Dr Afia Siddiqui "The Grey Ghost Lady of Bagram"

[roadrunner]

Maqsad,
Where does it say there's even one iota of proof that either the son of Musharraf OR Musharraf has taken any money for this alleged "wailing grey lady", who noone, not even her, has provided any evidence about her whereabouts the last 5 years?

 

[maqsad]

I don't know roadrunner all I know is someone testified that Bilal Musharaff took the money and I have Parvaiz Musharaff's book "In the line of fire" right in front of me where he brags on the back cover about bounty being collected for handing over suspects to American govt agencies. So if someone brags about doing something to hundreds of others it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination he could do this to Aafia Sidiqui.

Aafia Sidiqui is an icon and a representative of all the other potential victims whose rights were violated. Nothing special about her except she allegedly went though infinately more torture than some of the luckier ones.

 

[roadrunner]

I don't know roadrunner all I know is someone testified that Bilal Musharaff took the money and I have Parvaiz Musharaff's book "In the line of fire" right in front of me where he brags on the back cover about bounty being collected for handing over suspects to American govt agencies. So if someone brags about doing something to hundreds of others it is not too much of a stretch of the imagination he could do this to Aafia Sidiqui.

Aafia Sidiqui is an icon and a representative of all the other potential victims whose rights were violated. Nothing special about her except she allegedly went though infinately more torture than some of the luckier ones.

I havent read his book, so can't comment on it. However, I have read that bounty money does not go to the government.

“That is my error. It doesn’t come to government of Pakistan. I should not have written that and I’m going to amend it in the future copy certainly,” he told journalists in New York on Sept 27.
Musharraf amends ‘bounty’ portion: Urdu translation of autobiography -DAWN - Top Stories; October 23, 2006

This is very normal. When you put up bounty money, you do so in return for information of the whereabouts of people. The money is then used to pay off informants. So the CIA would be giving this money to Pakistan, who will then be paying off informants. What is wrong with that, so long as Musharraf is not pocketing the money (and he denies he pocketed any of the money).

As for Aafia Siddiqui, there's no evidence she was held in Bagram as yet over the last 5 years. There's no evidence of torture yet either. Why is she symbolic of the other tortured prisoners? Many of them had absolutely nothing to do with any money trail of diamonds in Liberia and were simply picked off the streets of Kabul by the Northern Alliance.

 

[ejaz007]

Yet more humiliation in store for Dr Aafia

Pakistani scientist being subjected to ‘strip search’ if she meets attorney or relative
Monday, August 11, 2008
By Usman Manzoor

ISLAMABAD: After passing five years in detention, reportedly at the Bagram Airbase in Afghanistan, the ill-fated Pakistani woman, Dr Aafia Siddiqui, would be again subjected to continuous humiliation at the Metropolitan Detention Centre (MDC) in Brooklyn, New York, in the name of 'strip search'.

According to the attorney of the detained Pakistani doctor, strip checking amounts to searching the body of a naked prisoner so as to check that the prisoner has not hidden anything in his or her body.

Though the American government has allowed two attorneys of Dr Aafia Siddiqui to meet her in the detention centre, the authorities are stressing for her strip search every time she would meet her attorneys, Pakistani diplomats or her family members as and when allowed.

A letter written by Dr Aafia's counsel, Elaine Whitfield Sharp, on behalf of the detained Pakistani woman, to Husain Haqqani, the Ambassador of Pakistan to the US, reveals that the Americans have stressed the need for strip search of Dr Aafia every time she would meet some one but the Muslim lady from Pakistan has refused to undergo such humiliation.

Dr Aafia's counsel wrote to Husain Haqqani that, "I write to you on behalf of Aafia Siddiqui, PhD, a 36-year-old Muslim woman and Pakistani citizen, who is in pre-trial detention at the Metropolitan Detention Center (MDC) in Brooklyn, New York. Dr Siddiqui is not allowed by the Federal Bureau of Prisons (BoP) to have contact visits, that is, she is not allowed to come into physical contact with anyone."

"Despite this, the BoP and staff at the MDC are insisting that Dr Siddiqui endure the humiliation of a so-called 'strip search' each and every time one of her lawyers come to visit her for purposes of defending her in the United States District Court on criminal charges."

The lawyer described the strip search: "The inmate is required to be stripped naked and checked to find he/she is not hiding anything on his/her body." "I think you will agree that this type of strip search is not only humiliating and degrading but is also offensive to a woman who is a devout Muslim, as is Dr Siddiqui."

The counsel on behalf of the detained doctor wrote, "Because it is so offensive, Dr Siddiqui is now refusing to undergo this 'procedure' and because she will no longer consent, she is now forbidden from having a contact visit with her attorneys."

Elaine Whitfield mentioned that on August 8, Gideon Oliver, Esquire, who is working with Attorney Elizabeth Fink, and she herself, went to the detention centre to visit Dr Aafia but could not gain access to their client for an attorney-client visit. "In addition, neither you (Husain Haqqani) nor any representative of the Pakistani government will be permitted to visit Dr Siddiqui to perform your diplomatic duties so long as she will not consent to a strip search."

The lawyer suggested to the ambassador: "I write to you to implore that you demand, in the strongest terms, that the United States government Bureau of Prisons and Metropolitan Detention Centre employees cease and desist the practice of strip searching Dr Siddiqui which, in her case, is totally unnecessary because she is not allowed to have contact visits with her attorneys, or anyone else, anyway. Dr Siddiqui has been through a horrendous time and this is adding to the colossal emotional distress already inflicted on her by the United States in Afghanistan for five years and in Pakistan when she was abducted in 2003."

Yet more humiliation in store for Dr Aafia

 

[maqsad]

I havent read his book, so can't comment on it. However, I have read that bounty money does not go to the government.

“That is my error. It doesn’t come to government of Pakistan. I should not have written that and I’m going to amend it in the future copy certainly,” he told journalists in New York on Sept 27.
Musharraf amends ‘bounty’ portion: Urdu translation of autobiography -DAWN - Top Stories; October 23, 2006

OK? I never said the bounty money goes to the government coffers, did I? I quoted Musharaff from the back cover of his book which brags that

"We have captured 672 and handed over 369 to the United States. We have earned bounties totaling millions of dollars..."

This is the book I am looking at right now and quoting him from. Your dawn link refers to a correction he made in an earlier edition which I know nothing of. Bilal Musharaff is a private civilian and thus would be eligible for bounty payments. Technically this is possible, don't know if it is true hence my use of the word IF. It certainly is plausable based on what Parvaiz Musharaff himself admits in his book. At the very least we have established that Parvaiz Musharaff is definately very proud and boisterous about picking up and selling "wanted" people from Pakistani soil to American officials. If Bilal Musharaff somehow exploited cronyism to become the recipient of CIA reward money I don't know...like I said it is an accusation by someone else and may be true or it may be false but it is most certainly plausible.

This is very normal. When you put up bounty money, you do so in return for information of the whereabouts of people. The money is then used to pay off informants. So the CIA would be giving this money to Pakistan, who will then be paying off informants. What is wrong with that, so long as Musharraf is not pocketing the money (and he denies he pocketed any of the money).

Yes I know how it works, someone rats out a high value target and becomes the eventual recipient of a few thousand dollars or more. If everything goes well that is.

Now at first glance this sounds good to every single westerner, most of whom don't give a damn about civil liberties in Pakistan. It even looks good to middle class educated liberal Pakistanis in the diaspora and in Pakistan itself, most of whom don't give a damn about anything as long as they can exist in their bubble world. The problems start if you look at things critically after hearing about horror stories concerning innocent people being tortured in Bagram and Gitmo. Some of these people are very obviously being tortured for the purpose of obtaining false confessions! Many of these torture victims are guilty of some crime or another but some have been tortured to extract false confessions. Others have been rumored to be tortured and brainwashed into becoming terrorists against pakistan itself!

So giving some plausability to the above scenarios one wonders, hey are there any safeguards to prevent these situations. Any checks and balances to prevent corruption and overzealousness? In a properly functioning society, be it a democracy, republic or junta there should be a system to weed out the good from the bad BEFORE people are handed over after being apprehended. That system was very obviously not present during Mushy rule and potentially innocent victims were being handed over to psychopathic CIA operatives to be tortured.

As for Aafia Siddiqui, there's no evidence she was held in Bagram as yet over the last 5 years. There's no evidence of torture yet either. Why is she symbolic of the other tortured prisoners? Many of them had absolutely nothing to do with any money trail of diamonds in Liberia and were simply picked off the streets of Kabul by the Northern Alliance.

I am speaking of the past and potential victims within Pakistan and of Pakistani origin. You know, the people whose life and liberty their govt is supposed to guard and protect, whose interests it is supposed to work for? Ayesha Siddiqui is a symbolic icon of these potential victims that the government of pakistan seems impotent in protecting and complicit in abusing. If I am not mistaken there are supposed to be extradition laws to provide Pakistanis with some protection, some Habeus Corpus before being thrown into a dungeon where they torture, rape, humiliate and dissapear the unfortunate.

 

[opinion786]

=maqsad;182501]"We have captured 672 and handed over 369 to the United States. We have earned bounties totaling millions of dollars..."

I have also read the book. Why didn't Musharraf hand over 672 people over to USA? Why only 369 ? Did you ever wonder?

These 369 were FOREIGNERS i.e Tajiks, Uzbeks, Chechans, Afghans, Arabs etc. These illegal immigrants were over-staying in pakistani mountains PASSPORT free!

The people who were NOT handed over were Pakistanis.

This is the book I am looking at right now and quoting him from. Your dawn link refers to a correction he made in an earlier edition which I know nothing of.

The book in Urdu has been corrected.

Bilal Musharaff is a private civilian and thus would be eligible for bounty payments.

This story above is 3rd class rumor without concrete evidence. Yellow journalism.

Parvaiz Musharaff himself admits in his book. At the very least we have established that Parvaiz Musharaff is definately very proud and boisterous about picking up and selling "wanted" people from Pakistani soil to American officials.

These wanted people (foreigners) had no right to stay passpot free in NWFP mountains and try to implement shariat in Swat. How was it that Abdullah Mehsud got freed from Guantanamo Bay and came to fight a Jihad in NWFP against PAK army?

Every single foreigner should be kicked out - I'm proud too!

Ayesha Siddiqui is a symbolic icon of these potential victims that the government of pakistan seems impotent in protecting and complicit in abusing.

An excellent factual refuttal to Ayesha Siddiqa is coming soon. I'll post it.

 

[opinion786]

And, for those that are mistaken, thinking & believing that such extraditions took place only now during musharraf .... should refresh the memories of Aimal Kansi and Yusuf Ramzi... and hundreds of those that were handed over in 1980's war in Afghanistan.

 

[maqsad]

I have also read the book. Why didn't Musharraf hand over 672 people over to USA? Why only 369 ? Did you ever wonder?

These 369 were FOREIGNERS i.e Tajiks, Uzbeks, Chechans, Afghans, Arabs etc. These illegal immigrants were over-staying in pakistani mountains PASSPORT free!

The people who were NOT handed over were Pakistanis.

Hold on, are you telling me that no Pakistanis were handed over to the US? Just a 10 second random search came up with this link which says 11 pakistanis were FREED from Gitmo in July 2003:

Eleven Pakistanis freed from Guantanamo Bay after two years of imprisonment | World news | The Guardian

Here is a short excerpt from that guardian report:

Pakistan has been holding talks with Washington on the release of its nationals from Guantanamo Bay for several months, and the US has already freed four others Pakistani prisoners.

Mohammed Sanghir, who was released last November after 10 months, is demanding $10.4m (£6.5m) in compensation for alleged mental torture. He says he was caged in a small cell and kept in solitary confinement for days at a time.

The US authorities are preparing to have the terror suspects tried by closed military tribunals. Some could be sentenced to death.

Now I assume there must be some more Pakistanis who were picked up in pakistan itself and handed over to the FBI without any due process, extradition proceedings or other luxuries they deserve to establish their innocence before being thrown to the mercy of ruthless, violent, brainwashed sociopathic interrogators at Gitmo. I keep reading all over the place that these pakistanis are being held WITHOUT CHARGE and just tortured to extract confessions.

Now think about that, if you arrest someone for a crime and you already have enough evidence why would you want to torture someone unless you needed a false confession to back up your useless evidence.

These wanted people (foreigners) had no right to stay passpot free in NWFP mountains and try to implement shariat in Swat. How was it that Abdullah Mehsud got freed from Guantanamo Bay and came to fight a Jihad in NWFP against PAK army?

Good question. Why don't you tell me how Mehsud got free and came to Pakistan? Why is it that Mushy was giving away people to the US like a faithfull puppy but the US was releasing Abdullah Mehsud to become an attack dog against Pakistan? And btw Abdullah Mehsud was captured in Kunduz Afghanistan by an Uzbek warlord and went directly to Gitmo. Tell me why Mushy's buddies in the CIA and Pentagon turned Mehsud loose?

Mehsud spent months, years in Gitmo during which time they would have easily established his guilt if he had any but instead they did nothing. Why? Because he was willing to fight AGAINST pakistan? Because he was willing to work for the CIA? Because he was already working for the CIA? For RAW? For Pakhtun separatists based out of Afghanistan?

So these are the kinds of people Mushy was handing Pakistani souls over to for as little as $5,000 a pop. Why do you think people are angry over this?

 

[opinion786]

=maqsad;182799]Hold on, are you telling me that no Pakistanis were handed over to the US? Just a 10 second random search came up with this link which says 11 pakistanis were FREED from Gitmo in July 2003:

Eleven Pakistanis freed from Guantanamo Bay after two years of imprisonment | World news | The Guardian

There may be one or two random cases of Pakistani being handed over mistakenly.

Even in this article of yours that you quoted above. The 11 Pakistanis that were freed were, caught in Afghanistan NOT in PAkistan after fall of Taliban. The government has been asking for their realease. Why would the govt hand over its citizens to seek their realease? I quote your article below.

"The freed Pakistanis were among thousands of foreigners who allegedly fought for the Taliban against coalition forces in Afghanistan. They were rounded up after the Taliban were overthrown in late 2001. Pakistan has been holding talks with Washington on the release of its nationals from Guantanamo Bay for several months, and the US has already freed four others Pakistani prisoners"

Similarly, the ONE man that was caught in pakistan and handed over to USA was a SWEDISH citizen and NOT a pakistani. I quote your article.

"Sweden has criticised the US for labelling 23-year-old Mehdi-Muhammed Ghezali an enemy combatant rather than a prisoner of war. Sweden has argued that his detention is illegal, and it wants the US to present evidence against him or release him. During a visit to Sweden in March Mr Prosper said that Mr Ghezali, arrested in Pakistan in 2001" Eleven Pakistanis freed from Guantanamo Bay after two years of imprisonment | World news | The Guardian

Now I assume there must be some more Pakistanis who were picked up in pakistan itself and handed over to the FBI without any due process, extradition proceedings or other luxuries they deserve to establish their innocence before being thrown to the mercy of ruthless, violent, brainwashed sociopathic interrogators at Gitmo.

There may be 1-2 random individual cases of Pakistani being handed over.

Ever wonder why Musharraf only handed over 369 people and NOT the 672 arrested?

These that were handed over were Tajiks, Uzbeks, Chechans, Swedish, Arabs, Afghans, etc. They were over-staying without passports in NWFP mountains assuming some sort of self proclaimed jihad.

Good question. Why don't you tell me how Mehsud got free and came to Pakistan? Why is it that Mushy was giving away people to the US like a faithfull puppy but the US was releasing Abdullah Mehsud to become an attack dog against Pakistan? And btw Abdullah Mehsud was captured in Kunduz Afghanistan by an Uzbek warlord and went directly to Gitmo. Tell me why Mushy's buddies in the CIA and Pentagon turned Mehsud loose?

USA is NOT Musharraf's buddies. You'll have to clear your mind of this GEO instigated perception. The USA wants Musharraf out!

The USA knows that Musharraf is Pro-China and internally against USA policies. Musharraf went against USA on several issues.

1- Gwadar
2- JF-17 Thunder (after USA refused F-16 for years)
3- IPI pipeline with Iran (Musharraf asked China to join)
4- Sust dry port
5- Several nuclear projects
6- He refused forces for Iraq
7- Musharaf refused to rein in ISI as per USA wishes.


Mehsuds and Fazalulalh's are being supported by Indians & CIA to destable PAkistan and Musharraf. Even yesterday, the Taliban leader annouced Jihad against everyone that would support Musharraf.

So these are the kinds of people Mushy was handing Pakistani souls over to for as little as $5,000 a pop. Why do you think people are angry over this?

Foreigners should be kicked out. Full stop. Yes, Pakistani should not be and Musharraf has not given away Pakistanis. Out of 672 only 369 were handed over. Meaning the rest were Pakistani.

Random 2-3 cases may come to light. But, the Pakistani government (against the general perception) is demanding release of their citizens from USA (confirmed by your article also)

Regards

 

[opinion786]

Our Pakistanis should NOT walk over into Afghanistan or Kashmir against official Pakistan policy and against Foreign policy. Those that will cross over into Afghanistan or Kashmir have 100% chances of being kidnapped, go-missing, abducted, killed or ambushed.... by USA or NATO forces or RAW agents. The PAK agencies are later blamed.

The 11 that you quoted in your article was same case, of pakistanis that were arrested in Afghianstan. What were they doing there??? They should Thank GOD that they were not killed by USA or NATO and were only detained.

 

[roadrunner]

Maqsad, the people in Gitmo were not all arrested by Musharraf for God's sake.

Many of the people in Bagram and Gitmo were arrested in Afghanistan.

 

[ejaz007]

US asked to repatriate Dr Aafia

WASHINGTON: The Pakistan embassy has formally asked the United States government to repatriate Dr Aafia Siddiqui to Pakistan where she will be dealt with in accordance with the law. It is unlikely that Pakistan’s request will be accepted, since the charge levied against the Pakistani scientist is that she attacked US security personnel with a gun in a Kabul holding facility. The embassy has also asked the US prison authorities not to subject Siddiqui to strip searches, since they are demeaning in the Pakistani and Islamic culture. There is also a move to have the government bear the expenses of her defence. Her family lawyer and a court-appointed one are helping Siddiqui at present. On the advice of her lawyer, Siddiqui did not answer any of the questions put to her by the two embassy officials who met her. They asked her about her whereabouts since her disappearance from Karachi five years ago, the whereabouts of her children and if she had been in detention all along. The US has claimed that she was arrested in Kabul only on July 17. Siddiqui told the embassy officials that she was grateful to the Pakistan government for having come forward to assist her and thanked the officers who had spent more than two hours with her. Siddiqui was on Tuesday examined by a medical doctor at the Metropolitican Detention Centre according to sources. The order for providing a doctor to examine Siddiqui within 24 hours was given by a US judge at her bail hearing on Monday. khalid hasan/app

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[opinion786]

Nobody praises Musharraf and his government's efforts, since before 2003, to seek release of their gone-missing citizens in Afghanistan from USA.

The article Maqsad shared is of 2003, when 11 Pakistani were freed becasue Pakistan had been holding talks with Washington on the release of its nationals from Guantanamo Bay for several months. These were rounded up in Afghanistan in 2001 (gone on some self-assumed jihad) Eleven Pakistanis freed from Guantanamo Bay after two years of imprisonment | World news | The Guardian

Nobody praises musharraf for this. Everyone is quick to blame him .... but they don't question the motives of THESE mis-guided pakistanis who crossed over in Afghainstan without passports??? Against the official Pakistan state foreign policy.

These mis-guided individuals put the safety & image of Pakistan at stake. The world accuses PAkistan of being a SAFE HAVEN for terrorist.

 

[ejaz007]

U.S. court finds Aafia guilty of attacking US army
Updated at: 0200 PST, Wednesday, September 03, 2008


NEW YORK: United States court Thursday found American-educated Pakistani doctor Aafia Siddiqi guilty on charges to attack U.S army in Afghanistan as a member of Al-Qaeda, said a statement released from US court.

Also, Aafia has been charged with attempt to murder, triggering terrorism, armed attacks on US forces in Afghanistan and keeping illegal armaments, it added.

Statement also said that she might have to undergo life imprisonment, 20 years imprisonment and eight years imprisonment for each charges respectively in case the charges leveled against her proved right in the court.

U.S. court finds Aafia guilty of attacking US army

 

[ejaz007]

Pakistan declines to accept Dr. Aafia’s children: Dr. Fouzia
Updated at: 1010 PST, Wednesday, September 03, 2008

KARACHI: Dr. Fouzia Siddiqui, daughter of Dr. Aafia Siddiqui has accused Pakistan of declining to accept the citizenship of Dr. Aafia’s children.

Talking to Geo News, she told that Pakistani government refused to demand custody of Dr. Aafia’s children from the Afghanistan.

She said her family had filed a case in American court seeking custody of children. Her lawyer told that US State department had appraised the court about Pakistani government refusal to consider Dr. Aafia’s children as Pakistani citizens, added Siddiqui.

According to Dr. Fouzia, her brother Muhammad Ali received a letter sent by the State department. The letter said Muhammad Ali didn’t appear before the court since more than two weeks, therefore; children could not be handed over to the family. Dr. Aafia’s children will remain in America, it said.

She further said that her brother didn’t appear before the court as Pakistani government had assured them of its full support in brining the children back to the Pakistan.

Pakistan declines to accept Dr. Aafia’s children: Dr. Fouzia