Enough evidence of Indian involvement in Balochistan, Waziristan

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

By the way, TOI could be jingoistic and reports like Arnab Goswami high on steroid, but at least they don't make their front page based on fake stories.

That is precisely what the Indian media did with the numerous concocted claims attributed to David Headley.

Headley's plea agreement and deposition is public record - read through it and show me where any of the claims made in the Indian media show up? Also, some of the wikileaks talk about US LEA's briefing the ISI about Headley, and those don't mention anything along the lines of what was claimed in the Indian media either.

 

[Bang Galore]

The Indian media runs concocted confessions attributed to Headley, that cannot be verified based on the information in his plea agreement/deposition made to US LEA's, and some of the Pakistani media is running concocted stories attributed to wikileaks.

The line about Gen. Singh being a 'egotist, braggart etc.' is in fact a comment made about Gen. Panang on the blog Pragmatic Euphony back in january of 2008:

It doesn’t take great wisdom to understand the reason behind the story — to discredit Lt. General Panag. Not that Lt. General Panag is a paragon of virtue himself. By all accounts, he is an egotist, self-obsessed, petulant and idiosyncratic General, a braggadocio and a show-off, who has been disliked (and barely tolerated) by all his subordinates.

Pragmatic Euphony Media : Army’s new force multiplier

Of course the purpose here has been served, the claims are out there and many Pakistanis (and perhaps others as well) who read the Pakistani media will believe the claims made, much like the concocted Headely confessions in the Indian media found a lot of traction with Indians and others who read Indian papers.

So much for 'Aman ki Asha', given that the two papers involved in that initiative, Times of India and The News, are the ones that run the most derogatory and unverified pieces about the other country. Kudos to the Pakistani papers that did not run the piece because much of the claims were unverified.

There was no need for the Pakistani papers to resort to this - there is enough information trickling out through the wikileaks that suggests that the Indians and Afghans are involved in supporting/sheltering terrorists attacking Pakistan.

You had to drag Indians into this, didn't you? The Headley confessions as reported by the Indian media is not in the least bit similar to this plant. The Headley confession, whether you choose to believe them or not are attributed to statements from officials of the Indian Home Ministry & not claimed to be directly sourced. As long as those whom the stories are attributed to do not deny the claims, the value of the story stands. Not so in this case where fiction has replaced common sense. Anyone reading it should have realised that the statements don't even seem to be a in a style preferred by the Americans let alone the sheer ridiculousness of the content. Seems like desperation at work. A bit like the Zaid Hamid story/photograph of the supposed Mumbai coastline as seen through the periscope of a Pakistani submarine. Easy to fool some but eventually a complete loss of credibility. I'm a bit surprised that The News got caught up in this. Have read them regularly & can only hope that it was some pretty bad judgment by otherwise decent journalists. The alternative is that Pakistan has a new rival to Zaid Hamid. Hopefully an apology would close this issue though I think their credibility has taken a very serious knock.

 

[justanobserver]

The Headley confession, whether you choose to believe them or not are attributed to statements from officials of the Indian Home Ministry & not claimed to be directly sourced.

Exactly!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

You had to drag Indians into this, didn't you? The Headley confessions as reported by the Indian media is not in the least bit similar to this plant. The Headley confession, whether you choose to believe them or not are attributed to statements from officials of the Indian Home Ministry & not claimed to be directly sourced. As long as those whom the stories are attributed to do not deny the claims, the value of the story stands. Not so in this case where fiction has replaced common sense. Anyone reading it should have realised that the statements don't even seem to be a in a style preferred by the Americans let alone the sheer ridiculousness of the content. Seems like desperation at work. A bit like the Zaid Hamid story/photograph of the supposed Mumbai coastline as seen through the periscope of a Pakistani submarine. Easy to fool some but eventually a complete loss of credibility. I'm a bit surprised that The News got caught up in this. Have read them regularly & can only hope that it was some pretty bad judgment by otherwise decent journalists. The alternative is that Pakistan has a new rival to Zaid Hamid. Hopefully an apology would close this issue though I think their credibility has taken a very serious knock.

Nonsense - anyone can concoct 'anonymous government officials' to promote propaganda and lies.

And if actual government officials were involved in concocting and propagating the Headely stories in the Indian media, then that is a step even beyond what happened here, since it illustrates how there is a strong Government-media nexus in India that manufactures and runs propaganda stories to continuously demonize Pakistan and brainwash the Indian public into hating Pakistan.

 

[sparklingway]

AM, we can tackle the fake reports, unsupported Headley claims (although they were attributed to NIA reports) and all other stuff coming from ToI and other Indian papers later. Red Herring, Lack of relevance, etc etc.

The reality is that Ahmed Quraishi posted a fake report that his employer carried on it's main pages as top headline and the papers are the most read urdu paper and the 2nd most widely read english paper. The Jang Group either didn't care to check the veracity of the story and believed what AQ threw at them (or maybe they saw it online and plagiarized like they do all the time) or maybe they got the fake story from the original source (after it was written by a Maj sitting in G-7/4).

Lying to the public so shamelessly must have it's consequences. APNS and Press Council should censure the Jang Group.

 

[Last Hope]

I wonder what else GoI has done to make Pakistan fall.
They are doing a disappointing job everywhere, because we are Pakistanis!

Aint gonna lose from anyone.

 

[LaBong]

The Headley confession, whether you choose to believe them or not are attributed to statements from officials of the Indian Home Ministry & not claimed to be directly sourced.

And also US foreign office hasn't expressed objection on any statement on headly by Indian Home Ministry. It would have been taken as serious diplomatic breach of conduct had Home Ministry been lying about Headly.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

AM, we can tackle the fake reports, unsupported Headley claims (although they were attributed to NIA reports) and all other stuff coming from ToI and other Indian papers later. Red Herring, Lack of relevance, etc etc.

Not at all - the relevance is in the similarity of unverified and concocted claims carried by the two largest media groups in India and Pakistan, and how it serves to brainwash the public in both countries.

If propaganda in the Indian media, either planted by the Indian government or manufactured by Indian journalists, continues, then one cannot just hope that there will no be retaliation by some in the GoP and the Pakistani press.

AQ is the manifestation of precisely such a response to the propaganda pushed by the Indian side.

 

[LaBong]

And if actual government officials were involved in concocting and propagating the Headely stories in the Indian media, then that is a step even beyond what happened here, since it illustrates how there is a strong Government-media nexus in India that manufactures and runs propaganda stories to continuously demonize Pakistan and brainwash the Indian public into hating Pakistan.

You do understand that US would have intervened had GoI been propagating false reports about Headly's confession, right?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

And also US foreign office haven't expressed objection on any statement on headly by Indian Home Ministry. It would have been taken as serious diplomatic breach of conduct had Home Ministry been lying about Headly.

Actually there was a report that the US was not pleased with the Indian government allegedly making these claims to the media, because of the terms of Headley's plea agreement.

And correct me if I am wrong, but the Indian government has not officially made these claims has it? Nor has it provided any evidence to back them up?

 

[sparklingway]

Not at all - the relevance is in the similarity of unverified and concocted claims carried by the two largest media groups in India and Pakistan, and how it serves to brainwash the public in both countries.

If propaganda in the Indian media, either planted by the Indian government or manufactured by Indian journalists, continues, then one cannot just hope that there will no be retaliation by some in the GoP and the Pakistani press.

I accept the reality although I choose not to post it here since I do not want to cover the lies that our media through under a heap of Indian lies.

AQ is the manifestation of precisely such a response to the propaganda pushed by the Indian side.

He is not a response. He's a devoted bigot who works on a payroll. This is not traumatic events in childhood coming out and affecting you.

 

[Bang Galore]

Nonsense - anyone can concoct 'anonymous government officials' to promote propaganda and lies.

And if actual government officials were involved in concocting and propagating the Headely stories in the Indian media, then that is a step even beyond what happened here, since it illustrates how there is a strong Government-media nexus in India that manufactures and runs propaganda stories to continuously demonize Pakistan and brainwash the Indian public into hating Pakistan.

I like the use of the word "nonsense" before you start, so that we know exactly what we can expect from your post. Those statements on Headley have been corroborated by the Indian Home Secretary & as Abir points out, no American official has ever disputed it. The rest of your post is just plain rambling that has no connection to this thread.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I accept the reality although I choose not to post it here since I do not want to cover the lies that our media through under a heap of Indian lies.

Its not about 'covering up' since I in fact point out how the article distorted claims about another Indian general and applied them to Singh, but about putting the issue in context.

He is not a response. He's a devoted bigot who works on a payroll. This is not traumatic events in childhood coming out and affecting you.

Whatever he is, traumatic childhood or not, paid or not, he is in essence a response to the drivel, propaganda, hate and bigotry coming out of the Indian media.

They have theirs, we have ours.

 

[Bang Galore]

Actually there was a report that the US was not pleased with the Indian government allegedly making these claims to the media, because of the terms of Headley's plea agreement.

That would only become an issue if the claims are true and they want to maintain confidentiality. Make up your mind. Are the claims true & the Americans are protesting them being made public or are they false, in which case there would be no connection to any plea agreement.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I like the use of the word "nonsense" before you start, so that we know exactly what we can expect from your post. Those statements on Headley have been corroborated by the Indian Home Secretary & as Abir points out, no American official has ever disputed it. The rest of your post is just plain rambling that has no connection to this thread.

American officials cannot say anything publicly about the allegations because of Headley's plea agreement.

Technically, since the US has not confirmed any of the claims made by the Indians, the Indians are as usual talking out of their rear ends. Let me know when India can actually support those claims with any evidence rather than the typical official GoI flatulence.

And why is none of this so called information in the briefings given to Pakistani officials in wikileaks, or in Headley's deposition?