Failure of Pakistani Government; it’s the time for Army to hold Pakistan?

[bigmoneymaker]

Hi,

First of all, there is no such thing as true democracy---democarcy is earned not lent.

Secondly---even though S 2 and I---as we look through the prism---we see a different picture---but sometimes when there is a convergence of light at one point---then we are not too far apart on how it should be handled.

This is my e-mail to ISPR through their web-site---


Dear general,

These terrorists have come and stuck a dagger in your heart, right in the middle of your house---and you the leader of my army,have been caught sleeping at the job, unprepared and ill-equipped to handle 10 terrorists.

Isn't that a shame and a disgrace for you---after all this talk of how great the pak army is and how prepared we are to face the enemy---you kow towed to 10 terrorists---who broke through your frontline barriers with a minimal of effort---.

Even though you killed them, that doesnot take the shame of loss from your uniform. Truthfully, you people are absolutely not mentally prepared to fight the TTP. Seems like you are really clueless to what you want to do.

Maybe you need to learn a lesson from your enemy---see how dedicated they are to their jobs---if you are half as dedicated and committed to yours as they are to theirs, you would not have been found lying on your knees with the gun of the enemy pointed at your head. MK . END

The problem with pak millitary is that it is not following its very own procedures---that of basics and fundamentals of security 101. The stance and the posture of pak millitary is extremely casual and callous.


Historically, pak millitary has taken all previous conflicts very casually and in a non-chalant manner. Like the 65 and 71 war---they have traditionally missed all the oppurtunities to take take down the enemy in the shortest possible time span---.

Examples are 62 india china war---pak didnot go for kashmir---71 war---pak generals chickened out on the western front---.

A simple analysis may show that the right officers are not being promoted---it may just be an inherent fault in the selection system---through no fault of there own---more procastinators / thinkers are being elected to a job that should have gone to doers---men of action---.

The analytical wing of the pak millitary may be way behind the eight ball---historical prcedence exists---.


Young pakistanis have no clue and understanding to what happened at the GHQ when the birgadier asked the gunmen--'what is happening' and got shot in result.

This incidence in itself show the callous and casual attitude of the brig in question---when no armed soldier was allowed in the GHQ then the brig should have asked the question to himself---what is this soldier doing over here---there is a gun figfht going outside and this soldier is here by himself---.

I mean to say---an attack outside and the insurgents getting in, inside that building would have been instantaneous--- otherwise the brig. would have had the time to peek outside or call someone to find out what was happening---.

Any standard operating procedure for security would have been---once you heard gunfire---every office should have been locked down from inside and not opened unless proper security clearance was given. Any armed soldier, who has no business to be inside the building in the first place should have been considered as a hostile.


I am a firm believer of the fact that once you get anrgy---your learing abilities disappear---once anger takes over thinking, the resulting reaction is more of self destruction.

The swat operation proves that the taliban cannot stand in front of the might of the millitary----any millitary---with a 30,000 strong force assaulting with all the fire power---even if there were a 100 thousand taliban troops, they would have been slaughtered---the millitary has big guns---they have armour and tanks---they have air support---they can pound the living day-lights out of the taliban as they did in swat at their discretion.

Swat showed what pak millitary can do---but the biggest thing that came out of the swat action was that---why did the pak millitary not do that before hand----did the pak millitary had a different agenda than the rest of the pakistan---.

It is not for the regular joe to understand the threat level of the enemy insurgency---it is the job of the millitary to analyze and assess the threat and convey their reservations to the the govt to take the appropriate action.

Very emotional video

Very sad , and very very sad - shows the ugly face of war when
innocent people go in war, they come out as tortured souls

When you go in , you are told something stories and vision by your commanders and when you go at ground level and see realities you get shocked and , you have only to choices either you die or you make it alive

Looks like this solider made it back alive but he lost his innocence , and soul in process


But at least he can see difference between right and wrong , and loss of civilian life -

if only more ppl were like this person the cilian life lost would be less ....

Rest I am speechless - war is always pain and sad

Hopefully he will find peace and goodness

Why doesn't China get off its a$$ and help Pakistan with the military assistance it needs RIGHT NOW to fight the TTP? Is China helping and I am just ignorant? Please enlighten me. What is China doing to help Pakistan fight internal terrorists??

who created taliban and call it terrorists at first??? usa

who abandoned taliban and snubbed its very religious existence so they become desperate and extreme to keep on surviving after they are no longer used to confront with ussr?? usa

who become jingoistic aroused to attack taliban instead of negotiating with sane islamic world to get a concensus on solutioN
to deal with extremist taliban??? usa

who now become powerless to curb taliban and try to get pak economy commiting suicide by attacking retaliatory taliban??? usa

who now blame pak and china for not participating in its DIRTY game of obliterating ITS FORMER SUBORDINATE taliban??? usa

Who then will claim the credit of winning the wot and protecting the world with the HEAVY sacrifice of pak army and citizen IF PAK PUT ALL HER EFFORT TO JOIN WAR INITIATED BY USA???? usa

CONCLUSION: this is all usa GEOPOLITIC SEEKING(INTERESTS GAINED BY USA INCLUDES CONTAINING RUSSIA AND PARTICULARLY CHINA)game of wot, usa should pay THE PRICE to curb the terrorist taliban so that the world will be in peace by your brutal rule of force, and small weak countries like pak and developing china should keep away from WESTERN INVENTED brutal game rules otherwise they will be smashed to pieces...
MAYBE USA should THINK CAREFULLY BEFORE RAPING THE OTHER COUNTRIES WHICH USA CANNOT AFFORD, AND THEN USA NEED TO SPEAK HARSHLY TO THE COUNTRIES TO GAIN SUPPORT FOR ITS GAME FOR WORLD PEACE (ACTUALLY WESTERN CHRISTIAN AGGRESSIVE CIVILIZATION SAFETY) BY SPREADING MORE BLOODY HATRED, IS THAT MORALLY UPRIGHT FOR YOU TO DRAG OTHERS INTO MARSH OF HATRED-SPREADING, CIVILIANS-INVOLVED PROLONGED BLOODY PEACE FIGHTING?????...ANSWER THE WHOLE WORLD!!!!!!

 

[SSGPA1]

No need for PA to take over ... Only our President needs to be chhanged along with a couple of ministers and an ambassador.

Parliament needs to decide on the fate of President.

 

[jupiter2007]

No need for PA to take over ... Only our President needs to be chhanged along with a couple of ministers and an ambassador.

Parliament needs to decide on the fate of President.

Imran Khan as President of Pakistan (Pervez Musharraf as advisor to the President.)
Aitizaz Ahsan ???? as PM
Hamid Nawaz Khan as Defence Ministers of Pakistan,
Salman Shah as Finance Minister of Pakistan
Mustafa Kamal as Interior Ministers of Pakistan

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

I agree with AgNoStIc MuSliM, look MastanKhan during MMA government people of NWFP were in a love and hate relationship with TTP and TTP was quiet too, any Army attack would have taken as Punjabi Pashton civil war.

When they spread their wings and local people in Swat become hostage to TTP madness and ANP give up in accepting their demands , people in NWFP shifted their support to Army action.

So Army acted when the time was right and people of NWFP were behind them.

 

[BATMAN]

Why do you guys want to be ruled by military dictators ?

We always had civilian parliament and prime minister, army was never involved in making any legislation.

Bhutto was PM in 1970's
Sharif was PM in 1980's
Sharif and BB shared PM post in 1990's
Shaukat Aziz, Jamali and Gilani shared PM post in 2000!

IMO, it is better to have a military PM rather than a puppet working for foreign powers.
If Pakistan was ever dictated it was when army's representation was missing.

 

[MastanKhan]

who created taliban and call it terrorists at first??? usa

who abandoned taliban and snubbed its very religious existence so they become desperate and extreme to keep on surviving after they are no longer used to confront with ussr?? usa

who become jingoistic aroused to attack taliban instead of negotiating with sane islamic world to get a concensus on solutioN
to deal with extremist taliban??? usa

who now become powerless to curb taliban and try to get pak economy commiting suicide by attacking retaliatory taliban??? usa

who now blame pak and china for not participating in its DIRTY game of obliterating ITS FORMER SUBORDINATE taliban??? usa

Who then will claim the credit of winning the wot and protecting the world with the HEAVY sacrifice of pak army and citizen IF PAK PUT ALL HER EFFORT TO JOIN WAR INITIATED BY USA???? usa

CONCLUSION: this is all usa GEOPOLITIC SEEKING(INTERESTS GAINED BY USA INCLUDES CONTAINING RUSSIA AND PARTICULARLY CHINA)game of wot, usa should pay THE PRICE to curb the terrorist taliban so that the world will be in peace by your brutal rule of force, and small weak countries like pak and developing china should keep away from WESTERN INVENTED brutal game rules otherwise they will be smashed to pieces...
MAYBE USA should THINK CAREFULLY BEFORE RAPING THE OTHER COUNTRIES WHICH USA CANNOT AFFORD, AND THEN USA NEED TO SPEAK HARSHLY TO THE COUNTRIES TO GAIN SUPPORT FOR ITS GAME FOR WORLD PEACE (ACTUALLY WESTERN CHRISTIAN AGGRESSIVE CIVILIZATION SAFETY) BY SPREADING MORE BLOODY HATRED, IS THAT MORALLY UPRIGHT FOR YOU TO DRAG OTHERS INTO MARSH OF HATRED-SPREADING, CIVILIANS-INVOLVED PROLONGED BLOODY PEACE FIGHTING?????...ANSWER THE WHOLE WORLD!!!!!!

Hi,

Thanks for your input---incidentally taliban are their own creation--- u s of a didnot create them---pakistan didnot create them---even though pak supported them.

Wecannot blame the u s of of all the ills---we are grown up people---we also need to take preventive measures and prevasive actions so that the u s is kept at bay.

All super powers at one time or the other, take it upon themsleves to do some strategic conquests of smaller nations---u s of a is just one of them.

Actually--u s of a wasn't thinking when it attacked afghanistan---it was reacting in anger----that is where the problem started---. All the blood had gone to their head---neither could they see clearly their goals and focus on most important things, nor could they analyze the situation with an open mind---all they saw was red---need for revenge overcame the need for reasoning---when they stopped listening to other people telling them otherwise, war was the only option they could see.

Bad decision, bad planning, bad management, worst execution---we all are paying the price.

 

[SSGPA1]

Imran Khan as President of Pakistan (Pervez Musharraf as advisor to the President.)
Aitizaz Ahsan ???? as PM
Hamid Nawaz Khan as Defence Ministers of Pakistan,
Salman Shah as Finance Minister of Pakistan
Mustafa Kamal as Interior Ministers of Pakistan

Imran Khan is not ready yet. Aitezaz Ahdsan first betrayed ZA Bhutto and then betrayed BB, not a trust worthy guy at all.

Here is my opinion:
1. Gen. Musharraf (President)
2. Gillani (PM)
3. Khurshid Qasoori (Foriegn)
4. Salman Shah (Fin.)
5. Hamid Nawaz Khan(Defence)
6. Imran Khan (Health)
7. Mustafa Kamal (Infrastructure, public works etc)

 

[Bane Blade]

We most definately need to look at our position on the political front as recently a PPP mna believed that we should have more ministers atleast one to three members where will this leave the tax payer? We fail to realize that our president or any other members change won't spark much however a change in the Beuracracy will most definately be welcome because they are the backbone of our system and sadly they aren't elected officials in the past as soon as General Musharraf intorduced devolution of power the Beuracracy was quick to act and removed him from power in a way that Military rule will be frowned upon by atleast another three electoral governments however as soon as they feel that the government is working for the people purely for re-election they imediately take it down malign it deem it corrupt and quietly remain incharge

 

[All-Green]

Pakistan Army has no business in politics, even when their intent is good all they achieve is a temporary period of stability after which the power vacuum is too great and eventually leads to even worse political situation...

We have given all the politicians a very good alibi whereby they attribute all their failures to interruption of democracy and remain busy in following their personal agenda.

We need Army to be strong and respectable so that when it takes action it has 100% support of its people...it should have an image that when it takes action against any entity be it internal or external, the people know that there is no ulterior motive and it is for the best of Pakistan.

Remember the image of Army in Musharraf's era?
Despite the conspiracy theories falling like a torrential rain upon this land...just a few steps from Kiyani have ensured a much better image of Army, which is well deserved...we need this to improve and not degrade...
Once Army remains neutral, it shall become even more popular...this shall create a positive force which shall push politicians to get their act together...

At a time when the state is not respected it is best that the pillars of state are strengthened and Army is one of those pillars...by keeping above the petty politics and personal agendas the Army will be in much stronger position to help the State regain the respect which it should command...

We have to let the politicians balance each other out without any help from Judiciary or Army, only on a neutral ground will the true leaders finally become dominant...supporting any single political entity only weakens the leadership pool...

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

A fresh member and already using profanity. Not acceptable.

 

[Iron_Eagle_17]

Hi,

A fresh member and already using profanity. Not acceptable.

You can ban him sir or give him a warning but it is the truth that he is speaking.Although his last two sentences were ....... IMMATURE.

 

[BKhan]

This is not army job to interfere into politics. Pak army should concentrate on the job what they are doing and should learn to obey elected politicians of Pakistan.

 

[MastanKhan]

You can ban him sir or give him a warning but it is the truth that he is speaking.Although his last two sentences were ....... IMMATURE.

Hi,

There must be some common sense used---we understand the truth---but there has to be a respectable way to put it on the paper.

 

[FlyingEagle]

So its the time 4 re election

 

[naveed qaiser]

I totally disagree with you. Whether you people like it or not some people, and they can be from any background, have no commitment with Pakistan. They all aspire their future generations to settle in USA, UK, hence their investments and deposits are also made outside. They live and operate in Pakistan as an expatriate and once they find a suitable time they board the plane leaving behind all the mess they create in Pakistan for general people to suffer. We have seen plenty of time that happening, in case of Musharraf, Nawaz Sharif etc. Army having been involved in government so frequently and most of the time has its own aspirations to form their own Cult. Judiciary is totally corrupt and enslaved by the establishment; hence socio-economic justice does not prevail. Those who are really educated and can think independently are mostly the silent majority who keep watching the shows on Television and keep solving problems of Pakistan in their drawing rooms , in parties discussions , or on websites and on online papers or magazines. Army is not a solution to the problem. In fact present government; I would rather call it democratic government is paying through the nose for the mess created in previous regime; we all know that Army was in rule from 1999 till February 2008. This is time to help out government in resisting extremism and terrorism which was one gifts of Army rule. Just wishful thinking won’t do the trick.