Evolution question.

[Sneaker]

I have neither the time nor the desire to educate you.

Don't worry about me, but please make some time to educate yourself. Do you atleast have desire to get educated?

 

[Developereo]

Don't worry about me, but please make some time to educate yourself. Do you atleast have desire to get educated?

I understand the role of recombination and mutation in evolution and I know there are claims on both sides
.
You clearly do not since you assert controversial claims as 'facts'. Most importantly, you don't understand that the distinction you introduced -- mutation v/s recombination -- is irrelevant to this particular discussion.

You don't understand the scientific method despite your bombastic posts.

 

[Sneaker]

What are you trying to say, they evolved first and now their evolution stopped because they became perfect??....if you think so then you're contradicting the very theory you're supporting, you're taking science's side but not being scientific/logical in your approach....because Evolution, according to the evolutionists, is a never-ending process.
In the 'comet strike' example of yours, why and how do you think the cockroaches survived the previous strike while the 'more intelligent' life forms perished despite facing similar conditions??.....it just doesn't add up....


....evolution doesn't "aim" to do anything, it is not a process designed by someone.......so, the brain, like any other parts of the body should evolve too....and species should become more and more intelligent/adaptive....infact, there is evidence about how the shape and size of the skulls of the primates changed over time, with that, their intelligence......indicating adaptation of the brain(probably depending on its use, just like any other organs).....but the question is, why did that happen to the primates only, that too, only to a sub-group of primates.....astonishingly, other sub-groups remained more or less same......as I said, things just doesn't add up.......unless of-course, you consider the reasons below.


How and why did the humans become an exception.....unexplainable, unless you bring in 'God' who created them, or 'Aliens' who mixed their genes with primates of the earth, you can even consider 'Gods' as 'Aliens'.....but the thing is, Humans shouldn't have become exception....

Yes, evolution stopped for cockroaches. Not ended, but stopped or paused. Because there is no significant "selective pressure" for them. If there is a situation where a new form of selective pressure arises, evolution will start again. I am not sure of exact traits of cockroaches which make them excellent survivors though. About brain, you are looking at only one possibility where in becoming more and more intelligent is beneficial. But it may not be so. For example, have you ever wondered why other mammal babies start walking/swimming within hours to weeks but humans take years? because our brain is bigger and during childbirth, it will kill the mother if brain is fully formed in the womb. So, all humans are born with premature brain and it matures outside of mother's body. Now imagine a situation where brain gets bigger and starts an increase in child and mother's mortality (thus negative pressure).. then brain will start shrinking again (species gets "dumber"). It all depends on what is best suited for surviving. Humans are not exceptional. There have been "other humans" with matching intelligence who died out (well, most probably because of us). So, nothing exceptional when you look at echidna, platipus, bat etc etc.. that is every single species on earth today is exceptional in one or the other way. That is why it is a separate species. No need to bring any unseen entities like god or aliens in the equation..

I understand the role of recombination and mutation in evolution and I know there are claims on both sides
.
You clearly do not since you assert controversial claims as 'facts'. Most importantly, you don't understand that the distinction you introduced -- mutation v/s recombination -- is irrelevant to this particular discussion.

You don't understand the scientific method despite your bombastic posts.

I did not bring that into discussion, you did. by saying mutations can only take place in the repairing proteins else they correct 100% DNA mutations, which is not correct. If it were, DNA paternity tests would be useless. There is always some error in DNA copying. Most errors are neutral, major harmful, some beneficial (of course, copy error is not the only type of mutations either).

 

[Selous]

For those Muslims who do not believe in evolution please look up Dr Israr Ahmed's views on the topic. He is the only one to present a sound theory with proof that I have come across so far. Look at his videos on the topic. I was fortunate enough to hear him speak live on the topic.

 

[Wolfhound]

For those Muslims who do not believe in evolution please look up Dr Israr Ahmed's views on the topic. He is the only one to present a sound theory with proof that I have come across so far. Look at his videos on the topic. I was fortunate enough to hear him speak live on the topic.

can you post a link?

 

[firestorm77]

Bring on the scientific FACTS of evolution not theories-

The evidence for evolution is overwhelming, where do you think all those fossils came from?

As a Muslim I have no problem in believing that life has evolved over billions of years, but I don't accept that random mutations was the driving force behind that change.

 

[Wolfhound]

The evidence for evolution is overwhelming, where do you think all those fossils came from?

As a Muslim I have no problem in believing that life has evolved over billions of years, but I don't accept that random mutations was the driving force behind that change.

exactly!

 

[Sneaker]

The evidence for evolution is overwhelming, where do you think all those fossils came from?

As a Muslim I have no problem in believing that life has evolved over billions of years, but I don't accept that random mutations was the driving force behind that change.

Natural selection guys, natural selection. That is all this theory of evolution is about (at least in layman's terms).

 

[Developereo]

I did not bring that into discussion, you did. by saying mutations can only take place in the repairing proteins else they correct 100% DNA mutations, which is not correct. If it were, DNA paternity tests would be useless. There is always some error in DNA copying. Most errors are neutral, major harmful, some beneficial (of course, copy error is not the only type of mutations either).

You are right that proofreading is not 100% effective, and environmental factors can introduce changes beyond the capability of the proofreaders to compensate. It doesn't affect my point that mutations within proofreaders are far more significant than mutations within the rest of the DNA.

 

[Sneaker]

You are right that proofreading is not 100% effective, and environmental factors can introduce changes beyond the capability of the proofreaders to compensate. It doesn't affect my point that mutations within proofreaders are far more significant than mutations within the rest of the DNA.

I am not knowledgeable enough to quantify significance of the mutations in certain regions of DNA. But I know that small mutations in "switches" can have profound effect. Infact, most of the related species have only minor changes in switches. This is still being studied though.

 

[Selous]

can you post a link?

Read this article:
(google it):
The Process of Creation A Qur'anic Perspective By Dr. Israr Ahmad
This is a 9 part video on youtube that deals with it:

Here is another interesting article: Evolution

 

[Selous]

The evidence for evolution is overwhelming, where do you think all those fossils came from?

As a Muslim I have no problem in believing that life has evolved over billions of years, but I don't accept that random mutations was the driving force behind that change.

Well if one believes that Allah/God is the primary Cause of everything then nothing is random...it might just appear to be random to us i.e. lacking a pattern.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Well if one believes that Allah/God is the primary Cause of everything then nothing is random...it might just appear to be random to us i.e. lacking a pattern.

Allah/God can be the creator of evolution. Why not.

The problem is not Allah/God, the real issue is with literal interpretation of Bible.

Muslims today just ape Biblical interpretations while attacking theory of evolution.

That's all.

 

[Selous]

Allah/God can be the creator of evolution. Why not.

The problem is not Allah/God, the real issue is with literal interpretation of Bible.

Muslims today just ape Biblical interpretations while attacking theory of evolution.

That's all.

Brother I believe in evolution, the problem is with uneducated people like Harun Yahya spreading their ideologies around in the guise of Islamic books. These books are sold in Islamic books shops and sadly sometimes these are the only books on science that Muslims read...so naturally they will oppose evolution. And as you said all these idiots who are refuting evolution these days are just aping the Christians. This is a relatively new trend since Muslims have not always refuted evolution...in fact I believe even Ibn Katheer and Allamah Iqbal wrote on the topic.

 

[Gauss]

So basically this is what ive gathered please correct me if im wrong.

Life existed only in the ocean till plants started growing and eventually fish came onto land in the form of amphibians(Synapsids). Small reptiles also started to develop then an extinction event happened because of increased volcanic activity destroying most amphibians.

This lead to smaller reptiles developing into the Dinosaurs which would rule the world for the next 200million years and hold mammals back to small creatures.

Then the asteroid came and struck in the Gulf of Mexico creating a giant shock wave and Tsunami and blocking out the sun killing all large life and so ended the rain of the dinosaurs and the rise of mammals who could now grow because the large dinosaurs were killed and eventually evolved into primates who lived in the trees.Grass then grew and primates took to the ground eventually developing the ability to stand on 2 legs eventually becoming the modern human.

The modern human then spread from Africa through Asia to Australia then into Europe.The world then entered an Ice age due to mountain ranges and placed land masses blocking warm water from reaching the north pole.This then connected modern Day Russia and USA/Alaska by land in which humans crossed it into the Americas then humans Finally went into Madagascar at about 500 AD and New zealand was settled by polynesians at about 1400 AD

My question is this if the asteroid didnt hit earth and nothing else happened could reptiles/dinosaurs of developed into life comparable to the human?

Evolution of life into an intelligent form was bound to happen under the climatic conditions of this planet. Without the asteroid, advent of intelligent life form couldve been delayed but not prevented.