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Doubtful video showing Army 'abusing' in Swat

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BBC NEWS | South Asia | Video shows Pakistan army 'abuse'


Video shows Pakistan army 'abuse'
By Syed Shoaib Hasan
BBC News, Islamabad

Men in Pakistani army uniform are seen beating a suspect
Men in uniform are seen kicking and hitting detainees

Pakistani soldiers are seen apparently abusing Taliban suspects in a 10-minute video which has been posted on the social networking site, Facebook.

The video would be the first clear proof of such abuse. It shows men in military uniform beating suspects as officers stand by giving instructions.

It is not clear who shot the film or where. It appears to have been made recently, perhaps in the Swat valley.

Pakistan's army has said it needs to examine the video before commenting.

Conversations heard on the video suggest it is recent. Troops recently declared they had largely cleared the Swat valley of insurgents after a sustained offensive there.

Human rights groups have accused the military of being involved in torture and extra-judicial killings in the region.

Whips


"This is a very serious accusation," Gen Athar Abbas, head of Pakistan army's public relations wing, told the BBC when asked about the video.

"I cannot comment on the video till we have examined it. This will take some time as the army headquarters will have to be involved in the process."

The footage shows an officer in Pakistani army battle uniform interrogating several suspects, some of whom are quite elderly and are presumably relatives of men being sought.

When the officer does not receive satisfactory answers, he motions with his head and soldiers rush in to punish the suspect.

They then beat him with belts, fists and what appear to be small whips. He is also kicked all over the body by soldiers wearing heavy army boots.

The suspect is heard screaming and imploring the soldiers to stop in the name of Allah, repeatedly saying he has told them all he knows.

In the video the soldiers administering the beating have to be restrained by the officer on at least two occasions.

Threats


After an initial round of punishment, the officer tells a suspect that this is "soft treatment". Unless the suspect tells all, the officer says he will have to administer "hard punishment".

"You don't want me to cut off your hands and feet," the officer says.

If confirmed, this would be the first clear proof of the Pakistani army being involved in the abuse of detainees.

The Human Rights Commission of Pakistan (HRCP) and other groups have accused the army of such violations during the recent Swat campaign.

The HRCP says it has also found evidence that the army is involved in extra-judicial killings in the region.

The Pakistani army has consistently denied the reports, calling them "baseless."

But it has also said it will investigate if any solid proof emerges of its personnel being involved in such activities.
 
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THESE weardos got the right treatement. No point of shouting around with alligations of Human rights violation with all that which is happening in Iraq 's Abu Gharib Gontanamo bay and Afghanistan due to their own forces.
 
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wow! these tallibunny actually squeal when they hurt!!

********.com - Pakistani Army Beating Talibans

wonder if they thought about their victims that much!
 
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Who gives a ****,these guys were probably giving some payback for all their brothers in arms beheaded by these scum !
 
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im not sure if this video is real but if its real I cannot say I'm apalled by this video. In fact the beatings are very mild. In the video they are hitting only on the lower parts of the body , on the back on the bums but not on the face, in a controlled way , you can hear the Major asking his men to back off from time to time , so its not the very exteme given that the TTP made beheading vidoes of our troops. Their screeming is more than the actual beatings.
 
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I was going to say - the people being 'beaten' don't really look like they suffer any serious injuries.

We aren't pulling finger nails off, breaking fingers or assorted bones etc.

Heck, sad as it may seem, one probably stands a chance to be abused worse than this in a regular police station in Pakistan.
 
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If that is how a respectable college professor is treated, than little doubt is left about the treatment of 'lesser' folks.

I am a witness of such incidents myself. I have seen how the coast guards near Habb (who are supervised by a regular Army officer of the rank of a Captain) harass the passengers travelling from Quetta to Karachi and openly demand for money if the passengers have to getaway with their goods. There have been several protests and the roads were blocked by the Bus owners and the passengers.

959be87824ae61c8631968e8a27d7628.gif

3710eee6c818d3ebd2eb3fad7567e480.gif


Source: Jang Group Online
 
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If that is how a respectable college professor is treated, than little doubt is left about the treatment of 'lesser' folks.

I am a witness of such incidents myself. I have seen how the coast guards near Habb (who are supervised by a regular Army officer of the rank of a Captain) harass the passengers travelling from Quetta to Karachi and openly demand for money if the passengers have to getaway with their goods. There have been several protests and the roads were blocked by the Bus owners and the passengers.

959be87824ae61c8631968e8a27d7628.gif

3710eee6c818d3ebd2eb3fad7567e480.gif


Source: Jang Group Online

As bad as the video is, do realize that this sort of a beating is pretty standard if you get caught by the Army in a hot zone. I know first hand of cases of young men caught rioting and they got the Army arse kicking but no serious injuries. Enough for them to not want to stir up trouble.

However the reality is that such practices do not yield anything tangible. When these chaps are getting the dunda, they will say anything. The fact that this purported video of the beatings made it out is giving the Army unnecessary and negative PR. Better to avoid such things altogether. What is really unfortunate is that fairly old men are being treated very roughly. Not a very good thing to do when the idea is to win the hearts and minds. :frown: :disagree:

On the above Jang articles, no less than the Chief of Staff, XI Corps apologized to the professor and the officer responsible (he was not a commissioned officer) was punished with 28 days RI and loss of pay for 1 month.

The bottom line is that as bad as the above is, when the Army completes the investigation and punishes, it does it without regard for those in uniform. Personally I am confident that there will be repercussions of this video and those responsible will be disciplined.
 
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I was going to say - the people being 'beaten' don't really look like they suffer any serious injuries.

We aren't pulling finger nails off, breaking fingers or assorted bones etc.

Heck, sad as it may seem, one probably stands a chance to be abused worse than this in a regular police station in Pakistan.
First of all how do we know that the guy being beaten-up is a ‘Taliban’ or a ‘Taliban-supporter’? He could be simple villager just happened to live in a troubled zone.

Secondly, were these ‘interrogations’ sanctioned by the court of law?

Thirdly, a person is being kicked like a foot ball by the men wearing heavy military boots and you are calling it ‘mild’?
 
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As bad as the video is, do realize that this sort of a beating is pretty standard if you get caught by the Army in a hot zone. I know first hand of cases of young men caught rioting and they got the Army arse kicking but no serious injuries. Enough for them to not want to stir up trouble.

However the reality is that such practices do not yield anything tangible. When these chaps are getting the dunda, they will say anything. The fact that this purported video of the beatings made it out is giving the Army unnecessary negative PR. Better to avoid such things altogether. What is really unfortunate is that fairly old men are being treated the same as the younger men. Not a very good thing to do when the idea is to win the hearts and minds. :frown: :disagree:

On the above Jang articles, see this:
Thanks Blain for not dismissing the video plus the column out rightly. This kind of understanding is getting scarcer these days.
 
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First of all how do we know that the guy being beaten-up is a ‘Taliban’ or a ‘Taliban-supporter’? He could be simple villager just happened to live in a troubled zone.

I'm not condoning it but these men are detainees in a police station. Its possible that some were just caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, but its not like the police and army just grab people off the streets and shove them into jail for no reason. Its possible the guys had credible local intel on them identifying them as militants.

Thirdly, a person is being kicked like a foot ball by the men wearing heavy military boots and you are calling it ‘mild’?

The boots aren't THAT heavy. I think the whips would've hurt more. But permanent damage is doubtful.
 
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This video shows how things get done in our part of the world. We're not kidding around, we're suppose to win a war that has effected our people to the maximum. These scumbags are the reason why we're in a situation where we have to stomp their heads to get information out in order to prevent a future terrorist attack in one of our cities. I can assure you that army has seen thousands of these "Old men" who later turn out as terrorists hiding arms, IEDs, and suicide jackets in their very own homes.

Secondly, I don't blame the soldiers for their actions. Once YOU'VE been down in the war zone and have seen how bodies of your own countrymen fly, and when you have to bury your brother, sister, mother, best friend or even your own father, you'd understand the psychology of the people who would go out of their way to interrogate terrorists in such a manner for OUR safer future.

Regular people like us would simply sit back and criticize the army for their every action but would never get to understand the other side of the picture. Let's not "Speculate" if these men were all that innocent. When surrounded, even a mass murderer and a rapist would come off looking like an angel. The army is a professional branch of the Pakistan Military and we should wait for what they have to say about this in order to avoid useless moral bickering.
 
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