Did I Say Pakistani? I meant Indian - Dr Sabreena Razaq Hussain

[karan.1970]

Well OK there... "most Pakistanis" and "facts". Sounds like you've done some independent research there and are associated to a well-known research organization.

Though going by your history, you're most likely setting up a trollbait for yourself.

Why is it that only bharatis claim that Pakistanis try to pass off as bharatis? What you hear from non-bharatis (in personal experience) is that when you call a Pakistani a bharati, they tend to get offended. This extends into the realm of stories that bharatis have made themselves believe about Pakistan where they think everyone in the world agrees with them, but really is no one actually gives a crap about what they think.

Well, the article in the OP is not from a Bhartiya.. Its from a Pakistani.. And yes, the use of word most was incorrect and an error on my part which I have corrected..

 

[cyphercide]

Actually, you could be very right about that! I mean that impression part.

About this discrimination abroad, I can only talk about what I have seen on a handful of airports, mainly Dubai and Heathrow. I have traveled through Dubai only 3 times, and Heathrow only twice. While the burka clad women passed on smoothly, the ones mostly checked and asked various questions were the well dressed young men coming from Pakistan.

The traditionally dressed ones had least problems of all the travelers.

Probably. Why else would she lie in the presence of someone who already knows the truth about her?

Not that it bears any weight on the current discussion, but I hope you don't mind me asking where you are from.

 

[Kompromat]

You are assuming that they do not have dual Nationality... I thought it was possible for a overseas born person of Pakistani descent to retain both nationalities.

Holding a Pakistani passport from your parents doesn't make you a Pakistani. Its not an ethnic/linguistic/racial identity. Pakistan is a multicultural state like other new nation states in the world. If you are not born and bead here, you may call claim the Pakistani heritage but you are not a Pakistani. It takes being born,raised,educated here to know what it means to be a Pakistani.

 

[karan.1970]

Holding a Pakistani passport from your parents doesn't make you a Pakistani. Its not an ethnic/linguistic/racial identity. Pakistan is a multicultural state like other new nation states in the world. If you are not born and bead here, you may call claim the Pakistani heritage but you are not a Pakistani. It takes being born,raised,educated here to know what it means to be a Pakistani.

Oh! Come On.. That's just a load of smoke screen. There is one and only one determination of nationality and that is the official citizenship.

By your logic, the suicide bomber who blew up 78 Christians in Pakistan today was more Pakistani than a British Doctor of Pakistani descent who was born to his Pakistani parents in UK or Canada, believes in goodness and sends a quarter million dollars of remittances to Pakistan every year.. ?

 

[Kompromat]

Oh! Come On.. That's just a load of smoke screen. There is one and only one determination of nationality and that is the official citizenship.

By your logic, the suicide bomber who blew up 78 Christians in Pakistan today was more Pakistani than a British Doctor of Pakistani descent who was born to his Pakistani parents in UK or Canada, believes in goodness and sends a quarter million dollars of remittances to Pakistan every year.. ?

Believe what you have to. Pakistani is not an ethno-linguistic/racial identity. Its more like being an Australian or Canadian - where you don't relate to such an identity.

Kids that are born overseas have zero understanding of Pakistani culture, they can claim heritage but not nationality. Officially yes, passport is a piece of paper.

 

[Hulk]

I was roaming around with my bangladeshi friends .. somebody asked us a lighter.. and while lighting his cigaretter asked where are you guys from.. bangladesh..I said.. while rest of them said India....

It have similar experience. I was at Johannesburg (SA), I went to a pan shop. Asked him where he is from, he said India, I asked India main kahan se? Bangladesh. Since when Bangladesh is in India. I can understand faking to whites, but why to us? This is very common there and same story with most Pakistanis.

 

[SQ8]

Not to point out the OP's malicious intent(but then again, more often than not the flag underneath that name inspires cheap shots and hatred) to create flames where this could have been put up for more amicable discussion; The identification as Indian is not a random occurrence and is done out of embarrassment and sometimes exploitation.
Twofold reasons for that are.

1. Being identified as a Pakistani automatically paints the image of a land torn by strife and religious/ethnic intolerance, perhaps not much so in the mind of the person being lied to but in the mind of the person pretending to be Indian. After all, such a person may also be exposed to only the news of bombs and corrupt money leaves their own self esteem arising as a Pakistani in threat. Hence, take the Indian identity; you may be target of racism but at least there can be an imaginary rebuke of India doing well otherwise.

2. Both Business and Employment contacts react better to Indian: their economy is doing better and hence these contacts see potential to further their business or get more repute out while the person in question fulfils their motives.

With the above being on the table, such occurrences are still rare and even now there will be a vociferous rebuke from most British Pakistanis if you try to label them Indian. Nor they indulge in such practices commonly.
The ratio is similar to that of Japanese in the US during WWII.

The OP is warned about trying to be a smart alec, otherwise I shall indulge his motives much more intently the next time.

 

[Kompromat]

Since The original troll post was deleted, i have deleted my replies. Sometimes it becomes necessary to pull the mirror.

Best Regards

 

[cloud_9]

The instances of such occurrences are very rare and probably significantly more bharatis call themselves American or British than Pakistanis call themselves Indians. A few isolated occurrences have no real meaning. Though it does give the bharatis something to gloat about like the kids they are.

LOL! Never seen one.Most will identify themselves as Indian - XXXXX.There's no way an Indian will try to hide his Indian identity and neither does the facial features allow us

 

[Zarvan]

this, by a member of Imran Khan's PTI, who if the natives on this forum are to be believed, is the rightful successor to Jinnah, a big deal for a pakistani, I suppose



Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

let the denials begin - "bharti" conspiracy, propaganda, she is not even a pakistani, yada...yada...yada

the more intelligent native could argue, she based her article on only 1 person. That still doesn't rebut similar older articles making similar claims.

Increasing body of evidence, pakistanis embarrassed/ashamed of their roots

Jana ji @Spring Onion your "nuanced" posts make for fine reading. Please contribute.

They are basically those people who are always too obsessed with west Sir and always too ashamed of what they are and from where they come from you would not see any religious guy doing this these these type of people are even found in Pakistan they are more westerners than people of west

 

[Spring Onion]

I think itS because Indians and pakistanis are same in many ways , you cannot say you are chinese and hope the other person will belive you.

)) its more embarrassing to change your look from shty to shyttier .

I would always stick to shyty look instead of turning shyttier.


One thing I must say these kinda Pakistanis are having complexion curse that is not leaving them.

 

[notorious_eagle]

let the denials begin - "bharti" conspiracy, propaganda, she is not even a pakistani, yada...yada...yada

the more intelligent native could argue, she based her article on only 1 person. That still doesn't rebut similar older articles making similar claims.

Increasing body of evidence, pakistanis embarrassed/ashamed of their roots

Jana ji @Spring Onion your "nuanced" posts make for fine reading. Please contribute.

Let me tell you something about Westerners in general. I don't know how much time you have spent abroad or how much exposure you have of the West, but as i have spent a considerable amount of time in the Western World, i believe i am qualified to make this statement.

The Westerners on general don't give a damn whether you are from India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal, China or Malaysia. Most of them cannot even point these countries on a World Map. Its not because they are dumb, its because simply they don't care. They are more interested in going to watch Iron Man on the weekend or go out clubbing/bar hopping on the weekends rather than discuss whose Indian or Pakistan.

The one thing i admire about the Western society is that people in general don't care if you are gay, lesbian, straight, bi, Pakistani, Indian, Buddhist, Parsi or into BDSM. As long as you don't interfere in their personal lives, they are cool with anyone living in their country. We South Asians might be obsessed with the Western culture and way of life but i can assure you they certainly are not. So please, get off this high course and accept the reality. No one gives a damn whether you are Indian or Pakistani. As long as you don't bug them, they are cool with you.

P.S. I am yet to meet a Pakistani who has called himself Indian in the West. The only instance i can remember of was when one Pakistani was caught in campus doing something bad, and upon inquiry by the Campus Security he said that he was Indian. Called himself Prem Chopra .

 

[krash]

This is going to be another one of my long posts and I apologize in advance.

Feel awkward calling yourself pakistani? Then the other option would be to live in a country where you will not be embarrassed about who you are. It is the same instinct that all capable and educated brown people have. Not fixing the problem but rather masking it to the point that these articles are printed.

No electricity -> buy a UPS -> UPS stops working -> Buy a generator -> No fuel for the generator -> Start applying for visa's.

Plus, I do not think any brown person is in turmoil over what to choose. Dignity or Money? They have made their decision and now baffled at how their choice is being upstaged by the uneducated people they left behind to represent them.

I would go as far as saying that they are just as bloody handed as the ones who have stayed back, if not more. It is easy to claim grandiosity for these people; I left because I didn't like the system, I couldn't take the jahiliyat, I couldn't take the mentality, yada, yada, yada. In truth they were the system, they are the jahils, they have that mentality and they are the leaches that bled the country, and that is exactly why they left (This is quite apparent the moment they land back for their holidays). You can see the insecurity dripping from their mouths and their desperation to make you believe that they were always goras at heart and way above the 'Pakistaniat'. But funnily its pretty easy to break them apart to what they really are. My uncle tried to give me this speech when he picked me up from the airport, doesn't talk to me any more.

What of the man's claimed 'principles' who can't identify his duties and responsibilities? I laugh at that.

ps: Of course there are always many exceptions and many different stories. I know of people who don't wish for anything more than to have not migrated at all.

I agree, Pakistani is just a nationality anyway.

Maybe to you but there are those of us for whom it is our identity, goes with our names. And we are proud of it.

Pakistani is not an enthno-linguistic/racial identity,its like being an Australian or a Canadian. If you are not born and raised here, you are not one of us as a matter of identity. It takes living and experiencing a culture, its goods and ills, strengths and weaknesses, in order to adopt that identity.

Overseas born and bread kids are technically not Pakistanis - they have British/American/Canadian with 'Pakistani heritage'.

Not quite, Pakistanis are overwhelmingly natives to the lands which belong to Pakistan. Canadians and Australians are the ones who hold the respective passports. But of course your main point is quite true.

For the article and OP:

The first thing that needs to be realized is that you cannot expect affinity from someone who has had no link to the subject except for an ancestorial link. Separated children don't feel any affinity to the absentee Parent either. Couple this with the current international image that Pakistan is shown in I'm not surprised that she did that. Just to drive in my point further, I had a neighbor who is as brown as brown can be but is named Scott, identifies himself as a Canadian. Took me two weeks to get out of him that his parents migrated from India when he was born. "My parents used to be Indian, but not any more. I was never Indian", is what he said. Their's another named Hriday, responds only to the name Friday and another named Preetam who only responds to the name Peter. I don't really blame these second generations.

All that said there certainly is this sense of inferiority in us brown people to the whites. I've seen them take ridicule after ridicule from a whitey and still lick his jewels. As if answering them would make one's face melt off. We always wan't to be their friends, hang out with them, even if it costs us our dignity. I've seen a Pakistani change his tone the day he got his citizenship. I don't really agree with @notorious_eagle, people are perceptive doesn't matter which color they are of. And these perceptions always play a roll in every relationship. Due to the dynamics of different societies, in some places the effect is more in some it is less. But it is not correct at all that a westerner living two doors away from you will take you as just another neighbor. The first perception they have of us is that we are pushovers, idiots and lesser, due to the reasons explained above. But all of this, more often than not, has nothing to do with Pakistan. It's the people and, for all I care, they can do whatever they want.

 

[forcetrip]

There is no such thing as an indian or pakistani who lives abroad. There is only brown. You just have to convince them that you are either mexican brown or indian brown. Indian brown entails all the south east asian's even nepalis and srilankans. The Nepali I knew had a tough time cause he was way too fair and looked nepali. Because of him most white people thought nepal is a province in China.

 

[Foo_Fighter]

Just for the bolded part below:

Pakistan’s ‘shame’: Rape cases in 2012 – The Express Tribune

Rape happens everywhere some get reported some don't. Infact I read a British article where almost 1 out of 10 women were being raped or sexually molested. However, bombing REGULLARLY happens in a few specific country. Now don't ask me which countries they are.

Just to ask you, where exactly was "kiran" headed off to do philanthropic work? Pakistan or India? I mean after her misdirecting the gentleman about where she was going.

The public perception of that country by the white guy was that pakistan is somewhere not to travel, due to the bombings all over the country. This white guy knew about the bombings. What if the guy asked her if she was safe from being raped in India? What if this was some other person who read up on the constant rape tickers all plastered on CNN every time I opened it? What would she say then? She would say that it does not happen everywhere just like the bombings do not happen everywhere in Pakistan. One person does not make a country. And especially not someone who does not live in this country or has no ulterior motives other than vacationing or forgotten extended family. The people that represent pakistan and india are the uneducated and in worse cases the educated exploiters who would rather keep these countries as their bathrooms. Charity starts at home, first make it your home and then I would feel offended that if a Pakistani or Indian wants to be something else.