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DULMIAL, PAKISTAN – The Village with the Gun

Er.. they went to fight for an enemy occupying their country..?:unsure:
What if your next generation fight for UK ?I am supposing you are UK citizen...correct me if i am wrong ..Blaming those people its easy thing to do..It was there sacrifice that made there village to be surface on map and there next generation is now serving PA
 
What if your next generation fight for UK ?I am supposing you are UK citizen...correct me if i am wrong ..Blaming those people its easy thing to do..It was there sacrifice that made there village to be surface on map and there next generation is now serving PA

Next generation? I hope this generation fight for the UK.

There is a difference of us living here by choice and are part of the community, and those villagers who were invaded and occupied by a foreign power.
 
Next generation? I hope this generation fight for the UK.

There is a difference of us living here by choice and are part of the community, and those villagers who were invaded and occupied by a foreign power.
Who was Invader to them ? Sikhs ruling before Englishmen ? or Mughals ? or Gori ? where do you want to put the full stop....
At-least they died and buried in there land..What do you think they were not "Offered" to settled in UK at that time ? Difference is they "choose" there land ..
while you are clearly .............sitting in "Darul kufar" and passing remarks about them..Sorry for being straight forward if you don't like the choice of words
 
I hope this generation fight for the UK.
and buried in UK?

Good for you angrez now please stop talking about our land and our people ;)

There is a difference of us living here by choice and are part of the community, and those villagers who were invaded and occupied by a foreign power.
By choice or not fact of the matter is this lot died for this land is burried on this land...None of your business now isnt it? Coz you and your descents will fight for UK and if UK wages a war on Pakistan these lot will be against you and your descendants ...So agrez wanna be...Keep to your own and we keep to ours!

:raise: @waz bro merge thread please!
 
This is a problem of mindset. If a people invade your land, you fight against them, not for them. I simply don't understand this, obviously you're happy with this.

As for the UK waging war against Pakistan, they already have. It was called British India. And the people of that village decided to fight for the British.

Any way, you have your mindset and I have mine. I suggest you argue the point and lay off the abuse or I will reply in kind.
 
Er.. they went to fight for an enemy occupying their country..?:unsure:

Not only fighting for the country who was occupying thier country, but was also fighting the Khalifa of the Muslims.

Anything for a penny though. They might be heroes to those they left behind but I have no respect for them.
 
Not only fighting for the country who was occupying thier country, but was also fighting the Khalifa of the Muslims.

Anything for a penny though. They might be heroes to those they left behind but I have no respect for them.

At last a man with my mindset. It was getting lonely here.:sarcastic:
 
Some posters really need to look into history here!!
Just where do you think the Pakistani army came from, thin air! The men who put together the Pakistani army at the birth of the nation ALL served in the British Indian Army. Pakistan was one of the very countries that at its birth, it had a large standing army ready to serve and protect it.
The men who served learned invaluable skills on the battlefield, including command and control structures, army logistics, infantry/armoured manoeuvres, operation and maintenance of field equipment and weapons and I can go on for ages.
They also had also tested their skills in live combat against two of the most formidable enemies the world has known i.e. the Japanese Imperial Army and the German Wehrmacht. It's with these skills they came to secure the freedom of Pakistan, the Empire knew this at the time and so did the founder of Pakistan Muhammad Ali Jinnah, and they left. Jinnah (May Allah's mercy be upon him) played our hand and supported the war;

The Muslim League Leaders fully exploited the war situation. Under encouragement during the war crisis Mr. Jinnah by making profound promises of Muslim aid in the war effort,

Addressing to the 31st session of the Muslim League at Karachi in December 1943 Jinnah proclaimed: “We have time and again made it clear- we have offered our hand of co-operation for the job or work that Lord Wavell (new Viceroy) wants to do,


http://www.iosrjournals.org/iosr-jhss/papers/Vol. 22 Issue7/Version-16/A22070160104.pdf

So people have an issue with Jinnah(ra)?


When partition happened Pakistan received its army, an army that was able to;
-Help evacuate and resettle partition refugees.
-Secure Pakistan's borders.
-Put down rebellions.
-Provide security on the streets in the absence of a police force.
-Secure Kashmir.


It's that last point regrading securing Kashmir that I will bring in my personal experience. My grandfather (1st Punjab) and my entire elder generation fought in the British Indian Army. It was these men who came back and then destroyed the Dogra army occupying Azad Kashmir and then charged towards Srinager, and contrary to the myth that is still put out here, no the tribal folk did not free Azad Kashmir, it was cleared out by the AKRF, as it was known back then. The tribals joined the fight when what is now Indian occupied Kashmir was attacked.

Let's just say that the people calling for Pakistan just sat back and decided not to be 'slaves' or any other stupid term you want to use, been right good little babus and listened to what Congress said and boycotted the war and kept our men at home. Do you honestly think there would have been a Pakistan? The Indian army would have steam rolled what is now Pakistan Punjab, Sind , Azad Kashmir and might have come stuck in Balochistan and of course Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, which they would then occupy. They would have burned every village, town, city. Massacred anyone that called for Pakistan and indulged in mass rape of all our women.

Oh this might not have happened? I beg you tell me, just how would they have been stopped? They would have had a professional, battle hardened army, where at most Pakistan's people would face them with militias.

Look what happened to Hyderabad, they wanted Pakistan and they were invaded, heck they even had an armed force, which being weak was pushed aside. So what followed? Massacres of civilians, including children. Burning of mosques, the mass rape of women, some Indian army troops took several Muslim women each night to 'entertain' them. Read it up.

Anyway the bottom line is that had our men not served Pakistan would have never happened. I can't think of any occasion where the old saying that 'each cloud has a silver lining' is more appropriate than in this situation.
Allah bless the veterans of the Second World War, our elders and the protectors of Pakistan.

@DESERT FIGHTER
@Irfan Baloch
 
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At last a man with my mindset. It was getting lonely here.:sarcastic:

People talk about embracing history and the past. I don't know why. Not all of the past is glorious and should be beloved. The only thing you should always do is learn from the past.

The Chinese call thier time of colonisation the century of shame. That shame has driven them to the peak of society. Meanwhile we sit there talking about the railways and palaces empire left behind and how our brethren fought valiantly alongside thier occupiers.

If we acknowledged the shame we could them use it as motivation, unfortunately we're too arrogant to see the defeats of the past for what they were.

Some posters really need to look into history here!!
Just where do you think the Pakistani army came from, thin air! The men who put together the Pakistani army at the birth of the nation ALL served in the British Indian Army. Pakistan was one of the very countries that at its birth, it had a large standing army ready to serve and protect it.
The men who served learned invaluable skills on the battlefield, including command and control structures, army logistics, infantry/armoured manoeuvres, operation and maintenance of field equipment and weapons and I can go on for ages.
They also had also tested their skills in live combat against two of the most formidable enemies the world has known i.e. the Japanese Imperial Army and the German Wehrmacht. It's with these skills they came to secure the freedom of Pakistan, the Empire knew this at the time and so did the founder of Pakistan Muhammad Ali Jinnah, and they left. Jinnah (May Allah's mercy be upon him) played our hand and supported the war;

The Muslim League Leaders fully exploited the war situation. Under encouragement during the war crisis Mr. Jinnah by making profound promises of Muslim aid in the war effort,

Addressing to the 31st session of the Muslim League at Karachi in December 1943 Jinnah proclaimed: “We have time and again made it clear- we have offered our hand of co-operation for the job or work that Lord Wavell (new Viceroy) wants to do,


http://www.iosrjournals.org/iosr-jhss/papers/Vol. 22 Issue7/Version-16/A22070160104.pdf

So people have an issue with Jinnah(ra)?


When partition happened Pakistan received its army, an army that was able to;
-Help evacuate and resettle partition refugees.
-Secure Pakistan's borders.
-Put down rebellions.
-Provide security on the streets in the absence of a police force.
-Secure Kashmir.


It's that last point regrading securing Kashmir that I will bring in my personal experience. My grandfather (1st Punjab) and my entire elder generation fought in the British Indian Army. It was these men who came back and then destroyed the Dogra army occupying Azad Kashmir and then charged towards Srinager, and contrary to the myth that is still put out here, no the tribal folk did not free Azad Kashmir, it was cleared out by the AKRF, as it was known back then. The tribals joined the fight when what is now Indian occupied Kashmir was attacked.

Let's just say that the people calling for Pakistan just sat back and decided not to be 'slaves' or any other stupid term you want to use, been right good little babus and listened to what Congress said and boycotted the war and kept our men at home. Do you honestly think there would have been a Pakistan? The Indian army would have steam rolled what is now PakistanPunjab, Sind , Azad Kashmir and might have come stuck in Balochistan and of course Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, which would then occupy. They would have burned every village, town, city. Massacred anyone that called for Pakistan and indulged in mass rape of all our women.

Oh this might not have happened? I beg you tell me, just how would they have been stopped? They would have had a professional, battle hardened army, where at most Pakistan's people would face them with militias.

Look what happened to Hyderabad, they wanted Pakistan and they were invaded, heck they even had an armed force, which being weak was pushed aside. So what followed? Massacres of civilians, including children. Burning of mosques, the mass rape of women, some Indian army troops took several Muslim women each night to 'entertain' them. Read it up.

Anyway the bottom line is that had our men not served Pakistan would have never happened. I can't think of any occasion where the old saying that 'each cloud has a silver lining' is more appropriate than in this situation.
Allah bless the veterans of the Second World War, our elders and the protectors of Pakistan.

Man lives and dies by his mistakes. Had we followed the sunna and each man maintained physical preperation and equipment for jihad, then maybe they would have had a better option.

We should recognise the sacrifices our elders gave for our nation and accept the desperate route they had to take to attain the means to do it. However let's not glorify the hodge podge of mistakes that was our colonial past.
 
Man lives and dies by his mistakes. Had we followed the sunna and each man maintained physical preperation and equipment for jihad, then maybe they would have had a better option.

We should recognise the sacrifices our elders gave for our nation and accept the desperate route they had to take to attain the means to do it. However let's not glorify the hodge podge of mistakes that was our colonial past.

We can all say about the ideal i.e. following the Sunnah, but would you rely on that? I agree we should honour them but I'm sorry it fills me with pride at how hard our men fought in the greatest fields of battle in history, regardless of what flag they fought for, because the ends justified the means.
Without them there would have been no Pakistan.
 
The Chinese call thier time of colonisation the century of shame.
I am not sure if all Chinese do that...Japanese do that for their take in WW HOWEVER, put up 1 statue of comfort woman and then see their reactions!

If we acknowledged the shame we could them use it as motivation, unfortunately we're too arrogant to see the defeats of the past for what they were.
There is actually no shame in surviving!

Man lives and dies by his mistakes. Had we followed the sunna and each man maintained physical preperation and equipment for jihad, then maybe they would have had a better option.
We were living under Hindus! Did you somehow forgot history?

However let's not glorify the hodge podge of mistakes that was our colonial past.
People the thread is to appreciate a whole village that sent EVERY of their men (MOST maybe) for war!
 
People the thread is to appreciate a whole village that sent EVERY of their men (MOST maybe) for war!

You're right, we shouldn't derail it. Its easy to talk today with a nation to call home. These men were not alive to fight the battles when home was lost (fall of the mug hals) but they fought the battles to preserve it when it was reclaimed.
 
We can all say about the ideal i.e. following the Sunnah, but would you rely on that? I agree we should honour them but I'm sorry it fills me with pride at how hard our men fought in the greatest fields of battle in history, regardless of what flag they fought for, because the ends justified the means.
Without them there would have been no Pakistan.
Bro how did we get derailed? :unsure: Thread is about a village and their proud ancestors! My people! I dont care what foreigners (British Pakistanis) think or want to think!

@313ghazi @jamal18
I am sorry, but one sitting in UK enjoying welfare state with laws cant talk about my land and about a time that he never saw or heard about!

Let alone about struggling families! Leave them to be happy about something! if it pride of being a brave soldier....so be it!

As for who they fought...THAT is not in our hands nor was in theirs! People can NOW sit and dictate what is "right" and "wrong" back then it was survival and that training and pride till date resonates that village kindly stop trying to take the little happiness from people like a bully!

You're right, we shouldn't derail it. Its easy to talk today with a nation to call home. These men were not alive to fight the battles when home was lost (fall of the mug hals) but they fought the battles to preserve it when it was reclaimed.
Ok you said it better :D

@waz bro kindly merge this thread with https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/dulmial-pakistan-the-village-with-the-gun.424389/
 

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