F-16 Block 15MLU/50/52 Fighter

[IceCold]

it is being reported by Aircraft Illustrated magazine, April -08 issue that:

"the US Navy Adversary Group operating part (14 a/c) of the 28 embargoed F-16A/Bs have agreed to release the 14 F-16A/Bs to the PAF as part of the PAF MLU program. the USAF has already agreed to release their 14 a/c to the MLU program".

Sounds encouraging though if it could have had happened earlier the better it would have bin. So intotal 28 aircrafts have been made available for the PAF's MLU programe i.e 14 from the USAF and 14 from the navy.
Sir would we buy anymore of the A/B type F-16 or perhaps this will be the last order for the A/B type?

 

[fatman17]

Sounds encouraging though if it could have had happened earlier the better it would have bin. So intotal 28 aircrafts have been made available for the PAF's MLU programe i.e 14 from the USAF and 14 from the navy.
Sir would we buy anymore of the A/B type F-16 or perhaps this will be the last order for the A/B type?

icecold as reported in AFM of March, USAF is quietly transferring F-16A/B Block 30s to the PAF. i expect PAF to pick-up atleast 18 such a/c. remember the PAF would like to achieve their original order of 111 F-16s. that would be a potent force for the PAF.

 

[EagleEyes]

Turkey And Pakistan To Perform Joint Military Exercise

Turkey and Pakistan will conduct a joint military exercise between April 19th and 30th.

The "Indus Vipers 2008" military exercise will be staged at an air base in Sargodha, Pakistan, Turkey's Air Forces Command said on its website on Saturday.

The command also said Turkey will join with 5 F-16 jets and 49 personnel in the exercise.

The exercise aims to boost cooperation between Turkish and Pakistani air forces.

200804123134 | Turkey And Pakistan To Perform Joint Military Exercise | General

 

[Imran Khan]

good news i have some turkish friends here

 

[fatman17]

Turkey And Pakistan To Perform Joint Military Exercise

Turkey and Pakistan will conduct a joint military exercise between April 19th and 30th.

The "Indus Vipers 2008" military exercise will be staged at an air base in Sargodha, Pakistan, Turkey's Air Forces Command said on its website on Saturday.

The command also said Turkey will join with 5 F-16 jets and 49 personnel in the exercise.

The exercise aims to boost cooperation between Turkish and Pakistani air forces.

200804123134 | Turkey And Pakistan To Perform Joint Military Exercise | General

definately a step in the right direction!

 

[Quwa]

icecold as reported in AFM of March, USAF is quietly transferring F-16A/B Block 30s to the PAF. i expect PAF to pick-up atleast 18 such a/c. remember the PAF would like to achieve their original order of 111 F-16s. that would be a potent force for the PAF.

March 2008? I remember hearing this on AFM a year back. The Block-30s can be given the standard CCIP upgrade which would equip them with AN/APG-68(V9); JHMCS; Link-16; new ECM/EW, etc. Although these airframes do have some heavy-duty flying on them.

Regarding F-16 numbers....IIRC of the 111, about 11 were supposed to be reserve/attrition replacements. The active fleet would have consisted of at least 100 F-16s...I imagine C/Ds would have been bought during the 1990s if possible.

These days I am willing to believe the PAF may have kept its doors open for up to 72 new-built Block-52+...later 54 with AESA. There has been word from pshamim about PAF requesting APG-80 AESA for Block-52+ - and this may be implemented on the optional 18. Hence we may see a deal renegotiation...and with SABR AESA possibly being available in the future, PAF might try a Mirage-type venture by securing used F-16C/Ds where possible. Nonetheless a lot of aircraft can be put into service or into emergency reserve with very contemporary capability...the Block-52+/CCIP/MLUs can put up a very serious fight to the MKIs.

 

[fatman17]

March 2008? I remember hearing this on AFM a year back. The Block-30s can be given the standard CCIP upgrade which would equip them with AN/APG-68(V9); JHMCS; Link-16; new ECM/EW, etc. Although these airframes do have some heavy-duty flying on them.

Regarding F-16 numbers....IIRC of the 111, about 11 were supposed to be reserve/attrition replacements. The active fleet would have consisted of at least 100 F-16s...I imagine C/Ds would have been bought during the 1990s if possible.

These days I am willing to believe the PAF may have kept its doors open for up to 72 new-built Block-52+...later 54 with AESA. There has been word from pshamim about PAF requesting APG-80 AESA for Block-52+ - and this may be implemented on the optional 18. Hence we may see a deal renegotiation...and with SABR AESA possibly being available in the future, PAF might try a Mirage-type venture by securing used F-16C/Ds where possible. Nonetheless a lot of aircraft can be put into service or into emergency reserve with very contemporary capability...the Block-52+/CCIP/MLUs can put up a very serious fight to the MKIs.

it may have been decided last year, but was confirmed by AFM in their March issue. anyway thx for further furnishing more details of the PAF plans.

 

[PakShaheen79]

I do hope that China will come up with an AESA soon so that we can get out of this US centric thinking regarding PAF.I know PAF can get its best from US but the price will be paid by our future generation in form of more dependence on USA.We better stay away from them and seriously i am more keen to see J-10 in large numbers in PAF rather then F-16s. I hope the 18 C/Ds will be last procurement from USA.

 

[0UTL4W]

will the ex-peace gate f16's get the MLU? What will be the total number of f16's up to the block 52 standard in our fleet?

 

[Keysersoze]

will the ex-peace gate f16's get the MLU? What will be the total number of f16's up to the block 52 standard in our fleet?

Outlaw please read through the thread there are 40 or so pages covering this.

 

[MastanKhan]

OUTL4W,

This a defence related forum. We expect you to be knowledgable and be able to participate on this forum on your own strengths. The only thing that you have posted is what is this and how is that so far.

 

[EagleEyes]

Listen man, some people here got other things to do aswell rather than read through the whole 40 paged thread. If you dont want to answer my question then fine but keep your unwanted comments to yourself.

There is nothing unwanted about those comments. It was a polite suggestion which you took it as an unwanted comment. The only "unwanted" comment i see coming is from you alone in this thread. You can only post questions in Air Force Question Thread. Avoid posting questions in these threads, administration has every right to deny/delete/edit any post in the forum.

Please see the rules for more info.

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan to buy only 18 F-16s

By Our Correspondent WASHINGTON, April 22: Pakistan has decided to halve the number of F-16 fighter jets it’s buying from the United States due to financial constraints, according to some diplomatic sources.

Pakistan had earlier agreed to buy 36 of these aircraft at a total cost of $5.1 billion, which included associated weapons, spares and upgrading of an earlier fleet purchased in the 1980s.

The proposed fleet of 36 new F-16 Block 50/52 planes was to cost Pakistan $3 billion while it was required to pay additional $650 million for weapons.

The decision to reduce the order by half would also halve the cost of buying new F-16s and that of the weapons associated with them.

Pakistan, however, will still have to spend $1.3 billion on mid-life update and modification of the F-16A/B aircraft purchased earlier. Engine modifications and purchasing some new equipment for the old fleet will cost Pakistan additional $151 million.The sources said the new aircraft will be fully equipped with weapons and facilities that come with an F-16 Block 50/52 aircraft. The planes will be capable of carrying nuclear and non-nuclear weapons.

The United States will, however, have the right to conduct frequent inspections and inventory checking.

“The media stories that new aircraft will not have the facility to carry a nuclear weapon do not make sense,” said a defence expert. He pointed out that the French Mirage aircraft now with PAF did not have such facilities when purchased. Pakistanis, however, modified the aircraft to make them nuclear capable.

Pakistan’s request for new planes and for the modification for its earlier fleet was put on hold after the October 2005 earthquake.


does this mean that pakistan and china have reached agreement on the J-10 (F-20) and funds needs to be diverted.

 

[IceCold]

does this mean that pakistan and china have reached agreement on the J-10 (F-20) and funds needs to be diverted.

A very bad decision IMO if this is indeed the case. J-10 is as capable as a Block-40 F-16s. So why to go for a low end jet when we can get a more advance one. We need to watch the development of the J-10 closely w.r.t to the developments that are taking place with our adversary. Otherwise we might lack behind way too much, making it almost impossible to catch up.

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan reduces F-16 purchase from US

Nathan Hodge JDW Senior Americas Reporter - Washington, DC

Farhan Bokhari JDW Correspondent - Islamabad

Key Points
Pakistan is to buy 18 new F-16C/D aircraft from the US, waiving an option to acquire 18 more

Budgetary pressures were behind Pakistan's decision; the deal, originally valued at USD3 billion, is now worth USD498 million


Budgetary pressures have forced the Pakistani government to reduce the number of new F-16s that it plans to purchase from the United States, a high-level Pakistani official has told Jane's .

An initial agreement between the two countries covered the purchase of 18 F-16s with an option for an additional 18, but Pakistan chose to drop plans for the optional 18 aircraft when it signed the contract in December 2007. The decision only emerged through the Pakistani media on 23 April.

In 2006, the US Congress approved the sale of 36 new F-16C/D Block 50/52 aircraft to Pakistan as part of a large fighter aircraft modernisation package. When announced, the total value of the F-16 sale - including training, spares and other equipment - was valued at USD3 billion. Pakistan also requested the sale of a USD650 million weapons package, including 500 AIM 120-C5 Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missiles (AMRAAMs), 200 AIM-9M-8/9 Sidewinder missiles and 500 Joint Direct Attack Munition guidance kits.

However, an official with the US Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) told Jane's on 23 April that the new contract was valued at just USD498 million. "The other 18 [F-16 aircraft] are off the table completely - they are getting 18 and that's it," he said. "They pulled it off the table as part of a review of the contract."

The new contract covered the 18 aircraft and no spares or additional equipment, he said. The order includes 12 single-seat C-model Block 52 aircraft and six two-seat D-model aircraft. The DSCA source said that the sale would include "no [US] government-furnished equipment and no third-party contractor furnished equipment".

The Pakistani source said that "high international oil prices and a domestic economic slowdown" had made the decision unavoidable. "We have to look at every possibility to cut expenditure," he said.

He added that the reduction of the F-16 purchase would not affect the Pakistan Air Force's (PAF's) plans to induct up to 250 of the newly developed JF-17 'Thunder' fighters, jointly developed with China. The PAF plans to induct all the JF-17s by 2013. Negotiations are also continuing for the purchase of China's J-10 fighter aircraft. Pakistani officials have, in the past, said that they are looking at the purchase of between 35 and 40 of the J-10s for between USD1.5 billion and USD1.8 billion.

The US government has attached a number of extraordinary security conditions to the deal to insure against the transfer of sensitive technology. Among other things, US officials conduct semi-annual inventories of all F-16 equipment and munitions and more frequent inventories of AMRAAMs; and F-16 flights outside Pakistan and participation in exercises with other nations are to be approved in advance by the US government.

In 2007, PAF Chief of Air Staff Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed told Jane's that the service was interested in procuring more aircraft from China and that the JF-17 would form the "backbone" of the air force. Western observers also suggested that the reduction in the planned purchase of new F-16s may have been driven by mounting concerns among Pakistani leaders that the US might decide to scale back its weapon sales to the country. This follows concerns that the new US administration, which takes office in 2009, could scrutinise Pakistan's role in the 'war on terror'.

"At the popular level, many Pakistanis simply do not trust the US," said one Western defence analyst based in Islamabad, recalling the US suspension of arms sales to Pakistan in the 1990s. "With that kind of history and background, I would not be surprised - [even] if Pakistan wants access to hi-tech US weapons - that there is concern that the US remains a hard ally to trust."

Related Articles
Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed: Pakistan's Chief of Air Staff, jdw.janes.com, 30.03.07

US sets security conditions to Pakistan F-16 sale, jdw.janes.com, 21.07.06