EDEX 2018: Egypt eyes JF-17 Thunder Block-III

[Genghis khan1]

You want to stay ignorant and blind to facts? ..it is up to you.. All I can do is try to help you open your eye..if you can..

The Israeli writer (Eitan Hever) admits very recently on Maariv pages that Israel did not face Arab armies except in the fourth war of 1973 says:
"For many years we have fought wars (de Lux), where we demonstrated ... mobilizing a fight for a few days, ending in with a swift victory, returning home to father, wife and work.
In the Yom Kippur War, the situation was very different. Preparedness in the army and beyond put pressure on the psyche of soldiers who still find it very difficult to understand the new situation created by the Kppur war. Today we need great efforts in the field of media. Soldiers ask many questions with no answers to them. And most of the answers to them are not true."

General Aharon Yariv, former director of military intelligence, says:
There is no doubt that the Arabs have emerged victorious from the war. As we came out we were crushed and weak

Dr. Amnon Kabiuk in Hamshar newspaper considers that what characterized the Arabs in their goals and their war is that they are more realistic.

Aaron Geva The Jerusalem Newspaper Davar: The Arabs do not give in to force


Israel recognizes the mistakes of its defeat in the October 1973 war

Head of State, Reuven Rivlin

"Voice of Israel" radio, Broadcast the Israeli president's remarks, Roovin Rivlin made on Sunday, he said that during the Yom Kippur War "October 1973" witnessed significant errors within the army and the Israeli leadership, the most important was to underestimate the enemy, "the Egyptian army."

He explained during the military ceremony which was held on Mount Herzl in Jerusalem, that the most important mistakes committed by the army of Israel was excessive vanity and disdain for the capabilities of the enemy and the lack of training and preparation of Israel's soldiers to fight against a strong army.

The Israeli President added, that after 41 years of the October war, we can not forgive or pardon the mistakes we made, and we do not have the time to search for negligence or accusation of the perpetrators of the defeat, but we must draw examples and lessons from the mistakes of the past.

General Sharon said about the third army:
To tell you the truth, we did not know who was surrounding whom

So who are you to contradict these top ranking Usraelis???

And this is The Egyptian armed forces at war and after the end of 1973 Ramadan war
Does it look like a defeated armed forces for you..

These are the IDF soldiers celebrating their escape from the gap.. they are praising Sadat for letting them go and not destroying them right there..

Smaller country doesn’t have to decisively win a war. All they have to do is not lose and It is automatically a win for them.
Arabs failed to decisively Defeat Israel, despite overwhelming large army and population. We can argue reasons and find excuses But fact on ground remains the same. Not only they failed to defeat, Israelis manage to break their will to fight by bribing them with so called economic assistance via western capitals. Much Much cheaper than constantly providing war level protection to Israel.

 

[ARMalik]

NO No NO

do not sell JF17 Block III to Egypt

Egypt will end up having it shot down by the Israelis and it will do a lot of damage to our reputation due to Egyptain incompetence

Only Block II is for sale

I have been to Egypt and love them but sorry

Agreed 110%. Actually I was one of few who raised objection here when this first became news a few months ago. But the problem is "corruption" due to which Pakistan "authorities" will export this to Egypt even if it is against national interests.

 

[PakFactor]

Smaller country doesn’t have to decisively win a war. All they have to do is not lose and It is automatically a win for them.
Arabs failed to decisively Defeat Israel, despite overwhelming large army and population. We can argue reasons and find excuses But fact on ground remains the same. Not only they failed to defeat, Israelis manage to break their will to fight by bribing them with so called economic assistance via western capitals. Much Much cheaper than constantly providing war level protection to Israel.

Bro, it’s useless arguing with him. He brings a few quotes to show they’ve won the war some how. Not realizing the Israeli were in a relaxed posture after defeating Arab armies in previous wars. If their is a mistake according to Israeli investigation it was intelligence gathering on Arab activity. But militarily the Arabs couldn’t holder the upper hand even after a surprise attack, the Israelis were able to quickly mobilize their forces and take the war to the enemies front door.

I can’t find a 3rd party to verify any of his quotes and doesn’t show up in my searches either unless it some Arab news outlet throwing garbage out.

But I can say the Israelis have learned from this lesson, and Ariel Sharon warned his nation this peace agreement is between leaders and not its nation and people.

I have not seen any nation besides Egyptians who celebrate an *** whopping as a victory, so theirs always a first I guess, lol.

With the below I rest my case and done with this useless conversation with a delusional Arab:


Recently, Efraim Halevy, ex-chief of Mossad, likened current intelligence failures to his reflections on the Yom Kippur War:

“There is an inherent understanding in the findings that the shortage of information on the threats—from Islamic terrorism and from Iraq's weapons of mass destruction (WMD)—was at the root of the intelligence breakdown on these two fronts. It seems only logical that the more you know, the safer you are and the greater the chance that you will get things right. Yet Israel's most costly and fateful failure was its mistaken estimate of Egyptian and Syrian intentions, on the eve of the Yom Kippur war in 1973, when the two armies unexpectedly attacked Israel in a bid to regain the territories lost in the 1967 war. At the time, Israel had it all: superior intelligence coverage, excellent human resources with good access, high-level and discreet dialogue with more than one Arab or Muslim leader, and an intelligence-evaluation arm that had provided an early warning several months before the war, thus preventing it from breaking out at that time. But despite all of the above, we got it all wrong. The abundance of information led us to intelligence “hubris”: we trusted our superior analytical prowess rather than ominous indicators on the ground. Naturally, one should not conclude from this that the less you know, the better your judgment. On the other hand, one should understand that, although knowledge is strength, knowledge by itself is no guarantee of safety.”- The Economist, Jul 24, 2004

http://csel.eng.ohio-state.edu/prod...ence Analysis: scenario : Yom Kippur War.html

 

[The SC]

Smaller country doesn’t have to decisively win a war. All they have to do is not lose and It is automatically a win for them.
Arabs failed to decisively Defeat Israel, despite overwhelming large army and population. We can argue reasons and find excuses But fact on ground remains the same. Not only they failed to defeat, Israelis manage to break their will to fight by bribing them with so called economic assistance via western capitals. Much Much cheaper than constantly providing war level protection to Israel.

In reality the Arabs were fighting the whole support of Usrael, not the small country you see..mainly Europe and the US.. So try to defeat that.. at least Egypt got its lands back.. Syria got back its city Kuneitera in The Golan despite the West full backing of Usrael..

Bro, it’s useless arguing with him. He brings a few quotes to show they’ve won the war some how. Not realizing the Israeli were in a relaxed posture after defeating Arab armies in previous wars. If their is a mistake according to Israeli investigation it was intelligence gathering on Arab activity. But militarily the Arabs couldn’t holder the upper hand even after a surprise attack, the Israelis were able to quickly mobilize their forces and take the war to the enemies front door.

I can’t find a 3rd party to verify any of his quotes and doesn’t show up in my searches either unless it some Arab news outlet throwing garbage out.

But I can say the Israelis have learned from this lesson, and Ariel Sharon warned his nation this peace agreement is between leaders and not its nation and people.

I have not seen any nation besides Egyptians who celebrate an *** whopping as a victory, so theirs always a first I guess, lol.

With the below I rest my case and done with this useless conversation with a delusional Arab:


Recently, Efraim Halevy, ex-chief of Mossad, likened current intelligence failures to his reflections on the Yom Kippur War:

“There is an inherent understanding in the findings that the shortage of information on the threats—from Islamic terrorism and from Iraq's weapons of mass destruction (WMD)—was at the root of the intelligence breakdown on these two fronts. It seems only logical that the more you know, the safer you are and the greater the chance that you will get things right. Yet Israel's most costly and fateful failure was its mistaken estimate of Egyptian and Syrian intentions, on the eve of the Yom Kippur war in 1973, when the two armies unexpectedly attacked Israel in a bid to regain the territories lost in the 1967 war. At the time, Israel had it all: superior intelligence coverage, excellent human resources with good access, high-level and discreet dialogue with more than one Arab or Muslim leader, and an intelligence-evaluation arm that had provided an early warning several months before the war, thus preventing it from breaking out at that time. But despite all of the above, we got it all wrong. The abundance of information led us to intelligence “hubris”: we trusted our superior analytical prowess rather than ominous indicators on the ground. Naturally, one should not conclude from this that the less you know, the better your judgment. On the other hand, one should understand that, although knowledge is strength, knowledge by itself is no guarantee of safety.”- The Economist, Jul 24, 2004

http://csel.eng.ohio-state.edu/productions/intel/oldeintel/Intelligence Analysis: scenario : Yom Kippur War.html

Well Mr delusional, you are just proving it with your contradictions in the same post..Go play with dome kids somewhere and never tackle a subject you have no knowledge about..All you have being doing is contradicting yourself in each and every post.. so go troll kids somewhere else..

 

[PakFactor]

In reality the Arabs were fighting the whole support of Usrael, not the small country you see..mainly Europe and the US.. So try to defeat that.. at least Egypt got its lands back.. Syria got back its city Kuneitera in The Golan despite the West full backing of Usrael..


Well Mr delusional, you are just proving it with your contradictions in the same post..Go play with dome kids somewhere and never tackle a subject you have no knowledge about..All you have being doing is contradicting yourself in each and every post.. so go troll kids somewhere else..

LOL! Not once have you posted anything of substance to back yourself as to how you won this war. Your only success was the initial surprise due to gaps in Israeli intelligence about ground activity and build up, but you failed to build up from their. Your own dismissed Cheif of Staff who led the Egyptian Army during the 1973 War said their was no victory in the end.

If theirs anyone delusional it’s you.

About those dome kids who whooped your asses, I would rather be with them than a dumb Arab like you or your race.

Your own dismissed Chief of Staff Saad El-Shazly maintains in his book The Crossing of the Suez (till this day still banned in Egypt). Sadat's plan's of advancing forward Oct 14 without air cover sealed Egypt's faith in that war.

@StormBreaker you want to learn about the war and who won read this CIA Report which I did and it’s a good analysis of this war:

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/1975-09-01A.pdf

@StormBreaker

This article is written by an Egyptian Professor at The American University of Cairo:

What Did the Arabs Really Win in the 1973 War With Israel?

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/what-did-the-arabs-really_b_751263

Below is one excerpt from the article:

"By the time of an Oct. 22 ceasefire, Israeli forces were on the outskirts of Ismailia. On Oct. 23, the Israelis surrounded the Egyptian Third Army, which Shazly claimed was on the verge of collapse.

Although Egypt agreed to the ceasefire, the Israelis continued to shell and air raid the surrounded Third Army.

When disengagement began on Oct. 28, the Egyptians were so desperate to resupply their Third Army with food that they hinted at the possibility of unprecedented direct talks with the Israelis.

Arabs today point at that conflict as testament to their unity and claim the military gains prove that they are not powerless.

Arab states that did not send military forces in time for the conflict contributed in materiel and funds; Libya, among others, gave Egypt $1 billion to procure armaments.

But initial gains can never accurately predict how the rest of the war will be waged.

By Oct. 24, the Israeli Army was 80 km. from Cairo and 40 km. from Damascus.

Egyptian nationalists say the return of the Sinai was the goal and that they achieved that through negotiations and the 1978 Camp David Peace Accords. However, they could not have achieved even the initial military gains had Israel not been occupied with the Syrians in the strategically more important Golan theater."

Furthermore, the Camp David Peace Accords alienated Egypt for a decade, broke Arab unity and effectively shackled Cairo to a series of international agreements and protocols it can never violate for fear of losing billions of dollars in US economic and military aid.

@The SC

This will be my last post as you have nothing of substance to post to back up your claims of winning this war -- the more I think about it I feel sorry for your kind, as I've not seen a much more useless race on this earth than yours.

 

[The SC]

LOL! Not once have you posted anything of substance to back yourself as to how you won this war. Your only success was the initial surprise due to gaps in Israeli intelligence about ground activity and build up, but you failed to build up from their. Your own dismissed Cheif of Staff who led the Egyptian Army during the 1973 War said their was no victory in the end.

If theirs anyone delusional it’s you.

About those dome kids who whooped your asses, I would rather be with them than a dumb Arab like you or your race.

Your own dismissed Chief of Staff Saad El-Shazly maintains in his book The Crossing of the Suez (till this day still banned in Egypt). Sadat's plan's of advancing forward Oct 14 without air cover sealed Egypt's faith in that war.

@StormBreaker you want to learn about the war and who won read this CIA Report which I did and it’s a good analysis of this war:

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/1975-09-01A.pdf

@StormBreaker

This article is written by an Egyptian Professor at The American University of Cairo:

What Did the Arabs Really Win in the 1973 War With Israel?

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/what-did-the-arabs-really_b_751263

Below is one excerpt from the article:

"By the time of an Oct. 22 ceasefire, Israeli forces were on the outskirts of Ismailia. On Oct. 23, the Israelis surrounded the Egyptian Third Army, which Shazly claimed was on the verge of collapse.

Although Egypt agreed to the ceasefire, the Israelis continued to shell and air raid the surrounded Third Army.

When disengagement began on Oct. 28, the Egyptians were so desperate to resupply their Third Army with food that they hinted at the possibility of unprecedented direct talks with the Israelis.

Arabs today point at that conflict as testament to their unity and claim the military gains prove that they are not powerless.

Arab states that did not send military forces in time for the conflict contributed in materiel and funds; Libya, among others, gave Egypt $1 billion to procure armaments.

But initial gains can never accurately predict how the rest of the war will be waged.

By Oct. 24, the Israeli Army was 80 km. from Cairo and 40 km. from Damascus.

Egyptian nationalists say the return of the Sinai was the goal and that they achieved that through negotiations and the 1978 Camp David Peace Accords. However, they could not have achieved even the initial military gains had Israel not been occupied with the Syrians in the strategically more important Golan theater."

Furthermore, the Camp David Peace Accords alienated Egypt for a decade, broke Arab unity and effectively shackled Cairo to a series of international agreements and protocols it can never violate for fear of losing billions of dollars in US economic and military aid.

@The SC

This will be my last post as you have nothing of substance to post to back up your claims of winning this war -- the more I think about it I feel sorry for your kind, as I've not seen a much more useless race on this earth than yours.

You must be very sick about an Arab victory..one of thousands like it throughout history..
All my posts are facts backed with solid sources.. you are stating mostly your opinion and talking about things you have no idea about..
Better be your last post..as you seem to be talking to yourself in a mirror..

 

[SD 10]

Why do you cry from Egypt we are not enemies

You long years want to force us to buy this tea that your country produce

Egypt not force your country for example to buy M1a1 tank for example

go to your friend Turkish to purchase JF - 17

As for Egypt to buy from you, or Egypt becomes an underdeveloped country, and Egypt is an enemy country, and you must spread hatred and reduce it

Oh this Egypt exists thousands of years before Pakistan called it
Also, Pakistan will end and Egypt will remain as it is we who write history

Egypt fought more than 900 wars, most of which were victorious and defeated in 12 war only

And why do you want to force us into a worst fourth-generation fighter that exists

Do pyramids cause you a problem or because you have no history and nothing

Try to be more gentle and smarter





Why do you cry from Egypt we are not enemies

You long years want to force us to buy this tea that your country produce

Egypt not force your country for example to buy M1a1 tank for example

go to your friend Turkish to purchase JF - 17

As for Egypt to buy from you, or Egypt becomes an underdeveloped country, and Egypt is an enemy country, and you must spread hatred and reduce it

Oh this Egypt exists thousands of years before Pakistan called it
Also, Pakistan will end and Egypt will remain as it is we who write history

Egypt fought more than 900 wars, most of which were victorious and defeated in 12 war only

And why do you want to force us into a worst fourth-generation fighter that exists

Do pyramids cause you a problem or because you have no history and nothing

Try to be more gentle and smarter

wtf did you just wrote? Brain farts?

 

[PakFactor]

You must be very sick about an Arab victory..one of thousands like it throughout history..
All my posts are facts backed with solid sources.. you are stating mostly your opinion and talking about things you have no idea about..
Better be your last post..as you seem to be talking to yourself in a mirror..

You very own Chief of Staff Saad El-Shazly who lead the Egyptian Military in 1973 and was the chief architect maintains in his book The Crossing of the Suez; you lost the war. LOL

But if it helps you sleep well at night by all means Egypt won 1973 took over Israel and established a Palestinian homeland. And after every Jummah they have a falafel party in Palestine.

 

[The SC]

You very own Chief of Staff Saad El-Shazly who lead the Egyptian Military in 1973 and was the chief architect maintains in his book The Crossing of the Suez; you lost the war. LOL

But if it helps you sleep well at night by all means Egypt won 1973 took over Israel and established a Palestinian homeland.

Come fight the US if you can..what Usrael..
Chazly was a brilliant tactical mind.. but no strategist like Sadat.. there is always diplomacy first ..the war is the extension of it if it fails.. Hence go find why this war has happened in the first place and see how many times Egypt asked Usrael to negotiate before the war, but it was always negative.. So call it what you want.. it was a victory on all fronts.. not only the IDF was defeated on the ground but the whole state of Usrael backed by the US lost diplomatically as it was forced to negotiate.... if you don't understand what is a victory then go educate yourself about it..

 

[Trango Towers]

You want to stay ignorant and blind to facts? ..it is up to you.. All I can do is try to help you open your eye..if you can..

The Israeli writer (Eitan Hever) admits very recently on Maariv pages that Israel did not face Arab armies except in the fourth war of 1973 says:
"For many years we have fought wars (de Lux), where we demonstrated ... mobilizing a fight for a few days, ending in with a swift victory, returning home to father, wife and work.
In the Yom Kippur War, the situation was very different. Preparedness in the army and beyond put pressure on the psyche of soldiers who still find it very difficult to understand the new situation created by the Kppur war. Today we need great efforts in the field of media. Soldiers ask many questions with no answers to them. And most of the answers to them are not true."

General Aharon Yariv, former director of military intelligence, says:
There is no doubt that the Arabs have emerged victorious from the war. As we came out we were crushed and weak

Dr. Amnon Kabiuk in Hamshar newspaper considers that what characterized the Arabs in their goals and their war is that they are more realistic.

Aaron Geva The Jerusalem Newspaper Davar: The Arabs do not give in to force


Israel recognizes the mistakes of its defeat in the October 1973 war

Head of State, Reuven Rivlin

"Voice of Israel" radio, Broadcast the Israeli president's remarks, Roovin Rivlin made on Sunday, he said that during the Yom Kippur War "October 1973" witnessed significant errors within the army and the Israeli leadership, the most important was to underestimate the enemy, "the Egyptian army."

He explained during the military ceremony which was held on Mount Herzl in Jerusalem, that the most important mistakes committed by the army of Israel was excessive vanity and disdain for the capabilities of the enemy and the lack of training and preparation of Israel's soldiers to fight against a strong army.

The Israeli President added, that after 41 years of the October war, we can not forgive or pardon the mistakes we made, and we do not have the time to search for negligence or accusation of the perpetrators of the defeat, but we must draw examples and lessons from the mistakes of the past.

General Sharon said about the third army:
To tell you the truth, we did not know who was surrounding whom

So who are you to contradict these top ranking Usraelis???

And this is The Egyptian armed forces at war and after the end of 1973 Ramadan war
Does it look like a defeated armed forces for you..

These are the IDF soldiers celebrating their escape from the gap.. they are praising Sadat for letting them go and not destroying them right there..

Ground check...before ww2...no Israeli. It was palestine.
After ww2 israel became a nation on arab land.

Reality check. Arab land is under israel...

Rest of what you say is bull..

Have a nice day

 

[Amun]

Ground check...before ww2...no Israeli. It was palestine.
After ww2 israel became a nation on arab land.

Reality check. Arab land is under israel...

Rest of what you say is bull..

Have a nice day

Do you see the logic...?! @BATMAN @StormBreaker @The SC do you guys see the logic here....?!

he can’t differentiate between Arab countries....!!

I wonder, why people with such a shallow knowledge about something..... giving their opinions...!?

 

[StormBreaker]

Do you see the logic...?! @BATMAN @StormBreaker @The SC do you guys see the logic here....?!

he can’t differentiate between Arab countries....!!

I wonder, why people with such a shallow knowledge about something..... giving their opinions...!?

I believe his concept was that Palestine was An Arab land but now that it is forcefully occupied, so he means to say that “An Arab land (Palestine) is under Israel”

BTW Bro, You should consider participating more, There is a lack of Arabs on the forum, Always fascinating to see Arabs talk amongst...

 

[Genghis khan1]

In reality the Arabs were fighting the whole support of Usrael, not the small country you see..mainly Europe and the US.. So try to defeat that.. at least Egypt got its lands back.. Syria got back its city Kuneitera in The Golan despite the West full backing of Usrael..


Well Mr delusional, you are just proving it with your contradictions in the same post..Go play with dome kids somewhere and never tackle a subject you have no knowledge about..All you have being doing is contradicting yourself in each and every post.. so go troll kids somewhere else..

Isreal is just 10 miles across into ocean from its narrow point. No Western country took active combat involvement into war. So Arabs weren’t fighting anyone else. Arabs were armed to teeth by Soviets , the same way Isreal was supported by US.

After the war, Isreal came out on top and Arabs Neighbour compromised their stance and signed peace treaties for aid.

There is a reason, every country consider Arabs peninsula a walkover. At a mercy of any aggressor.

 

[Amun]

I believe his concept was that Palestine was An Arab land but now that it is forcefully occupied, so he means to say that “An Arab land (Palestine) is under Israel”

BTW Bro, You should consider participating more, There is a lack of Arabs on the forum, Always fascinating to see Arabs talk amongst...

yes ..... but Alquds is not Arab thing ..... Alquds and Alaqsa Mosque is a Muslim thing ... and throughout the history we have defended it as Arabs and as Egyptians .....
remember who ...
- opened Alquds and spreaded justice in it .... Muslim Arabs of Arabia..
- Who stopped the Mongols from destroying Alquds / Mecca / Medina .in Ainjalut battle..Egyptians ( Arabs) ..
- Who Defeated the Crusaders and returned Alquds back to Muslims after 88 years of occupation .... Egyptian- Muslims army ( Arabs) led by Salaheldin .

- Who protected Mecca and Medina from Portuguese invaders ..... Egyptians ( Arabs).
- Who fought Israel many wars to return Alquds ..... Arabs.

Now you see .... this is a war of thousands of years ... Israel presence is a lost battle ..... but one day the war will continue till we win it inshaaallah we believe in that .... ....

now who do you think will fight the next war ...... Turks of NATO ...?! that Pakistani keyboard warrior....?! ( no offense) A BIG NOOOOO .... it will be also ARABS .


as for participating in PDF .... I will try brother but as you see we are not welcomed from Turks and Turks loving Pakistanis

 

[Aspen]

I hope some day they buy it. Orders from countries like Egypt are exactly what is needed to prove to the world that JF-17 Block III is as good as any 4th gen fighter out there.