Exclusive interview: Musharraf hits back at Shahid Aziz

[batmannow]

First, prior to our research, it was widely believed that mujahideen, or
civilian “freedom fighters” involved in a Muslim war or struggle, played
a significant part in the Kargil intrusion – a falsehood caused by the initial
confusion of India’s civilian and military intelligence services, a carefully
planned Pakistani denial and deception campaign, and opportunistic
Islamic militant groups. The Indian Kargil Review Committee, which
was highly dubious about the role of militants in the conflict, still concluded
that “the regular/irregular ratio may well have been in the range of
70:30, if the overall numbers are taken into account.”17 Our interviews
with Pakistani and Indian ground commanders revealed that local civilians
played only minimal reconnaissance and logistical roles in the operation.
In fact, numerous Pakistani officers and soldiers told us they did not
encounter a single civilian combatant during the conflict.
Eight years after the event, Pakistan still officially maintains that freedom
fighters and not the Northern Light Infantry conducted the cross-
LoC intrusion. Former President Musharraf states in his 2006 memoir
that the “freedom fighting mujahideen occupied the Kargil Heights that
the Indian army had vacated for the winter.”18 Three reasons can be
offered to explain why Pakistan concocted the mujahideen cover and why
it maintains this façade even today. First, until the Kargil operation, the
Pakistan army did not consider the Northern Light Infantry at par with
regular troops. Being locals of the area, most NLI soldiers came from
villages near the LoC, which even today do not have the legal status as
being a full part of the Pakistan nation-state. Therefore, it was easy for
government officials to refer to these soldiers as freedom fighters as
opposed to regular army troops.


http://assets.cambridge.org/97805217/67217/excerpt/9780521767217_excerpt.pdf


The whole world knows about Pakistani so called 'freedom fighter' lies during Kargil

This still begs the question as to why Pakistan maintained the façade
after NLI soldiers had been captured and proof of their involvement was
abundant. As strange as itmay seem, the reason rests largely in the legality
of the position. The Pakistan government concluded that it could not have
admitted occupation by Pakistani troops across the LoC because the area
was demarcated under the 1972 Simla Accord and covered under the
1949 Karachi Agreement, and Pakistan’s admittance of the cross-LoC
operation was judged in Islamabad to be tantamount to admitting aggression.
The legal context differed significantly from that of India’s 1984
Siachen military occupation, which India had been able to justify because
Siachen was a contested area that was not demarcated with the rest of the
LoC. To the Pakistanis, however, Siachen violated the Simla Accord, as
pointed out in chapter 2 by Zafar Iqbal Cheema. Although Siachen was
still amajor Pakistani grievance, Pakistan’s Foreign Office believed that an
admission of regular troops crossing the defined LoC would be difficult to
justify internationally. In its assessment, continuation of the mujahideen
story, along with a narrative that defensive positions were improved,
would preserve some degree of plausible deniability.20
19

Pakistan’s perpetuation of the mujahideen deception may have provided
a thin veneer of legal deniability and a face-saving formula, but in the end
it severely damaged Pakistan’s credibility both inside and outside South
Asia, as C. Christine Fair discusses in chapter 9. It also altered the standing
of Kashmir insurgency. Instead of being regarded internationally as a
“freedom struggle,” the Kashmir insurgency came to be seen after Kargil
(and especially after the 9/11 terrorist attacks against the United States) as
“terrorist” activity. If Pakistan had hoped the Kargil operation would
stimulate international focus on the Kashmir issue, this was not the
intended result.

India’s security at risk: Army Chief warns PM
Last Updated: Wednesday, March 28, 2012, 11:21
India

New Delhi: Amidst the raging row over bribery allegations, Army Chief General VK Singh is reported to have written a letter to the Prime Minister, stating the country’s security might be at risk owing to the fact that tanks are running out of ammunition, air defence is going obsolete and the infantry is operating without critical weapons.

According to DNA, Gen Singh wrote the letter to PM Manmohan Singh on March 12, two weeks before making an explosive revelation that he was offered Rs 14 crore bribe to clear a defence purchase.

The Army Chief’s letter also rocked both Houses of Parliament, with Opposition creating an uproar over the issue.

Defence Minister AK Antony told Rajya Sabha he was aware of the letter and that a response would be given “at an appropriate time”.



Minister of State for Defence Pallam Raju had earlier confirmed that the government had received the letter from the Army Chief and were taking it seriously. The minister added that steps were being taken to overcome the shortcomings in armed forces' preparedness.

"There is obviously a gap in the capabilities. We are trying to bridge that gap," the minister told reporters.

Sources meanwhile said that the Army Chief’s letter was a breach of protocol as it should have been sent to the Defence Minister only.

In the letter, the Army Chief – who also had a recent run-in with the government over his date of birth controversy – asked the PM to “pass suitable directions to enhance the preparedness of the Army”.

Gen Singh wrote to the PMO after he failed to get a response from the Defence Ministry. It is no secret that following the row with South Block —which houses the Defence Ministry — over his birth date, the Army Chief has had to face a bureaucracy that seems reluctant to process files.

Also, experts and observers have criticised the Manmohan Singh-led government, which first came to power in May 2004 and then won a re-election in 2009, for not having made any big ticket defence purchases.

“The state of the major (fighting) arms i.e. Mechanised Forces, Artillery, Air Defence, Infantry and Special Forces, as well as the Engineers and Signals, is indeed alarming,” Gen Singh wrote in his letter, as per DNA.



In his letter, the Army Chief stated that while there is lack of critical ammunition for the entire tank fleet, the country’s air defence is “97% obsolete and it doesn't give the deemed confidence to protect…from the air”.

Also, the infantry is crippled with “deficiencies of crew served weapon” and lacks “night fighting” capabilities. Elite Special Forces, on the other hand, are “woefully short” of “essential weapons”.

Lamenting the complex and slow defence procurement procedures, Gen Singh said that there was “hollowness” in the present system.

He also hit out at indigenous ordnance factories, saying they produce weapon systems and other fighting material of poor quality with no sense of urgency.

Stating the shortcomings were severely eroding the Army's preparedness, he stressed on the need to “urgently mitigate” these “critical deficiencies” that are “impacting the operational capability” of a 1.3million-strong Army.


severely damaged indian credibility both inside and outside South
Asia

@batmannow What ever happened Indian army Indian public knows the truth and necessary actions will be taken, But Musharaf did a coup to stop the truth from coming out and now he is lying when the truth came out from his own generals.

thats our problem , instead 70% of peoples of pakistan , want a coup to be taken now!
& he isnt lying, liar can be found only on your side friend!

 

[darkinsky]

No body can match the lying capability of mushy

Official claims of pakistan death is near 470 and they gave a list of it but now he says 260

Indian soldier list is of near 550 but how the fck its is 1600?

thats new invention

looks like you just visited wikipedia

all the figures(pakistani plus indian) have indian sources mentioned on them, go and check again

 

[batmannow]

looks like you just visited wikipedia

all the figures(pakistani plus indian) have indian sources mentioned on them, go and check again

stupidly they think , whole of pak, is against him?

 

[Srinivas]

thats our problem , instead 70% of peoples of pakistan , want a coup to be taken now!
& he isnt lying, liar can be found only on your side friend!

If you are fan of Musharaf, I have no problem with that

 

[batmannow]

If you are fan of Musharaf, I have no problem with that

i am the one who killed 99 indian soilders, in kargill all of them got eyeball headshots, ask your army peoples! how you feel now

 

[INDIC]

looks like you just visited wikipedia

all the figures(pakistani plus indian) have indian sources mentioned on them, go and check again

Wikipedia even contain references but Musharraf is saying 260 Pakistan killed while we have more than 260 graves of Pakistani soldiers while your army's website mentions the name of around 500 soldiers killed in Kargil.

Kya hai ye.

 

[Paan Singh]

looks like you just visited wikipedia

all the figures(pakistani plus indian) have indian sources mentioned on them, go and check again

Capital talk on Geo news – Col. (R) Ashfaq Hussain, Air Marshall (R) Shahid Latif,, Lt. Gen (R) Talat Masood – 31st January 2013

listen col ashfaq

Tonight with Moeed (Facts reveals on Kargil War) – 30th January 2013

listen the lady journalist who conducted 250 interviews related to kargil of various pakistani army officers.
all say same that mushy is liar and you are brainwashed kids

 

[danger007]

Seems liek u have been watching quite a few bollywood movies lately, wakeup and come into reallity.



Nobody gives a shitt abt what world says abt pak army, where is that world when thousand's of muslims were brutally killed in Gujraat ???

we don't give chit against, mushy exclusive show... he bring shame with kargil... and you guys trying to find lame excuse from the nasty stupid (tactical in your way) move... by occupying emptied posts.... it is an provocative move by mushy..

 

[Paan Singh]

i am the one who killed 99 indian soilders, in kargill all of them got eyeball headshots, ask your army peoples! how you feel now

and you forgot how 300 + got killed in LGB strikes on ammunition depots

keep lying n denying...

atleast get the bodies who are still buried in india .

this is the image after bombing who lead to 300 killings in one strike..

remember ?

 

[danger007]

i am the one who killed 99 indian soilders, in kargill all of them got eyeball headshots, ask your army peoples! how you feel now

sleep well my friend, don't wet your bed while having wet dreams...

 

[darkinsky]

Capital talk on Geo news – Col. (R) Ashfaq Hussain, Air Marshall (R) Shahid Latif,, Lt. Gen (R) Talat Masood – 31st January 2013

listen col ashfaq

Tonight with Moeed (Facts reveals on Kargil War) – 30th January 2013

listen the lady journalist who conducted 250 interviews related to kargil of various pakistani army officers.
all say same that mushy is liar and you are brainwashed kids

India actually lost Kargil war: Gen Pal



India actually lost Kargil war: Gen Pal

* Indian general says what his country gained from war has not been consolidated

By Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI: An Indian general, who commanded troops during 1999 Kargil war, on Sunday broke his 11-year silence to say that India actually lost the war in strategic terms.

Lieutenant-General (r) Kishan Pal, the then head of Srinagar-based 15 Corps, told a private channel that he did not speak because he was never convinced about this war.

“We did gain some tactical victories, we regained the territories, but lost 587 precious lives. I consider this loss of war because whatever we gained from the war has not been consolidated, either politically or diplomatically. It has not been consolidated militarily,” he said, when was asked for his assessment of the conflict 11 years later.

Gen Pal was recently in a controversy involving the battle performance report of one of his juniors, Brigadier Devinder Singh. An armed forces tribunal has indicted Pal for showing bias against Brigadier Singh; former 70 infantry brigade commander, and belittled his achievements in the war besides falsifying accounts of battles during the Kargil operations.

Meanwhile, a Chandigarh-based former army major has also come out with a revelation that his inputs on Kargil ‘intrusion’, sent to his seniors as early as January-February 1999, were ignored and he was asked to stop sending such reports in writing.

Major Manish Bhatnagar, who participated in the Kargil war, said not only were his inputs ignored, later, when a full-scale conflict broke out, he was court martialled on another pretext and made to leave the army.

He said he had informed his senior officers about the heavy presence of hostile forces and had also apprised them of the large number of bunkers and occupation of vital points by them during his posting. “Later, when the strength of ‘intruders’ was found to be more than the perceptions of the top generals — resulting in mass causalities of soldiers — officers like me were persecuted to hide their wrongs,’” Bhatnagar said.

 

[batmannow]

and you forgot how 300 + got killed in LGB strikes on ammunition depots

keep lying n denying...

atleast get the bodies who are still buried in india .

this is the image after bombing who lead to 300 killings in one strike..

remember ?

both of times you hit dummies, dont you know that? no
you dont?

 

[darkinsky]

and you forgot how 300 + got killed in LGB strikes on ammunition depots

keep lying n denying...

atleast get the bodies who are still buried in india .

this is the image after bombing who lead to 300 killings in one strike..

remember ?

did you forget this?

 

[batmannow]

sleep well my friend, don't wet your bed while having wet dreams...

i know its horrible, even to think, bt still after retirment, i still want a 100?
& i think you just hve taken out your wet dhoti, isnt you?

 

[Paan Singh]

@darkinsky

“We did gain some tactical victories, we regained the territories, but lost 587 precious lives. I consider this loss of war because whatever we gained from the war has not been consolidated, either politically or diplomatically. It has not been consolidated militarily,” he said, when was asked for his assessment of the conflict 11 years later.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/nation...af-hits-back-shahid-aziz-2.html#ixzz2JaJQ2ojA

This is true.

Atleast read what he is saying

1)We dint get anything or gain anything from war.WE could push pakistan to shove but nothing done by vajpayee.

and

what pakistan got from kargil?

1) lost kashmir fully
2) humiliation
3)1100 + casualties (as per many resources of your own media,it may be more)

keep supporting mushy nad live in denial.

now tell me what you achieved by kargil?

i know its horrible, even to think, bt still after retirment, i still want a 100?
& i think you just hve taken out your wet dhoti, isnt you?

save those 100's who daily get killed in karachi and federal areas in terrorist strikes ...