Don't push us to the wall: Hindus

[fd24]

The secularists dont have a voice in Pk, they are either called traitors or said to be anti islam or are executed.



The hindu and christian minority condition is deplorable, it's a shame for the state of PK.

Of course i hear Hindus treat muslims and especially christians incredibly well - perhaps we should learn from your shining example....

 

[haviZsultan]

As the poor Muslims are paying in India from last half a century. By the way two can not be compared. Muslims in India genocided but here you can not bring one such case on !!!

I agree, India has a horrible record, Gujarat, Babri, Kashmir, in gujrat begging women had their wombs torn apart. All that happened. I have family in India that suffered some of that, fine. But how the hell will that make it right for us to do the same thing to Hindus? We should stand as an example to India and the world.

We should show them how minorities SHOULD be treated instead of just saying look what the Indians did. If they are not a good example why try and copy them? Remember our Nation was formed because minorities in India were treated unfairly. If we treat our own minorities unfairly our division from India means nothing.

You don't say a single word about the innocent Hindu girl converted forcefully but fire off against the Indians. We have to give equal rights to each Pakistani failing which we cannot function as a Nation. Quaid E Azam made that clear. This should be our primary concern. Who gives a damn what the Indians did? Unless its Pakistanis killed why are we looking towards them anyway. At least solve your own problems. It is our responsibility to give the Hindus in Pakistan their rights and it should hurt us that we are not always succeeding.

Quaid E Azam told us, no ordered us to protect minorities, especially Hindus:
"Muslims! Protect your Hindu Neighbours. Cooperate with the Government and the officials in protecting your Hindu Neighbours against these lawless elements, fifth columnists and cliques. Pakistan must be governed through the properly constituted Government and not by cliques or fifth columnists or Mobs."

9, January, 1948

 

[illusion8]

Of course i hear Hindus treat muslims and especially christians incredibly well - perhaps we should learn from your shining example....

Does that give someone the right to treat their own minority so badly, Also Indian muslims are not treated the way hindus are treated in your country.

 

[fd24]

Does that give someone the right to treat their own minority so badly, Also Indian muslims are not treated the way hindus are treated in your country.

I completely agree yaar - its disgraceful how minorities are dealt a bad hand by simpletons and extremists from our nation - but the way you guys talk - its as if you have never experienced such behavior - come on it exists and it shouldn't happen

 

[Rusty]

Irrespective of that fact, India claimed that Muslims constitute 8% at Independence. Now the same India says that Muslims constitute 14%. It could be higher, I agree. But it doesn't diminish the fact that Muslim population in India had grown and not many present day Muslims from India seek amnesty in Pakistan. We cannot say the same about Pakistani Hindus, can we?

while we are comparing irrelevant things, why don't we also compare the population growth of the Zulu and the population of growth of Russia?

Pakistan is not India, we have a different history. The explanation of haviZsultan is perfectly reasonable and logical.
Your reply, however, is not.
You are so desperate to prove something that does not exist that you are making flawed arguments.
Please accept the fact that, unlike India, there has been no ethnic cleansing of minorities in Pakistan. And all demographic shifts can be explained.

 

[illusion8]

I completely agree yaar - its disgraceful how minorities are dealt a bad hand by simpletons and extremists from our nation - but the way you guys talk - its as if you have never experienced such behavior - come on it exists and it shouldn't happen

Its quite deplorable and I can sense that you can feel their pain and anguish. Anybody defending these acts should think about the way they would feel if they were in their shoes. Imagine someone being preyed on just because of their religion when they have accepted to be Pk citizens. Being targeted, killed and preyed on in your own house must be devastating to them. I hope sense prevails and people stop giving reasons for these acts and do something about it.

 

[haviZsultan]

Irrespective of that fact, India claimed that Muslims constitute 8% at Independence. Now the same India says that Muslims constitute 14%. It could be higher, I agree. But it doesn't diminish the fact that Muslim population in India had grown and not many present day Muslims from India seek amnesty in Pakistan. We cannot say the same about Pakistani Hindus, can we?

I believe population wise the Hindu population too has grown but not as heavily as the Muslim population. Of course there are problems too for the community as proven in the article but not all Muslims want the Hindus dead. Some Muslims believe having minorities in a country is a brilliant way to increase people to people contact and stem the tide of terrorism.

And some Muslims still want to come to Pakistan:
1) For example an old relative living in India with no relatives left in the country to take care of her.
2) Our family has a tradition of marrying women from India. It used to be stronger in the past than it was now. I myself would like to bring an Indian bride. More open minded. But of course I would want her to become a Pakistani. This is the tradition. Of course her choice counts too.

I am saying this because people I know have moved from India. Few people in India know about those that moved to Pakistan later (despite our moronic laws) than in the 1940's and 50's which were standard years for movement between India and Pakistan. There is now a smaller but still significant trickle of people moving to Pakistan.

 

[illusion8]

while we are comparing irrelevant things, why don't we also compare the population growth of the Zulu and the population of growth of Russia?

Pakistan is not India, we have a different history. The explanation of haviZsultan is perfectly reasonable and logical.
Your reply, however, is not.
You are so desperate to prove something that does not exist that you are making flawed arguments.
Please accept the fact that, unlike India, there has been no ethnic cleansing of minorities in Pakistan. And all demographic shifts can be explained.

Indian minorities are not targeted as you presume, communal tensions happened both ways people of both religions got killed. But systematic cleansing is what is happening in Pk and if you cannot see that then you cannot do anything about it and you are a culprit as well.

 

[ashokdeiva]

while we are comparing irrelevant things, why don't we also compare the population growth of the Zulu and the population of growth of Russia?

Pakistan is not India, we have a different history. The explanation of haviZsultan is perfectly reasonable and logical.
Your reply, however, is not.
You are so desperate to prove something that does not exist that you are making flawed arguments.
Please accept the fact that, unlike India, there has been no ethnic cleansing of minorities in Pakistan. And all demographic shifts can be explained.

care to explain more?
The last rift between Hindus and Muslims happened 10 years ago in Gujarath and the trigger was by the Muslims when they burned down 56 people alive.
There has been no communal rift until today after that riot. Muslims in my country are more united than in Pakistan and any harrasment by the Hindus get highlighted because of this unity and I dont see such a highlightment in the last 10 years in no part of my country which certainly means that both Hindus and Muslim of my nation have learned from the mistakes of the past and have learned to move past and stay united or atleast not inflict damage to each other and stay away from each other..

 

[mahabharath]

while we are comparing irrelevant things, why don't we also compare the population growth of the Zulu and the population of growth of Russia?

Pakistan is not India, we have a different history. The explanation of haviZsultan is perfectly reasonable and logical.
Your reply, however, is not.
You are so desperate to prove something that does not exist that you are making flawed arguments.
Please accept the fact that, unlike India, there has been no ethnic cleansing of minorities in Pakistan. And all demographic shifts can be explained.

Why are you blabbering if you don't have answer...

Where in the world population of the community is increased if there was well-executed genocide happened on that particular community?

Their population is growing because they are happily living in India unlike minorities in Pakistan. Barring couple of sad incidents, that too where both the communities have suffered, minorities are treated much better than anywhere else.

 

[haviZsultan]

The secularists dont have a voice in Pk, they are either called traitors or said to be anti islam or are executed.

The hindu and christian minority condition is deplorable, it's a shame for the state of PK.

The secularists are gaining power and influence in Pakistan because people are tired of the way things are. Ever since Quaid E Azam died Pakistan has been betrayed by the Islamists who initially did not even want Pakistan to be formed but joined our camp because they knew they would have influence in a largely Muslim Pakistan compared to India. They have tried to impose Islam on everything. The result is before us. People are being killed in the name of religion like rats by a infestation company. You think just hindus are the target of these murderers? You will notice 90% of their targets are Muslims.

I believe you are confusing us for the Liberal fanatics who control the media completely. Sadly the people you are talking about control our countries media. I have been on twitter for a while and every journalist seems to be from this breed. I am a Liberal myself but I believe Pakistan must come before everything else. I do not fear defending National Interest nor do I take the Pakistan-bashing line the World takes just because the fake liberals have made it a tradition to do so.

Forgetting your blood, your country in your Liberalism is not Liberalism, it is madness. The journo's you see on telly today don't give a damn about Pakistan. We are the real Liberals, real secularists. They won't ever raise a voice for the Hindus like us. If you don't believe us their was a liberalist movement in the year 1998 that donated 2000 pieces of clothes and cutlery to Hindus and Christians. That was from us. The (Secular) Nationalists of Pakistan. My own Nationalist wing was active back them, Go research Patriots-minority wing.

I completely agree yaar - its disgraceful how minorities are dealt a bad hand by simpletons and extremists from our nation - but the way you guys talk - its as if you have never experienced such behavior - come on it exists and it shouldn't happen

I agree. How can you talk about a neighboring country when you haven't done any better.

human rights groups believe that over 2,000 people, mostly Muslims were killed. A large number of the victims were women and children; local investigators have stated that between 250 and 330 women victims were amongst the dead, but exact numbers for all the incidents are not available.

In the report, one Muslim woman recalls how she, seven other women and eight men were surrounded by a mob when they were trying to escape the riots. The mob threatened the men with swords and hit them on the head with iron rods until they lost consciousness. They took the women into the fields, tore at their clothes, scratched their bodies and sexually assaulted them, while shouting: “We will make you conceive Hindu children!”

Another witness remembers how she saw six of her neighbours being raped and molested, with iron rods and swords being thrust into them after which they were set alight. A pregnant woman had her breasts cut off and her womb sliced open.

A woman described how policemen desecrated the Koran and then picked up her eighteen-month old child and threw him across the room. When she protested, the police said: “Reproduce and make more terrorists.”

The Hindu : National : All accused in riot case acquitted

Inhuman rights : STATES News - India Today

 

[illusion8]

^^^The root cause of the Mumbai riots and Gujarat riots were the Mumbai bomb blasts and in case of Gujarat was the burning of the train both was done by Muslims...though the Mumbai incident was after the Babri Masjid demolition which could have been avoided. 26/11 was an attempt at inciting communal violence but as Indians we are pleased that it did not lead to a riot between hindus and muslims. Hindus and muslims have a long history of enmity, hatred and war and I have seen with my own eyes muslims hacking hindus in India during the riots. The hindus being in majority did cause more number of muslim deaths but thats a given. Every communal riot had a reason. But the systematic cleansing in PK is pre planned and results are there in the diminished population of your minorities.

 

[protest]

I believe population wise the Hindu population too has grown but not as heavily as the Muslim population. Of course there are problems too for the community as proven in the article but not all Muslims want the Hindus dead. Some Muslims believe having minorities in a country is a brilliant way to increase people to people contact and stem the tide of terrorism.

And some Muslims still want to come to Pakistan:
1) For example an old relative living in India with no relatives left in the country to take care of her.
2) Our family has a tradition of marrying women from India. It used to be stronger in the past than it was now. I myself would like to bring an Indian bride. More open minded. But of course I would want her to become a Pakistani. This is the tradition. Of course her choice counts too.

I am saying this because people I know have moved from India. Few people in India know about those that moved to Pakistan later (despite our moronic laws) than in the 1940's and 50's which were standard years for movement between India and Pakistan. There is now a smaller but still significant trickle of people moving to Pakistan.

I am sorry I don't think you got my question. I am sure people move to Pakistan for marital reasons or family reasons. But how many of them move because of persecution or economic reasons? Pakistani Hindus come to India mainly alleging persecution in Pakistan. How about Indian Muslims? Do they ever move to Pakistan citing the same?

Again if I may, I am not saying all Pakistanis want to kill Hindus. Of course not. But you cannot ignore the size of people who would want to, can you? In my country a christian evangelist would call 'Hanuman' a monkey and get away with it legally. Can we say the same about Pakistan with its blasphemy laws?

 

[haviZsultan]

Srinagar, IOK:

Kashmiri people rise against Indian aggression - YouTube

Kashmir banega Pakistan.

Many Kashmiris move from India to Pakistan because of persecution. After the Gujarat riots there was an article where Muslims in India went to the border and demanded repatriation to Pakistan.

 

[protest]

Srinagar, IOK:

Kashmiri people rise against Indian aggression - YouTube

Kashmir banega Pakistan.

Many Kashmiris move from India to Pakistan because of persecution. After the Gujarat riots there was an article where Muslims in India went to the border and demanded repatriation to Pakistan.

Okay. Could you please share that article with us? Even so, that happened what 10 years ago? India has 170 million Muslims don't you think if they are persecuted every day, they would revolt. Show me a article in this decade where a Muslim family wants to move to Pakistan citing persecution. We even got Ahmedis moving to India citing the same? Would you think a Gujarathi Muslim would want to move to Pakistan today?

Coming to Kashmir, over 250000 Kashmiri Pandits were thrown out first. So the Kashmiris aren't innocent in any way. Also only Kashmir valley people would want to move to Pakistan. Mostly they are illiterate, know nothing but religion preached by local mullah.