Do Pak textbooks build a hate culture against India?

[Vinod2070]

And the source of your posting is an Indian author.

Atleast i have not studied in Pakistan Studies book what the Indians are claiming.

You need to look into text books which are being taught in India and you will see how much hate is being taught against Muslims.

No Indian board will have courage to allow Pakistanis to carry out propaganda on such a scale which you Indians are doing on Pakistani boards.

This alone proves how much tolerant we are.

Why don't we get over this once and for all!

It may be true and the admins and mods of this board have made a policy to have those kinds of discussions. If this board wanted to be a copy of PDF or such Indian boards, they would have done that. Its obvious they did not want that.

Why do so many members want to trumpet this endlessly when they are not the ones deciding the policies. If the board does want to become another PDF or BR, let it be. People will miss these discussions for some time but will likely join other boards if they want to where such discussions may not be possible but life will move on.

 

[IceCold]

*While Muslims provided all types of help to those wishing to leave Pakistan, the people of India committed cruelties against the Muslims. They were murdered and looted- Civics of Pakistan, Intermediate classes [/I]

Creating a Pakistan of distortions

While the rest of the article was nothing more then a one more vague attempt added in the very long list of BS to create a negative impression about Pakistani education, however this last line really blew my temperament and i had to respond, my English teacher a very moderate women i would call her, one day told her students about her own experience when partition took place and every event that she was witnessed to herself from the escaping of the house from the fear of sikhs to her train journey and killings of people in the very same train were the exact same which is also written in the history and which these fanatic hindus now claim to be a text of hatred.

 

[Vinod2070]

Great inhumanly acts happened on both sides during the partition. That is a fact.

What this article tries to convey that in Pakistan event did not happen is a plain lie. Not for nothing was the whole of Pakistan ethnically cleaned of Hindu Sikh minorities for all intents and purpose.

 

[Blossom]

Oh please. Indian textbooks write extensively about the evils of the caste system and Sati and all that, but they do it without drilling home the point that "hindus and brahmins inherently cunning and immoral".

I can imagine the uproar in India if textbooks began to mention the disgusting aspects of Sharia law, the repressive nature of the burkha, the "evils of Islam" such as honour killings, the attitude towards non-muslims as "inferior" and "jahils" and "kaffirs", and the complete absence of freedom of religion in Islam (Death for apostasy).

Or the violence and destruction that followed the arrival of the first muslim conquerers, intent of subjugating the "inferior" race and religion.

Indian history textbooks focus predominantly on the evils of Hinduism, and tend to brush over the negative aspects of Islam in order to be "secular".

Who told you that? I never read anywhere in my textbooks that Brahmins are cunning and immoral despite the fact that they are.Yes.If they are still following the ordeal of pouring molten lead into the ears of people belonging to lower caste.

Repressive nature of Burka?? how many times do I have to explain this to you that there's no restriction of Burka in islam?, the emphasis is on covering the body.Burka does the job well so a good majority wears it cosidering the comfort.I cover myself very well.But I don't wear Burka.I wear western dresses.Yes.Maxies, Long skirts, jeans everything.I had a Christian friend who once nitpicking the women who wear Burka living in Canada said...."why do these women wear Burka and Hijab.?? who are they hiding from?? from a guy who has a beautiul blonde girlfriend? Who cares to even look at them?"
I have a Question"why cant YOU people leave us alone???I don't have any problem with your girls going naked in the streets with the whole world watching em.NO I JUST DONT CARE!!!
Honor killings??? You think Pakistan government is backing them? NO.and neither Islam.Indeed Islam allows the two,without any criticism and objection to get married.Those who prefer to kill such people are defnitely not encouraged and strongly condemned.And I hate them too.

And the inferior attitude??huh.these are your issues.I never read anything like that.Different religions have always been there.Right from the outset of mankind.We invite People to embrace Islam,so do Christians and Hindus.But do we ever force anyone to?
by the way can we, at all??

Indian history textbooks focus predominantly on the evils of Hinduism, and tend to brush over the negative aspects of Islam in order to be "secular".

Oh God! I repeated the same thing about Pakistani textbooks.But talking to you is like

 

[Flintlock]

Who told you that? I never read anywhere in my textbooks that Brahmins are cunning and immoral despite the fact that they are.Yes.If they are still following the ordeal of pouring molten lead into the ears of people belonging to lower caste.

despite the fact that they are

On one hand you deny it, and on the other, you display the same attitude.

Jeez...I wonder what a brahmin reading your post would be feeling right now.

Also, I wonder where you got this story of pouring molten lead down people's ears. Is it that same place where I got stories of muslim emperors lighting a huge fire and then asking all the hindus to either convert or jump into the fire?

Pointing out individual acts of cruelty/torture and half-truths is not the mark of a quality history textbook.

Repressive nature of Burka?? how many times do I have to explain this to you that there's no restriction of Burka in islam?, the emphasis is on covering the body

Well, in that case, there is no caste system in hinduism either.

Honor killings??? You think Pakistan government is backing them? NO.and neither Islam.Indeed Islam allows the two,without any criticism and objection to get married.Those who prefer to kill such people are defnitely not encouraged and strongly condemned.And I hate them too.

You think Indian government is backing Sati? You think hindu saints are backing sati? You think I like sati?

Yet, I can say positively that instances of honour killing are far more common in Pakistan than cases of Sati are in India.

And the inferior attitude??huh.these are your issues.I never read anything like that.Different religions have always been there.Right from the outset of mankind.We invite People to embrace Islam,so do Christians and Hindus.But do we ever force anyone to?

They why death for apostacy? Why restrictions on marrying non-muslims?

Ans: Because Islam is designed to dominate and crush other faiths, and controlling marriage and conversion to other faiths is the way to keep up the numbers. That's the real story, which any secular expert on religion will tell you.

Oh God! I repeated the same thing about Pakistani textbooks.But talking to you is like

Sorry?

 

[Blossom]

despite the fact that they are

On one hand you deny it, and on the other, you display the same attitude.

thats my personal opinion.And you are referring to textbooks aren't you?

Jeez...I wonder what a brahmin reading your post would be feeling right now.

You think I care?

Also, I wonder where you got this story of pouring molten lead down people's ears. Is it that same place where I got stories of muslim emperors lighting a huge fire and then asking all the hindus to either convert or jump into the fire?

from the same thread. and Jumping into fire?? where did YOU get this story?? gee have I caught amnesia?Cause I don't remember anything like that.

Pointing out individual acts of cruelty/torture and half-truths is not the mark of a quality history textbook.

you think everything I said was half true?at one point you're agreeing with me and crticizing sati and all and at other point you're again denying it.Why don't you write a history book (format included)yourself and let us have privilege to read i?

Well, in that case, there is no caste system in hinduism either.

There never was?

You think Indian government is backing Sati? You think hindu saints are backing sati? You think I like sati?

I already know it.And thats not the part of argument.

Yet, I can say positively that instances of honour killing are far more common in Pakistan than cases of Sati are in India.

How so? I disagree.Its been controlled sternly.

They why death for apostacy? Why restrictions on marrying non-muslims?

You think your middle class and upper middle class Hindus encourage marrying Muslims? You won't even let 'em enter your kitchen.

Ans: Because Islam is designed to dominate and crush other faiths, and controlling marriage and conversion to other faiths is the way to keep up the numbers. That's the real story, which any secular expert on religion will tell you.

Stop presuming.Don't make false assumptions about Islam.If this was the case, Saudi Arabia that follows Islamic constitution would never have welcomed American President and dined with him.Everyone would abandon Mulims and islamic Countries.The world would have ceased.

Sorry?[/QUOTE]
are you that naive?

 

[rajk20002002]

There is no denying some basic facts when it comes to relations between India and Pakistan. Hate between two is much stronger than love if any. Reasons are many. Foremost is the very creation of Pakistan as that was based upon that logic that Muslims and Hindus can not live together. So there is a good amount of hate already there right from the day go. This hate is the basis of the very existense of Pakistan. I am very doubtful if this can be removed so easily. At best it can only be managed and this is what our objective should be. Let Pakistanis have the full freedom to hate us and vice verse. I see nothing wrong in it. Let us come out of this slumber that India and Pakistan will ever be friends. It will never happen for 20 generations at least. Working for Indo-Pak friendship is a total waste of time. Let us learn only how to manage our relations while hating each other as much as we wish. Can we have the rules of this hate so that we don't end up annihilating each other. After all we need enemies as much as friends.

RK

 

[rajk20002002]

Alright Rubyjackass ! if You are looking for a personal individual opinion.Then the answer is No.
I suggest you to please consult my previous posts.I have made everything very clear.There are no myths in Pakistani textbooks either.Everything's based on facts.and history proves it.Indian culture, architecture, religious aspects, the Brahman Shodar system and all.Its all true.and I don't hate India.I don't hate Indians.I hate the founders and seconders of the low caste system and Satti and other excruciating acts against humanity.I have seen indian architecture in Pakistan.They are the same as described in those books.You're impugning something that doesn't even exist.
we present facts in front of the world and we criticize something...these two things are totally opposite to each other.
Not all those myths are true.I read 'em.
one of them is "All Pakistanis hate India"(earlier posted by afriend)...I don't understand how the author got across this but it is really a myth and It is not worth mentioning in those TEN myths because I believe that this myth never existed.



Its a pity.I disagree.These political parties never establish overnight.Its a matter of time before it actually starts representing a particular objective of a certain group of people.We work on it...we plan things..plans change ..we negotiate before we are ready to speak our mind to people...and to understand people's mind ...their desires..we got to be THEM..then and only then we can win their trust.And thats exactly what happened in case of Muslim League.It succeeded in exceeding expections of Muslims, win their trust and open their eyes to reality in a short span of time.Hence it emerged as the only Representative political body of Mslims.Otherwise as many Muslim countries would have come into existence as those Muslim political parties.

Hate does not come automatically my friend. It gets instituted in our brains as we grow. You have grown hating many things and so am I;

1. You hate Satti which now hardly exists.
2. I hate Qurbani of cow or for that matter of any living being.
3. I am sure you hate many Hindu practices and I see no problem in that. Even I hate many of our own practices and I am free as a Hindu to oopose them.

There are evils in every system and thats why we follow a particular system which we love. We can never have a hate free society and I won't aim either for one. All I would be interested is how to live life happily in our own way.

RK

 

[rajk20002002]

There is no doubt plenty of hate on both sides but you need to differentiate where this hate coming from.

In Pakistan, from an early age students are taught hatred against ethnic minorities and other nations and distorted history, not according to me but according to SDPI of your own country. An intercept from that analysis posted by sha123:

Our analysis found that some of the most significant problems in the current curricula and textbooks

*Inaccuracies of fact and omissions that serve to substantially distort the nature and significance of actual events in our history.
* Insensitivity to the existing religious diversity of the nation
*Incitement to militancy and violence, including encouragement of Jehad and
Shahadat
* Perspectives that encourage prejudice, bigotry and discrimination towards fellow citizens, especially women and religious minorities, and other towards nations.
* A glorification of war and the use of force
* Omission of concepts, events and material that could encourage critical selfawareness among students

Apart from this, hatred towards India also stems from the fact that India has liberated Bangladesh from Pakistan and kashmir issue.

On the other hand, hatred in India against Pakistan stems more from the fact that Pakistan is working against the Indian interests such as Kashmiri militancy, 1993 bomb blasts, Kargil etc. But you will never see any teachings in the text books against any religion (which we are taught as all religions and gods are equal) and hardly any mention of Pakistan apart from Independence related events.

So it is for you to see this differences between the hatred towards each other and underlying reasons.

Truth is a matter of pure perception. Their truth and our truths are different and thats what we all try to defend. Simple..Accoprding to them we are wrong and this why they hate us and are taught to hate us. Same is true on our side. Best I can think of is how to manage this hate so that it does not get out of hands....nothing more...I will leave themn free to hate us ...Its their previlage I suppose.

RK

 

[Blossom]

Hate does not come automatically my friend. It gets instituted in our brains as we grow. You have grown hating many things and so am I;

1. You hate Satti which now hardly exists.
2. I hate Qurbani of cow or for that matter of any living being.
3. I am sure you hate many Hindu practices and I see no problem in that. Even I hate many of our own practices and I am free as a Hindu to oopose them.

There are evils in every system and thats why we follow a particular system which we love. We can never have a hate free society and I won't aim either for one. All I would be interested is how to live life happily in our own way.

RK

Yes.Its very logical.I mean everyone hates cruelty, injustice, depravity.I don't swallow truth.I embrace it.And I understand how cow slaughter offends you.Its a world of diversity and difference of opinions will always exist.Two different people may have an entirely different perspective towards the same problem.We slaughter cow and you worship it.To us, when we abandon something that Allah has created and blessed us with( as Halal)...we are being unthankful.Also, compromise is the best solution.Living in a society where such things aren't appreciated...its better to lower it down to something plausible and exempting cow slaughter.It will both alleviate the anxiety and serve the religious purpose.

 

[Blossom]

Truth is a matter of pure perception. Their truth and our truths are different and thats what we all try to defend. Simple..Accoprding to them we are wrong and this why they hate us and are taught to hate us. Same is true on our side. Best I can think of is how to manage this hate so that it does not get out of hands....nothing more...I will leave themn free to hate us ...Its their previlage I suppose.

RK

Nobody hates you.Trust me

I request the great, self righteous, sho shweet starter of this extremely knowledgable thread to kindly do the honor and rename it as...Do Pak textbooks build hate culture against Hindu fanatics?

Allow me to confer .The answer is YES, Whats not to hate?

Now don't go for a "tit for tat" tactics when replying.
"we also hate Muslim extremists and not to mention....Burka"

because I know you do and so do we

 

[rajk20002002]

Nobody hates you.Trust me

I request the great, self righteous, sho shweet starter of this extremely knowledgable thread to kindly do the honor and rename it as...Do Pak textbooks build hate culture against Hindu fanatics?

Allow me to confer .The answer is YES, Whats not to hate?

Now don't go for a "tit for tat" tactics when replying.
"we also hate Muslim extremists and not to mention....Burka"

because I know you do and so do we

If at all we wish to address the Indo-Pak issues, we have to accept some truths with all honesty. Making smiling faces won't help. With all honest I wish to point out;

1. Majority of Indians did not like the creation of Pakistan. My single reason of not liking is that this amounted to our disrespect. Indians lived fairly happily for centuaries and we fought together with invaders. India gave everything to Muslims. In creation of Pakistan we felt a sense of rejection. I am sure most of Pakistanis have their own reasons and I am not questioning anyone.

2. There is no doubt that majority of Indians don't trust Pakistanis and I suppose vice verse. This distrust is part of our history and creation. Its not going to go away so easily and we have to live or die with this.

In my view above is the basic disease and rest all are symptoms. Can we control the disease till we find the cure? I am sure there are lots of sensible brains on both side. Does anyone have a solution? I know people will come with all sorts of solutions. Most of them have already been talked and tried. Nothing has worked. Let me be honest. Even if we hand over Kashmir, create five more mini Pakistans, this is not going to help. I will go even further. Even if whole India accepts Islam, its not going to help. In my view Islam alone can not bind the people of sub-continent. It has proved in the past and still proving through violence/ wars among Muslims. There is not much we can expect when we don't trust each other. May be someday we will realise the futility of our actions.

RK

 

[Blossom]

If at all we wish to address the Indo-Pak issues, we have to accept some truths with all honesty. Making smiling faces won't help. With all honest I wish to point out;

1. Majority of Indians did not like the creation of Pakistan. My single reason of not liking is that this amounted to our disrespect. Indians lived fairly happily for centuaries and we fought together with invaders. India gave everything to Muslims. In creation of Pakistan we felt a sense of rejection. I am sure most of Pakistanis have their own reasons and I am not questioning anyone.

2. There is no doubt that majority of Indians don't trust Pakistanis and I suppose vice verse. This distrust is part of our history and creation. Its not going to go away so easily and we have to live or die with this.

In my view above is the basic disease and rest all are symptoms. Can we control the disease till we find the cure? I am sure there are lots of sensible brains on both side. Does anyone have a solution? I know people will come with all sorts of solutions. Most of them have already been talked and tried. Nothing has worked. Let me be honest. Even if we hand over Kashmir, create five more mini Pakistans, this is not going to help. I will go even further. Even if whole India accepts Islam, its not going to help. In my view Islam alone can not bind the people of sub-continent. It has proved in the past and still proving through violence/ wars among Muslims. There is not much we can expect when we don't trust each other. May be someday we will realise the futility of our actions.

RK

Pakistan is an Islamic country and it was made for Muslims with some different perspectives and objectives.It goes without saying.Why feeling of rejection?What about those Muslims who never shifted and preferred to stay in India?What kind of feeling do you have at there?Muslim population in India has exceeded over that in Pakistan..
Is not about handing Kashmir over.Don't overlook the fact.Its about freedom and the right of self determination.
and Islam? whats the point?I mean why is it always has to racial and incomplete without religion?You're what you project to the world.Do you go around asking people their religion before start talking?
Muslims wanted their Independent ,undisputed state where they can perform religious activities with freedom.Thats it.When did it happen that they demanded whole of India to accept Islam?
I won't comment further because you're distorting the thread.Thank you.

 

[rajk20002002]

Pakistan is an Islamic country and it was made for Muslims with some different perspectives and objectives.It goes without saying.Why feeling of rejection?What about those Muslims who never shifted and preferred to stay in India?What kind of feeling do you have at there?Muslim population in India has exceeded over that in Pakistan..
Is not about handing Kashmir over.Don't overlook the fact.Its about freedom and the right of self determination.
and Islam? whats the point?I mean why is it always has to racial and incomplete without religion?You're what you project to the world.Do you go around asking people their religion before start talking?
Muslims wanted their Independent ,undisputed state where they can perform religious activities with freedom.Thats it.When did it happen that they demanded whole of India to accept Islam?
I won't comment further because you're distorting the thread.Thank you.

As I had already mentioned, we have different perspectives on almost everything. Doesn't matter how honestly I put my views, they would appear to be distorted. I have not questioned those who wanted Pakistan. I just wrote how I and most others feel. I know , we are poles apart on everything and this is why these problems.

RK

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Well, the opinion polls while presenting one set of facts are not sufficient to prove that the curriculum is not having the impact it was designed to have.

Unless we see the sample size, statistical errors etc. it would be hasty to draw conclusions from that.

Then there is the fact of so many other facts that present themselves. Pakistani media writings, the various anti-India groups in Pakistan that actually attract people who are ready to kill themselves and innocents in India, the inclinations of many people in this forum and some other more extreme ones, the youtube videos posted by Pakistanis, popularity of the likes of Zaid Hamid and his anti-India message etc. do convey a picture different from your conclusions here.

The ease with which so many people in Pakistan start bashing "Hindu" India is a proof that the people who designed the curriculum did not totally fail in their attempts.

Please feel free to look at all the poll related data on their respective websites, and provide your objections.

Gallup, Pew research etc. are all extremely well established organizations with a history of conducting accurate polling. That and the fact that multiple polls taken over multiple years bay multiple polling organizations have offered the same result adds tremendous credibility to the conclusions they draw.

Your argument against that is an unscientific 'opinion' based on articles you have read, or the views of a handful of people on a forum that you perceive as 'anti-Indian'. This is gibberish.

I could point out even more nasty and derogatory comments against Pakistanis by Indians from websites with far higher traffic. I could also point to writings by reputable authors, former government officials and military officers, that drip with anti-Pakistan hatred, and also argue that the 'ease with which so many Indians fall into bashing Pakistan', and Indian you tube videos is indicative of a sustained and systematic brainwashing and propaganda campaign in India.

Nothing has been presented to refute the conclusions arrived at by the various polls - which are the only empirical evidence on this thread so far, collected over multiple years by multiple reputable organizations.

You are trying to argue against the weight of a whole lot of evidence staring you right in the face, and refusing to acknowledge that evidence. I almost suspect that propagandist brainwashing thing in India is true... you seem so influenced by it that you cannot think beyond it.