme.

The details were later worked out between the two countries when a Pakistan Navy delegation visited Germany in April.

However recently quoting Pakistani government sources, the Financial Times Deutschland says President Asif Zardari may overrule his military’s preference for the German subs to take up a “better offer” from France.



France?s fakement on Pakistani JF-17 Thunders - CombatAircraft.com News

excellent article as far as delusions are concerned

 

[ANG]

Hi, this is the best thing that could happen. India knows to much about French avionics and radars. Moreover, you honestly do no think China with its mongol hordes of engineers cannot develop this on their own? The JF-17 was not meant to fly and now look were it is. Yes, this might mean a delay, but it is better in the long run. Thanks!

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Fakement is not a word .. now let me read the article

 

[Luftwaffe]

DMLA...even though they've no bird in the category of JF-17, french product generally speaking mirage 2000 of india are the only ones to survive for the next say 12 years with expensive extensive upgrades, world will replace them between 2010-2015...rafale a disaster marketing product with remote possibilities of ending up with brazil although some gulf nation might give a chance to compete but as euro-fighter took a lead and impressed gulf nations, i am hoping gulf nations to pick up euro-fighters as their next generation fighters...truely BAE and sukhoi have marketed their product in the best possible way.

 

[DMLA]

DMLA...even though they've no bird in the category of JF-17, french product generally speaking mirage 2000 of india are the only ones to survive for the next say 12 years with expensive extensive upgrades would replace them between 2010-2015...rafale a disaster marketing product with remote possibilities of ending up with brazil although some gulf nation might give a chance to compete but as euro-fighter took a lead and impressed gulf nations, i am hoping gulf nations to pick up euro-fighters as their next generation fighters...truely BAE and sukhoi have marketed their product in the best possible way.

I agree! This is nothing new as the defence industry will keep consolidating. The traditional markets for the french have been slowly taken away by the british and the americans. This is the reason why France is one of the vocal advocates of removal of ban on exports of "sensitive" technology to china. What has happened over the years is a gradual shift of most non-aligned or former soviet bloc countries moving towards US. The high French prices don't help a bit. I do not see rafale winning the MMRCA for the very reason (High Cost). Having said all of that, France still is and will remain a major player in the world defence markets for years to come.

Anyhow, as the discussion here is about the JF-17, I personally feel that the french deal was in no way "path-breaking". They were providing you with technology that is more or less dated. Considering the fact that jf-17 is a new fighter here for the next 3-4 decades, I feel the best option for PAF will be to get together with the Chinese and develope a new avionics package if needed. I personally feel modern radars and long range standoff weapons are the need of the hour for thunder.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

I agree! This is nothing new as the defence industry will keep consolidating. The traditional markets for the french have been slowly taken away by the british and the americans. This is the reason why France is one of the vocal advocates of removal of ban on exports of "sensitive" technology to china. What has happened over the years is a gradual shift of most non-aligned or former soviet bloc countries moving towards US. The high French prices don't help a bit. I do not see rafale winning the MMRCA for the very reason (High Cost). Having said all of that, France still is and will remain a major player in the world defence markets for years to come.

Anyhow, as the discussion here is about the JF-17, I personally feel that the french deal was in no way "path-breaking". They were providing you with technology that is more or less dated. Considering the fact that jf-17 is a new fighter here for the next 3-4 decades, I feel the best option for PAF will be to get together with the Chinese and develope a new avionics package if needed. I personally feel modern radars and long range standoff weapons are the need of the hour for thunder.

yup this is what is going to happen,agreed
and current fleet of jf-17 is capable of delivering standoff weapons plus Chinese gliding bomb.but the French deal contains a whole package of weapons+good fire control radar that is also used in anti ship role.
now first option would be Chinese improved avionics and radar.
or it would be selecting different avionics from diff countries,which is quite costy.

 

[intelarpit]

Hi
we are talking of Pakistan here not the American or British governments in general, secondly no is talking about removing him. Actually the supreme court it self was handi capped when he took charge and at that time there were several cases against him, its not even about that it's his meddling with defense, and its a matter of defense first then foreign affairs, it is the ministry of defense that approves which submarine to go with then ministry of foreign affairs comes in

My analysis was in General and not related to any particular country. For smooth functioning of the country all the organs must work in a free environment.

Of-course if President did something wrong than he should be removed but not through court . Simply Defence and FA are not subject matter of Court.

Regards

 

[Rank]

I dont know but when Muslim learn this

"Yahood aur Ansara tumharay kabhe doost nahe hosakhtay"

but times will come.. when muslim will learn this!!!

 

[harrymohan]

what if France again offers the same deal, do u guys accept it? wats ur personal choice?

 

[Mani2020]

what if France again offers the same deal, do u guys accept it? wats ur personal choice?

well in aviation deals are not made on personal choices rather they are made on the availability of resources and the readiness of supplier to supply the equipment..

back to your question as far as i have heard the deal is on hold not cancelled and if French offered it again thn i thnk PAF will go for it ,as it will improve the capability of jf-17 alot, untill and unless chinese come up with somethng better or atleast equivalent