First World War - Finding Pakistan's place in history.

[INDIC]

That doesn't mean anything in contemporary understanding of the word. That is like saying China, well which one, Qing, Ming, Han, Xin ? - Wei, Shei, Wu kingdoms?

India back then was classified as a region not a country because there was no nation state structure present at that time.

Chinese term was Zhongguo for China, similar was India/Bharat/Hindustan east of the Indus. India was always country, because in old days countries were a landmass without considering the kingdoms ruling them, what we have today is called nation states from past 200 years with an idea of fixed territory with a single government and nationalism.

your perception is usually not based on reality.
Sorry to say.

Now, tell why Pakistanis claim the Tipu Sultan, the ruler of Mysore as Pakistan's history and why a language from Ganga Valley is the national language of Indus valley.

 

[VCheng]

To be precise, those "regiments" in reality formed the country.
you cannot separate the two.

No Sir, it was a political process that formed the country, and divvied up the military between the two resulting States, including these regiments, to be precise.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Jinnah was a Gujarati from Gondal in Gujarat and it he don't become a Sindhi in single generation and you also know lot many Muslims from United Provinces and Bengal were associated with Pakistan movement. So, Pakistan as a state was created on Muslim identity, not on some regional identity of North-West. Iqbal wrote poems in praise of India/Hind.

When I say someone was born in Mumbai with forefathers from Kabul.

Is he an Afghanistani for you.


or a citizen of modern day India?

 

[Kompromat]

Okay, if "it doesn't matter" what the region was called at the point in history being discussed (WW1) then why call it by a name that did not even exist then?

OH bhai toon na discuss kar!

 

[FaujHistorian]

No Sir, it was a political process that formed the country, and divvied up the military between the two resulting States, including these regiments, to be precise.

See this is why I say, please live in pothohar for a while, study the people and study the history.

If you rely in 5th grade history books of government schools, you will remain unaware.

 

[Kompromat]

just for the sake of avoidance of any doubt and clarity: Which era you are talking about when 'we' didn't keep up with latest trends. I reckon, you refer to Mughals, from Muslim Ummah Point of view. I am talking from pure nationalist point of view.

The rot in Muslim governance structure had started to take shape when we took the transition from Khilafa to Malookiat.

 

[INDIC]

When I say someone was born in Mumbai with forefathers from Kabul.

Is he an Afghanistani for you.


or a citizen of modern day India?

Forefathers usually means many generation and their descendents adopting local culture and language, Jinnah was first generation settler in Karachi who could only speak Gujarati and English and that don't make him a Sindhi.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

The rot in Muslim governance structure had started to take shape when we took the transition from Khilafa to Malookiat.

You mean the Young Turks?

 

[FaujHistorian]

......


Now, tell why Pakistanis claim the Tipu Sultan, the ruler of Mysore as Pakistan's history and why a language from Ganga Valley is the national language of Indus valley.

He was a mysoor sultan.

He off course is appreciated as someone who resisted British East India Company. But I have serious questions about your study of him being a Pakistani.


The language of northern Indian states is not limited to Ganga valley.

There were three major cities where Urdu literature started and progressed.

Delhi, Lahore, and Luknow.


Urdu will be Ganga valley only if Lahore too was located next to Lucknow



Please study some yaaara.

please study.

 

[scorpionx]

These politicians were using the bravery and patriotism of martial tribes for their own purposes e.g. extract political mileage.

Sir, in 1914 I feel, both Mr.Jinnah and Gandhi were somewhat truthful to their inner conscience and ideological principles. The matter of "extracting political mileage" comes perhaps much later, during the second world war. Although Gandhi was mastering it right from the khilafat movement.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Forefathers usually means many generation and their descendents adopting local culture and language, Jinnah was first generation settler in Karachi who could only speak Gujarati and English and that don't make him a Sindhi.

you are now fully involved in serious spin-doctoring

Bhai

Serious spin-doctoring.

 

[VCheng]

OH bhai toon na discuss kar!

Sure. I will wait for the next issue of Hilal discussing Pakistan's role in the conquering of India by the Mughals.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Actually..

Pakistan was carved out of British India, what remained became India.

Going by this logic, can what is now Pakistan & BD be called Predecessor States of India and therefore claimed ?

Both the modern states of Pakistan and India were carved out of British India.


Please update your knowledge.

Thank you.

 

[Kompromat]

You mean the Young Turks?

No. YT were a racial nationalist movement.

Malookiat is when the Muslim rulers gave up ruling by the Islamic principles and adopted Kingships, started to transfer power to their lineage rather than the most able leader. Both Umayyad and Ottoman caliphates started off as Khilafa states but later caved into the urges of power and ended up creating kingdoms, ultimately leading to the downfall of an entire civilization. The flexibility was inbuilt into the Islamic code of governance to only hand over the rule to most able leaders through consensus. When that law or practice was abandoned those caliphates became 'Malookiat'.

 

[INDIC]

He was a mysoor sultan.

He off course is appreciated as someone who resisted British East India Company. But I have serious questions about your study of him being a Pakistani.


The language of northern Indian states is not limited to Ganga valley.

There were three major cities where Urdu literature started and progressed.

Delhi, Lahore, and Luknow.


Urdu will be Ganga valley only if Lahore too was located next to Lucknow



Please study some yaaara.

please study.

you didn't give me the proper answer, why making Tipu Sultan as the part of Pakistani history. Unlike Delhi and Lucknow, Lahore became the centre of Urdu literature very late in 19th century during British rule, the medieval literature in Punjab were in Punjabi by Baba Farid Shah, Waris Shah and Baba Bulleh Shah.