Did India really 've OFFENSIVE doctrines??

[Zarvan]

It all started when admin Horus called Indian doctrines offensive while maintaining that our neighbor has always been mellifluous and had defensive doctrines.As discussing Op-Brasstacks and Op-Parakram was off topic on another thread I was asked to create a new thread.



Ignoratio elenchi!!

• Let me remind you that we have a "no first use policy" when it comes to nuclear arsenal.But Pakistan has been vague, Pakistan has stated that it may use its nuclear arsenal under a number of different circumstances including to fend off a conventional attack and even if India tries to strangle it economically.
• wasn't it the Pakistani tribesmen and militants who made it to Baramulla sector and ran amok?Kashmir (region, Indian subcontinent) :: The Kashmir problem -- Encyclopedia Britannica
• Or lets take Kargil, by a Pakistani officer 's confession (Capt.Sambal,8 Northern light Infantry) even the highest ranking officers of PA were aware of the infiltration.

And then you came up with your own version of Sunderji doctrine

which was later debunked here..
Indian Army News & Discussions | Page 84

I dont mind you debunking shibboleth's theories on Pakistan's defence budget but pls dont come up with statements which 've blunders of gargantuan proportions blaming things on India..If India aimed at revanchism then it would not 've maintained its stance that LOC should be made IB.


I pointed at WHY it was named Ghauri.


India's past doctrine??
which one?? Sunderji ,is it??
I've already proved you wrong on that.


so what was Op Brass Tacks??
Brasstacks crises was nothing but accidental crises, caused by Pakistan's misinterpretation.The magnitude and large scale direction of the exercise led to Pakistan fears that India was displaying an overwhelming conventional superiority and was planning to invade Pakistan, which came out of the lessons from '71 winter war.
Was India being offensive by not even firing a shot???
To prove its intentions were peaceful during the exercise, India took the unusual step of inviting diplomats and journalists to observe the operation separately. AFAIK even a Pakistani diplomat was invited.

ON INDIA'S BORDER, A HUGE MOCK WAR - New York Times


One,Operation Parakram was launched in the wake of the December 13, 2001 terrorist attack on Parliament and the 10 month deployment ended without a conflict.
Two,Op-Parakram had 3 aims mobilising the army to the border — defeating cross border terrorism without conflict,containing the national mood to “teach Pak a lesson” and in the case of war,degrading the neighbouring nation’s war fighting capabilities.
Three,after US and other western governments stepped in with diplomatic manoeuvres General Musharraf made an ashen faced commitment in a nationally telecast speech on January 12, 2002, that Pakistan “will not permit any terrorist activity from its soil” and then India backed-off.
Again was India being offensive here?


I wasnt expecting you to accept it with alacrity.You could 've avoided this debate had you not been polemic about India in your article.You should've restricted it to debunking the myths ONLY.


continued from this thread


*** Trolls not invited but contributors 're welcome***

India has intention of maintaing offensive policy against us but thanks to our nuclear power it has failed to implement it yet

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Sure, sure. care to give an example?

latest Example :
A) See when PAK gone for LOC/IB border firing to UN and US what are their response?

B) What happened in Kargil? Even china told PAK to back off. despite PAK claims they are undefended unit.

C) Nuclear Deal with India while PAK keep asking for it.

India has intention of maintaing offensive policy against us but thanks to our nuclear power it has failed to implement it yet

A) It might change soon, as overall part india is now building offensive n defensive position against china.

B) with ABM / and Nuclear tried in place , india can take things at next level.

latest Border firing is the part of starting.

 

[Zarvan]

latest Example :
A) See when PAK gone for LOC/IB border firing to UN and US what are their response?

B) What happened in Kargil? Even china told PAK to back off. despite PAK claims they are undefended unit.

C) Nuclear Deal with India while PAK keep asking for it.



A) It might change soon, as overall part india is now building offensive n defensive position against china.

B) with ABM / and Nuclear tried in place , india can take things at next level.

latest Border firing is the part of starting.

Yes you are free to live in dreams try to take it to next level we would take it to even higher level and whole of India would be wiped out

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Yes you are free to live in dreams try to take it to next level we would take it to even higher level and whole of India would be wiped out

lol ..... India told this to PAK in Kargil when Mush said we use Nuke , after he back out....Till now India is waiting to counter from PAK nuke blackmail, ABM and Triad is will eliminate this .....

if you know the ABC of ABM , you can't wipe out India , but one cannot say about PAK.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Pakistan doesn't have a strike corps? Which world are you living in, friend?

Pakistan has two strike corps - I Corps, also known as I Strike Corps or Army Reserve North, headquartered in Mangla and II Corps, also known as II Strike Corps or Army Reserve South which is stationed in Multan.

Elements of II Strike Corps are presently engaged in Op Zarb-e-azb in NW.

Like you just mentioned, I only see a Pakistani ranting needlessly to prove his innocence. But it's never too late to catch up with PA's ORBAT (Order of Battle). Just needs a little effort on your part.

The DIFFERENCE Sir lies in the relative SIZE of the Strike Corps

On paper we have 3 Strike Corps compared to their 2
But the Size of each one of them ...... is enough to send a chill down the enemy's spine

Lately however the Pivot corps / Holding corps too have been reinforced with plenty of Striking power
so that they can start operations on their own

 

[SipahSalar]

B) with ABM / and Nuclear tried in place , india can take things at next level.

Which ABM are you talking about?

 

[surya kiran]

@levina

Forget what uncle horus says. He is indoctrinated in the Pakistani area of self righteousness and grandeur through the Zia version of history.

Why do you even bother?

Having said that, Indian doctrine has changed. And this is not during the time of the current government, but the last. The posturing is more aggressive and from whatever I have heard and read, there will be repercussions to any adventures in Kashmir by the Pakistanis. This need not mean a military push, but, the same language the Pakistanis understand. You will see a more than proportionate response, like I have said earlier, in Balochistan and Sindh. And mark my words, they will burn.

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Which ABM are you talking about?

ignorance is at highest ....

 

[Xeric]

So, @levina
Theory of Simultaneity, Cold Start, Pro Active Operations all are 'defensive' concepts?

So are cutting Pakistan into two halves, Dissecting GT road, Surgical Strikes and finding Space for war under a Nuclear Overhang, right?

#fml

The Indian Amphibious brigade now converted to Reorganised Amphibious Formation (RAMFOR) is also defensive, right?

 

[ranjeet]

The Indian Amphibious brigade now converted to Reorganised Amphibious Formation (RAMFOR) is also defensive, right?

how does a retaliatory option is considered offensive? Attacking Pakistan unprovoked in not in our interest, but If India is provoked further beyond a point by the proxy non state actor, India reserve the right to respond in the best possible way they can.

 

[Xeric]

how does a retaliatory option is considered offensive? Attacking Pakistan unprovoked in not in our interest, but If India is provoked further beyond a point by the proxy non state actor, India reserve the right to respond in the best possible way they can.

Kid, we are discussing the Security POLICY of countries here (Try to understand the difference between Policy, Strategy and Doctrine first), not what will you do or what shall we do if this happens or that shyt blows up.

So, just sit around and learn!

 

[ranjeet]

Kid, we are discussing the Security POLICY of countries here (Try to understand the difference between Policy, Strategy and Doctrine first), not what will you do or what shall we do if this happens or that shyt blows up.

So, just sit around and learn!

Thank you Sire for bringing my attention to the difference between Policy, Strategy and Doctrine, the humble disciple here thought the whole discussion was about the word in Capital letters in the title.

I will sit around and learn.

 

[Xeric]

Thank you Sire for bringing my attention to the difference between Policy, Strategy and Doctrine, the humble disciple here thought the whole discussion was about the word in Capital letters in the title.

I will sit around and learn.

Guud boy.

See, even the OP can be mistaken at times, thanks for understanding.

 

[rockstar08]

India will always look up for opportunities to attack Pakistan , even if the have any doctrine or not , they still have a large force which can outnumber us anything ,
and let alone the future purchases of India in term of Weapons , " India ki Neeyat Achi nai lagti mujhe "

 

[Xeric]

Even though none of my previous two points have been answered by defensive Indians, i still ask; when India says that "there exists a Space for Limited War within the Nuclear umbrella between Pakistan and India", how the eff can this be termed as being defensive?!

"Seeking" space for war, that too between nuclear armed belligerents is NOT being defensive!