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Diffrences Between White House and Pentagon over India

Dont mistake a few of our leaders being bribed or bullied into following American diktat into thinking the majority of Pakistanis wanting an alliance with American
and those few are elected by majority..and in a sense only those few are responsible to run pakistan and its FP. secondly PA, which obivously is being supported by majority of pakistanis, are in direct line of Pentagon and PA is the biggest beneficiary of the American aid whom you are despising now..(every one know why)..
but now it seems you guys are disenchanted with USA but dont worry they wont let you slip so easily..bhai aakhir pichle 64 saalo ka yaaarana hai.. :)
 
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I wish the US,UK remain supreme in the world,I respect the Chinese too.
 
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I wish the US,UK remain supreme in the world,I respect the Chinese too.
Hillbillies and rednecks chanting "nuke iraq/iran/pakistan/france/mecca/india/china/every other country they dont like and probably cant find in a map or pronounce right" ruling the world?
I feel safer already.
 
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Hillbillies and rednecks chanting "nuke iraq/iran/pakistan/france/mecca/india/china/every other country they dont like and probably cant find in a map or pronounce right" ruling the world?
I feel safer already.

Well if given a chance your Hafiz Syed types will gladly n-bomb India,US, Israel or whichever infidels they don't like..and hillbillies and rednecks have much lesser say in US politics than your Hafez Syed.
 
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Well if given a chance your Hafiz Syed types will gladly n-bomb India,US, Israel or whichever infidels they don't like..and hillbillies and rednecks have much lesser say in US politics than your Hafez Syed.
The difference is, Paksitan's 1% has the guns and the money to give an impressiion of the whole country as radicals
But america's 99% are braindead and cant stay away from politics for long.
 
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The difference is, Paksitan's 1% has the guns and the money to give an impressiion of the whole country as radicals
But america's 99% are braindead and cant stay away from politics for long.

Only Pakistan's 1% has guns...don't lie dude.
 
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Is it too much to ask you Indians to read what your former Ambassador said before you go off at a tangent:

Blah blah blah....

In a game of chess its not only about moving your piece to win but forcing opponent to move her pieces for the same.

Pakistan is more isolated, than India ever in 60 years of history.

India is rightly changing the shift the way it wants with cautious pace, not the way Pakistanis or 50 centers are projecting. India has its own internal issues/inherited mentality which might have made our position awkward at times but mind you whatever we did was not 'doing without knowing' but well thought off choices, unlike kind of 'doing without knowing' blunders Pakistan has been doing.

Whatever Mr. Bhadrakumar has said is his opinion and if you could have been sound enough then you could have seen his opinion more anti Pakistan than what you thought is against Indians participating in this thread.

He is knotting you with China faster and tighter than even your own Government and establishment would have wanted.

For sake of your black and white POV I would make a very simple assertion that Pakistan with USA wasn't able to do squat against India nor she be able to do a squat being higher than mountain friend of China.
 
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Blah blah blah....

In a game of chess its not only about moving your piece to win but forcing opponent to move her pieces for the same.

Pakistan is more isolated, than India ever in 60 years of history.

India is rightly changing the shift the way it wants with cautious pace, not the way Pakistanis or 50 centers are projecting. India has its own internal issues/inherited mentality which might have made our position awkward at times but mind you whatever we did was not 'doing without knowing' but well thought off choices, unlike kind of 'doing without knowing' blunders Pakistan has been doing.

Whatever Mr. Bhadrakumar has said is his opinion and if you could have been sound enough then you could have seen his opinion more anti Pakistan than what you thought is against Indians participating in this thread.

He is knotting you with China faster and tighter than even your own Government and establishment would have wanted.

For sake of your black and white POV I would make a very simple assertion that Pakistan with USA wasn't able to do squat against India nor she be able to do a squat being higher than mountain friend of China.

Excellent reply! :enjoy:
 
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@rkjindal91 , While your assessment is valid in its entirety, India cannot offer US what Pakistan does, that is access to five strategic crossroads connecting the most populus and energy rich regions of Asia.
India can only dream on and try harder to catch with China..there is still a lot of nonsense in India where as China is more mature no-nonsense type country!
 
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I would say that M.K.Bhadrakumar a diplomat in the Indian Foreign Service. Devoted 3-decade long career to the Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iran desks in the Ministry of External Affairs and in assignments on the territory of the former Soviet Union. Other diplomatic assignments abroad included as Ambassador to Turkey and Uzbekistan and Acting/Deputy High Commissioner in Islamabad, besides postings in the Indian Missions in Bonn, Colombo and Seoul. Briefly held charge as Charge d’Affaires in the Indian embassies in Kuwait and Kabul knows more than you arm chair internet warriors this is what he had to say:

Dai Bingguo heading for Islamabad

Francis Fukuyama wrote a sequel to his celebrated book The End of History and the Last Man (1992) no sooner than he realised that he was hopelessly wrong in his prediction that the global triumph of political and economic liberalism was at hand. He wrote: “What we may be witnessing is not just the end of the Cold War, or the crossing of a particular period of postwar history, but the end of history as such… That is, the end point of mankind’s ideological evolution and the universalization of Western democracy as the final form of human government.” But in no time he realised his rush to judgment and he retracted with another book.

However, unlike the celebrated American neocon thinker, Indian foreign policy thinkers who were heavily influenced by his 1992 thesis are yet to retract. The Indian discourses through the 1990s drew heavily from Fukuyama to throw overboard the scope for reinventing or reinterpreting ‘non-alignment’ in the post-Cold War setting and came to a rapid judgment that Russia belonged to the dustbin of history. Our discourses never really got updated despite Fukumaya’s own retraction.

Indeed, western commentators also fuelled the consequent sense of insecurity in Delhi through the 1990s by endorsing that India would never have a ‘Russia option’ again and Boris Yeltsin’s Russia itself was inexorably becoming an ‘ally’ of the west — and, therefore, what alternative is there for India but to take to the New American Century project? Remember the drama of the Bill Clinton administration arm-twisting Yeltsin not to give to India the cryogentic engines?

In sum, India got entrapped in a ‘unipolar predicament’. The best elucidation of this self-invited predicament has been the masterly work titled Crossing the Rubicon by Raja Mohan, which was of course widely acclaimed in the US. While releasing the book at a function in Delhi, the then National Security Advisor Brajesh Mishra even admitted that India’s main foreign policy challenge was somehow to engage the US’s “attention”.

Russia, of course, went on to prove our pundits completely wrong. Russia remerged as a global player and the evidence of it is today spread (and is poised to expand) all across global theatres — Libya, Syria, Iran, Central Asia, Afghanistan, etc.
Why I am underscoring all this is that I am strongly reminded of that sad chapter in the recent history of India’s foreign policy when I see the huge ‘psywar’ being let loose on Pakistan currently when that country too is at a crossroads with regard to its future policy directions in a highly volatile external enviornment.

In Pakistan’s case, the ‘psywar’ substitutes Russia with China. The US’s ‘Track II’ thesis is that China is hopelessly marooned in its own malaise so much so that it has no time, interest or resources to come to Pakistan’s aid, the two countries’ ‘all-weather friendship’ notwithstanding. Let me cull out two fine pieces of this ongoing ‘psywar’.

One is the lengthy article featured by America’s prestigious flag-carrier Foreign Affairs magazine in early December titled “China’s Pakistan conundrum”. Its argument is: ‘China will not simply bail out Pakistan with loans, investment, and aid, as those watching the deterioration of US-Pakistani relations seem to expect. China will pursue politics, security, and geopolitical advantage regardless of Islamabad’s preferences’. It puts forth the invidious argument that China’s real use for Pakistan is only to “box out New Delhi in Afghanistan and the broader region.”

Alongside the argument is the highly-tendentious vector that is beyond easy verification, namely, that US and China are increasingly ‘coordinating’ their policies toward Pakistan. Diplomacy is part dissimulation and we simply don’t know whether the US and China are even anywhere near beginning to ‘coordinate’ about ‘coordinating’ their regional policies in South Asia, especially with regard to Pakistan (and Afghanistan). The odds are that while the US and China may have some limited convergent interests, conceivably, their strategic interests are most certainly in sharp conflict.

A milder version of this frontal attack by US pundits on Pakistan’s existential dilemma appears in Michael Krepon’s article last week titled ‘Pakistan’s Patrons’, which, curiously, counsels Islamabad to follow India’s foreign-policy footsteps and make up with the US. Krepon literally suggests that the Pakistanis are living in a fool’s paradise.

The obvious thrust of this ‘psywar’ — strikingly similar to what India was subjected to in the 1990s — is that Pakistan has no option but to fall in line with the US regional strategies, as it has no real ‘China option’. The main difference between India and Pakistan is that the foreign policy elites in Islamabad — unlike their Indian counterparts — are not inclined to buy into the US argument with a willing suspension of disbelief.
In a way, the Sino-Pakistan relationship is proving once again to be resilient. Pakistan is in no mood to get into a ‘unipolar predicament’, as the Indian elites willingly did in the 1990s.

Thus, the visit by the Chinese delegation led by State Councilor, Dai Bingguo to Islamabad at this point in time assumes much significance. Dai is one of the highest-ranking figures in the Chinese foreign-policy establishment and the fact he is leading a delegation that includes of senior Chinese military officials is very significant. Dai is scheduled to meet not only Pakistan’s political leadership at the highest level but also army chief Ashfaq Kayani and ISI head Ahmed Shuja Pasha.

Obviously, Beijing is making a big point through the timing of this visit as well, which, incidentally, is taking place at a time of great uncertainties in Pakistan’s internal affairs. When it comes to relations with China, it must be assumed that Pakistan’s civil and military leaderships are together.

Dai doesn’t really have a US counterpart as he is ranked above the FM. Arguably, it would be secretary of state Hillary Clinton. If so, to what extent Dai ‘coordinated’ his proposed visit with Clinton will be of particular interest. The future of the US’s ‘psywar’ on Pakistan is at stake.

The big question is whether this would be Dai’s last major trip to South Asia, as he is a key member of President Hu Jintao’s team and China is moving into a period of transition at the leadership level. Dai’s visit to Delhi for the Special Representatives meet was called off at the last minute.
Posted in Diplomacy, Politics.
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By M K Bhadrakumar – December 23, 2011

Dai Bingguo heading for Islamabad - Indian Punchline

---------- Post added at 10:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 PM ----------




Just read the above article and then weep
:rofl:

---------- Post added at 10:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:00 PM ----------




Just read the above article and then weep
:rofl:

LOLLL weep about what??? I asked you a simple question show me proof of the soviets saying that.
 
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