Finally, Mountain Guns for India

[sancho]

At least things have started moving, government of India is back from a 3 years vacation, be positive.

Well one can be happy with a faster process in the DAC, even if most of what they cleared in the last 7 months was already cleared before the elections and just passed over for final decision after the election. The problem is, when people let themself confuse by DAC clearances and the huge ammounts of crores the media and the NDA hypes in these clearances, since that doesn't mean anything wrt to actual decision making to procure an arm!

Apache and Chinook helicopter deal - selected by IAF, received DAC cleareance of the former government, pushed for final selection after the election, once again DAC cleared by the new government => Status, no final procurement made!

M777 howitzer deal - selected by IA, received DAC cleareance of the former government, pushed for final selection after the election, once again DAC cleared by the new government => Status, no final procurement made!

Avro replacement deal - received DAC cleareance of the former government, once again DAC cleared by the new government => Status, stalled because single vendor situation, since none of the MoDs could get enough interest of the Indian industry into the deal and now we don't even have enough foreign vendors to offer us aircrafts!

Mounted gun deal - received DAC cleareance of the former government several times, now once again DAC cleared by the new government => Status, tender is at the begining again!

P75I deal - received DAC cleareance of the former government, scrapped and re-issued by the new government with new DAC clearance => Status, procurement delayed!

LUH deal - put on hold by IA to investigate relations to VIP helicopter deal, received DAC cleareance of the former government, scrapped by the new government, although there is no relation to the VIP helicopter deal and re-issued with ne DAC clearance again => Status, procurement delayed!

And the list goes on and on. There is no denying that there is an obvious ease in the bureaucracy of MoD, but apart of the hype and PR, it didn't resulted in much selection of new arms and techs to improve our forces. And even the few that were selected (Barak 1 missiles, Arjun MK2), were passed from the former government:

Dec 23, 2013. Defence Ministry approves deal to procure 262 missiles for the Barak air defence systems. Major relief for Navy. Deal worth Rs 880 crore.

Defence Ministry approves deal to procure 262 missiles for the Barak air defence systems

Aug 29/14: Go-aheads. The new BJP government’s Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) makes a number of key moves in its 1st major DAC session...
...DAC’s clearances included an “acceptance of necessity” for the Arjun Mk-II, effectively clearing the INR 66 billion purchase (about $1.1 billion) limited production program of 118 Mk-II tanks for the army, which amounts to about $9.3 million per tank. The previous UPA government had also cleared the buy, but 2 years of testing were long enough to force expiry of this clearance. This renewal allows the army to order the tanks from the Avadi factory when trials are complete...

India Reverses Gear, Puts Arjun Tank Back in Production


Conclusion, "something" is moving, but didn't resulted in the major changes to improve the forces, in some areas it went even the opposite way, lets hope 2015 gets better!

 

[Echo_419]

Chill guys, since MoD started with the habbit to fool the world with DAC clearances, everybody is jumping the gun for no reasons.

1) The article is BS and not even news, as it refers to a DAC clearance from november and not a new one:

Manohar Parrikar greenlights purchase of 814 artillery guns worth Rs 15,750 crore | The Indian Express


2) It has nothing to do with mountain, but is for mounted guns

3) The DAC clearance only means, that the tender was cleared (and I lost count how often that happend now) not that any procurement will happen soon

4) The mountain howitzers deal is still limited to the M777 and pending without any decision so far

I knew there was something fishy about this article

 

[Koovie]

Finally?!

Tell me that word when we actually induct them.... not several years before they get put into service.

 

[skysthelimit]

Well one can be happy with a faster process in the DAC, even if most of what they cleared in the last 7 months was already cleared before the elections and just passed over for final decision after the election. The problem is, when people let themself confuse by DAC clearances and the huge ammounts of crores the media and the NDA hypes in these clearances, since that doesn't mean anything wrt to actuall decision making to procure an arm!

.....

Conclusion, "something" is moving, but didn't resulted in the major changes to improve the forces, in some areas it went even the opposite way, lets hope 2015 gets better!

Exactly - industry leaders told the exact same thing to Parrikar's face in last month's Make in India workshop. He was touting the crores of DAC clearances, and Baba Kalyani was - come back to me when anything has actually been procured.

Let's celebrate when the guns actually start arriving on our shores.

 

[Zarvan]

A long-delayed Indian Army program finally gets the go ahead.

By Debalina Ghoshal
January 03, 2015

In late November, the Indian Army’s artillery breathed a sigh of relief when the government gave clearance to a Rs. 15,570 crore ($2.5 billion) project for mountain artillery guns. The news came just a month after the Indian government cleared 80,000 crore worth of defense project deals. The guns to be purchased are 155 mm/52 caliber with a range of 40 km and will be part of the “Buy & Make India” program. At present, there is a plan to acquire 814 guns for the Indian Army. While 100 guns would be acquired off the shelf, the remainder of the 714 guns would be made in India.

This is a major boost to the Indian Army’s artillery, which has not acquired guns since the Bofors’ scam in the 1980s. India had already cancelled the acquisition of self-propelled 155 mm/52 caliber guns on the grounds that they failed to meet requirements. The only progress that was made in artillery was an upgrade to the Russian 130 mm/39 caliber M46 guns to 155 mm/45 caliber, which increased the range from 26 km to 39 km.

A ban on South Africa’s Denel had adverse repercussions for the progress of the Indian Army’s Bhim Artillery Project, an indigenous project under which Denel proposed to install a 155 mm gun on the Indian-made Arjun tank chassis. Now, though, given the government’s fast-track approach to procuring weapon systems for the Army, Air Force, and Navy, there is reason to believe that other lagging projects of the Indian Army’s Artillery could be about to get a boost. This haste in decision-making regarding defense procurements is due to the new government’s desire to “clear a backlog of defense orders” in order to provide an impetus to India’s military capability and boost its defense preparedness. China and Pakistan are already enhancing their artillery strength and India cannot afford to be left behind.

Several Indian companies are vying for the Army’s artillery project, namely TATA, L&T, and Bharat Forge, which can either develop the guns completely or build the guns in collaboration with a foreign firm. For instance, L&T has entered into an agreement with France’s Nexter Systems to offer the guns, while Mahindra Defence has joined with BAE systems. In August 2014, reports came in that India had lifted its ban on South Africa’s Denel company while in November 2014, India has also lifted its ban on Israeli Military Industries (IMI) and intends to plan for the future possibility of manufacturing ammunition for its 155 mm guns.

As New Delhi considers national security to be of “paramount concern” for the government, addressing the bottlenecks and hurdles in the defense procurement process will ensure that the “pace of acquisition is not stymied.” In July 2014, Finance Minister Arun Jaitley raised the foreign investment limit that can be contributed to the domestic defense industry from 29 percent to 49 percent in the hope of attracting more of its main arms suppliers in order to “reshape the defense industrial base dominated by state firms.” Under the new government, India has boosted defense spending by 12 per cent.

India’s decision to clear the 155 mm/52 caliber guns will no doubt lend momentum to the Indian Army’s artillery modernization program, and could cause foreign firms to “revisit their strategies” for the Indian market. It is clear that India is now keen on moving towards self-reliance with state-of-the-art equipment, rather than just buying complete systems from foreign firms.

Debalina Ghoshal is an Associate Fellow at the Centre for Air Power Studies.

Finally, Mountain Guns for India | The Diplomat

Finally something good for Indian Army. Well recently some of your defence source claimed we are getting our 400 old Towed Artiller Guns to 155 MM by help of China, can any one tell which Guns were they ? @Horus @Irfan Baloch