Exclusive: PAF Airchief Visits Rafale & M2k Units

[Esgalduin]

Which plane Qatar going to replace?? Plus they buying whole world of new jetts F15, EF, Rafale for tiny country it's an over kill.

They also picked a fight with the Saudi-UAE coalition and faced sanctions as a result. The Qataris want to hold their own (geopolitically speaking) in the Arab world and I don't blame them. For a small country that faces the threat of aggression by the Saudis and their allies, such a step is not over-kill: it is a force multiplier to make up for their smaller size.

 

[Haris Ali2140]

They also picked a fight with the Saudi-UAE coalition and faced sanctions as a result. The Qataris want to hold their own (geopolitically speaking) in the Arab world and I don't blame them. For a small country that faces the threat of aggression by the Saudis and their allies, such a step is not over-kill: it is a force multiplier to make up for their smaller size.

Not force multiplier they are buying for political support.

 

[Esgalduin]

Not force multiplier they are buying for political support.

There is politics involved in every major defence acquisition, but unless they intend to let their jets rust in a hangar and never let them be used, political support is not the sole nor is it even the decisive reason for buying Mirages. If political support was the only reason, the Qataris might was well have bought just the airframes with all the electronics and other material ripped out to save on costs.

 

[Haris Ali2140]

There is politics involved in every major defence acquisition, but unless they intend to let their jets rust in a hangar and never let them be used, political support is not the sole nor is it even the decisive reason for buying Mirages. If political support was the only reason, the Qataris might was well have bought just the airframes with all the electronics and other material ripped out to save on costs.

Looks like you are not aware of the operatus mundi of GCC.

Buy most expensive weapons at high rates.

 

[Esgalduin]

Looks like you are not aware of the operatus mundi of GCC.

Buy most expensive weapons at high rates.

All I'm saying is that even though politics has a lot to do with weapon's acquisitions, there is at least some analysis made on the effectiveness of weapons platforms and how they fit into a country's defence policy. In other words, there is no country on Earth that buys weapons simply for political purposes, because that would imply they don't find them useful otherwise and thus will not use them. Don't level accusations for the sake of doing so, please.

 

[The Eagle]

Once upon a time....

 

[ziaulislam]

less than 600 Mirage-2000 were made

France has 300+ in storage or use
A 100 will be enough

 

[FuturePAF]

less than 600 Mirage-2000 were made

Pakistan may only need about 100-112 to fill the gap between the 76 F-16s and the 250 JF-17s, to maintain fighter numbers. Mirages would only be procured in a similar manner as the mirage 3/5 are; just air frames as they are; perhaps only a modest EW upgrade. At the lowest cost possible.

but you are correct, unless France sells directly or more via Qatar, Pakistan can get any more Mirage 2000 unless from the UAE (which won’t want on do it for India’s sake) and maybe Peru but even then that’s still just another 12.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Not to mention the costs associated with upgrading any old French ones that were never upgraded to -5 or -9 or even later upgrades like the ones UAE and India just undertook. As a reference, you can see how much Indians paid (through the nose) for upgraded standard, ie around 2.4B for 51 Mirages to the -5mk2 standard or 45MM ea roughly. This cost however probably also includes weapons, though I am not sure.
UAEs deal to upgrade it's -9 aircraft is about $1B but the aircraft only portion is $490MM, so maybe $9-10MM each.
While Mirage 2000s would definitely be a huge upgrade over the current 3/5 variants, bang for the buck doesn't exist imo. Similarly equipped F-16s would be cheaper and easier to operate and integrate and JF-17s even cheaper and easier. We should consolidate logistics as much as possible instead of buying too many different types. PAF will still at a minimum operate 4 different aircraft in this decade. F-16s, Mirages, Jf-17s and F-7s of various subtypes. JF-17 will by late 2020s replace all F-7s given the construction per year and the first block 3 squadron in 2023.

 

[Sulemanms202]

M2k: a low cost fighter?

you wish!

 

[nahtanbob]

Pakistan may only need about 100-112 to fill the gap between the 76 F-16s and the 250 JF-17s, to maintain fighter numbers. Mirages would only be procured in a similar manner as the mirage 3/5 are; just air frames as they are; perhaps only a modest EW upgrade. At the lowest cost possible.

but you are correct, unless France sells directly or more via Qatar, Pakistan can get any more Mirage 2000 unless from the UAE (which won’t want on do it for India’s sake) and maybe Peru but even then that’s still just another 12.

I do not think you will be able to get 100 second hand Mirage-2000s unless France is willing to participate.
I do not see France giving those to a country who has not purchased any Mirage-2000 or Rafales.

 

[FuturePAF]

I do not think you will be able to get 100 second hand Mirage-2000s unless France is willing to participate.
I do not see France giving those to a country who has not purchased any Mirage-2000 or Rafales.

I agree, France wont directly sell to Pakistan. France may sell to Qatar which may sell on wards to Pakistan, just maybe, although that is a long shot, but worth a try.

Even basic Mirage 2000 with modest A2A and A2G capabilities, if they have ways to integrate PAF munitions; especially A2G will make them worth it. Its the air frame, and engines with decent enough life left in them to operate another 15-20 years, that the PAF needs.

 

[Ra's al Ghul]

@Windjammer sir, will you plz share some pics from old excercise of PAF F-16 with Qatari Rafales both togather ,
i cant find them on google search.

 

[Windjammer]

@Windjammer sir, will you plz share some pics from old excercise of PAF F-16 with Qatari Rafales both togather ,
i cant find them on google search.

Dude Qatar received her first Rafales in June last year so there's no question of any exercise with them.

 

[nahtanbob]

I agree, France wont directly sell to Pakistan. France may sell to Qatar which may sell on wards to Pakistan, just maybe, although that is a long shot, but worth a try.

Even basic Mirage 2000 with modest A2A and A2G capabilities, if they have ways to integrate PAF munitions; especially A2G will make them worth it. Its the air frame, and engines with decent enough life left in them to operate another 15-20 years, that the PAF needs.

Qatar puts its Mirage-2000 fleet on sale
https://www.tacticalreport.com/qatar-france-and-crisis-over-mirage-sale/