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Dhaka vs Kolkata

We could have talked about our issues here, a comparative analysis of living standards, scope of improvement, how to make things better, perhaps a greater degree of economic cooperation. But no, just had to take it the wrong way. Some really narrow minded people I saw in this thread.
 
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I am not comparing BD with entire India, just with largest state Maharastra.Which is comparable to BD you know.

Tbh you are better off comparing states in India with similar GDP per capita to Bangladesh.

Almost all the states that have similar size economy to BD (i.e MH, TN, ex-Andhra combined, GJ) are much more richer than Bangladesh....so its quite unfair because they will simply trounce you with all these pictures. 1st, 2nd or 3rd tier doesnt matter.

Only WB (similar per capita, 2/3rd size of Bangladesh GDP) and UP ( lower per capita, 80% GDP of Bangladesh) are gonna make Bangladesh look good in various Economic and picture comparisons like what is already happening here.
 
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Depreciation of currency has little to do with inflation...there can be a correlation but it heavily depends on the particular scenario being talked about. One can happen without the other....sometimes both happens....sometimes they happen in opposite directions. The situation is complicated.

All Real GDP is doing is gauging the effective strength of an economic output instead of what is written on paper (Nominal)

Lets say India GDP was 100 US dollars in year 2000 and the same year Bangladesh was 10 dollars.

The next year India GDP goes to 110 US dollars and Bangladesh goes to 11 dollars (exact same nominal growth of 10%).

But during this year prices of goods and services in India increased by 5% and Bangladesh by 10%. Lets say no depreciation or appreciation happens anywhere w.r.t US dollar since we are highlighting the role of inflation only.

That effectively means in year 2001, we have 110 divided by 1.05 = 104.8 dollars of production compared to before for India.

For Bangladesh in 2001, we have 11 divided by 1.1 = 10 dollars.....which makes sense because 10% growth was countered by the 10% inflation.


Nominally you are producing more than last year in US dollars and the average worker is earning more than last year...be it in Takas or US dollars...lets say by 10% (because lets forget about investment, capital inflows through govt loans/net spending and net exports and focus on 100% consumption economy for simplification).

So a worker is earning 10% more than he did last year because of the 10% nominal growth....and his spending money has also increased by 10%....he will find he is still only able to buy the same amount of goods and services that he did last year....and thus he is also producing the same amount since we are talking about production - consumption simple sort of economy.

Basically the entire growth of the economy was done through printing more money. Your economy will increase nominally, but it wont increase in the real sense.....since people are still eating the same number of chapathis each day, buying the same number of TV sets, using the same amount of fuel.....you are in a stasis physically basically.

Thats why REAL growth is preferred to nominal growth at ALL times.

It does not matter if you are able to exchange your income in takas for 10 USD or 11 USD....if the 10 USD and 11 USD buy you the exact same number of goods and services locally. Whats worse is when 11 USD buys you even less than 10 USD did last year....but that is another topic.

There is also a related somewhat nuanced concept of PPP theory which has nothing to do with inflation...with real GDP numbers we are still assuming perfectly even purchasing power of every currency in the world....when comparing between countries.

I hope you understand this before you continue the discussion.

Now specific parts:



When you quote IMF figures, i will point out the intricacies of the full IMF prediction. They are predicting higher inflation in Bangladesh, not me. Take it up with them....or be prepared to accept all their data and predictions and not selective bits and pieces.



Like I said before, depreciation and inflation are two different economic phenomenon. You are mixing up the two. Depreciation/Appreciation is more related to the PPP theory I brought up earlier. If you want me to go into this, tell me...but for the moment it is straying off topic somewhat.

There might even theoretically be a time when 1 Bangladesh Taka buys more US dollars than 1 Indian Rupee.....but Indian Rupee has inflated much less than Bangladest Taka.



No. I am predicting growth acceleration in both countries. Just a higher growth acceleration in India. As with all predictions I am liable to be wrong. We will have to wait and see. I am actually more optimistic about Bangladesh than either IMF or World Bank. If Bangladesh plays its cards right it can get to a REAL growth rate higher than 7% and even 8%....which is quite phenomenal. But it needs SHW administration to take up some real strong reforms and initiatives similar to what Modi administration is doing and planning for India....it cannot accelerate much on cruise control. I am confident some of this will happen, more so because SHW administration will be watching what happens in India and implementing the successful ideas themselves....it is a global competition game right?



Past 5 years had a lousy govt for India for the majority. "wider economic gap" is such a general statement that I cannot say I predict that... since GDP and GDP per capita is only one small part of economic measurement anyways. For overall economic performance we will again have to wait and see. I too am not a big fan of predictions etc....my only qualm is that you cannot consider MH as the only state economy comparable to Bangladesh when there are many other contenders both by sheer size and dynamism...and improving economic climate. You are free to disagree and lets move on.



Uh not they aren't. Some are better in India, some are better in BD....and there are few major differences in most of them.

To me literacy rates and education are way more important than any other social indicator area....and thats one area where India is far ahead of Bangladesh. You are free to bring up any social indicator and I will give my 2 cents on why India or Bangladesh is worse. The general trend is that there are a few massive states in North India that are severely lagging in various indicators, bringing down the whole average....how those states now change politically to bring in more reform and action oriented govts and bureaucrats will be the main factor in getting these numbers improving at a faster rate.



Ask who exactly? Bangladeshis? Most neutral world sources (World Bank, IMF, UNDP, PWC, citibank, the economist etc) certainly do not think so judging by their growth rate predictions for India and Bangladesh. Most lie at 6-7% for Bangladesh and 7 - 8% for India when we talk about long term real growth rates. Unless you know something they don't?



Most stable? Thats a matter of opinion. If a country is swinging between 6% to 10% growth from year to year....it is not very stable....a country growing at 6% every year is way more stable.....but which hypothetical situation would you prefer?

"Low debt" by itself means nothing. I think what you mean is debt to GDP ratio right? I mean if a country produces 10 dollars worth every year and has a debt of 10 dollars......how would that compare to a country that produces 1000 dollars every year but has a debt of 500 dollars? Latter country has much higher absolute debt than the first one....is it in a worse situation though?

Public Debt/GDP ratio also has its limitations in simply comparing. FYI, Bangladesh has around 32% in this regard and India around 50%...but a country like Japan has debt/GDP of 226%! Singapore a phenomenally well managed country has a debt/GDP ratio of 111%. Many developed countries are in this ball park.....so obviously a simple debt/GDP ratio is not going to give the full story....rather many other factors come in like credit rating, financial stability, political and economic stability. These are all areas where India scores higher than Bangladesh.....there are no allegations of a stolen election, kangaroo courts, vote rigging, political assassinations and threats and an ever present looming threat of a coup and history of coups and history of all of these and bitter politics creating such a schism between the population.



Current account deficit in India is marginally around -1.5%...Bangladesh is near 0. Both of these are very low.

Developed countries: US for example has -2.4% UK has -5.5%.

India also has 350 billion USD of forex reserves compared to 25 billion USD for bangladesh. Per capita this is more than 274 dollars for India and 157 dollars for Bangladesh....so the difference in CAD is not a big deal....though credit should be given to Bangladesh that is it in a solid position compared to say Pakistan.

List of countries by current account balance as a percentage of GDP - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of countries by foreign-exchange reserves - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of countries and dependencies by population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Exports per capita:

India: 363 USD

Bangladesh: 194 USD

Ref: List of countries by exports - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Remittances are already reflected in the CAD argument....its not really something to be terribly proud of either....a necessary evil to give high paying jobs to "surplus" labour because conditions back home economically cannot abosrb them effectively.



Completely agree. Same is true for India. Best of luck to both countries!
I appreciate your knowledge and efforts:tup:.I have read few months ago about a respected bank's prediction which predicted Both India and BD in a league of top performing economy in future.So let's not tussle about future performance,keep our discussion simple to present or 1 or 2 years from now.There are many variable which can pull ahead one country against another as gap between growth in both country is not very large.:-)
 
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I appreciate your knowledge and efforts:tup:.I have read few months ago about a respected bank's prediction which predicted Both India and BD in a league of top performing economy in future.So let's not tussle about future performance,keep our discussion simple to present or 1 or 2 years from now.There are many variable which can pull ahead one country against another as gap between growth in both country is not very large

Agreed! Lets wait and see. I have been saying this from the beginning. I wish the best for Bangladesh. A more prosperous Bangladesh is in India's interests.

Nusraat Faria Mazhar :smitten:

Nusraat Faria Mazhar - Google Search

Just wanted to say I like your avatar, that chick is hot....someone called her fat:o:?!?!
 
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Tbh you are better off comparing states in India with similar GDP per capita to Bangladesh.

Almost all the states that have similar size economy to BD (i.e MH, TN, ex-Andhra combined, GJ) are much more richer than Bangladesh....so its quite unfair because they will simply trounce you with all these pictures. 1st, 2nd or 3rd tier doesnt matter.

Only WB (similar per capita, 2/3rd size of Bangladesh GDP) and UP ( lower per capita, 80% GDP of Bangladesh) are gonna make Bangladesh look good in various Economic and picture comparisons like what is already happening here.
My friend,Total economic size matters.China may have lower per capita income than say :Australia but that doesn't mean Australia is more important than China. You can't compare BD with Gujarat or Punjab as these economy are much smaller than BD although thay have more per capita income than Bangladesh.So economic size consideration the appropriate would be between Bangladesh and Maharastra.

Agreed! Lets wait and see. I have been saying this from the beginning. I wish the best for Bangladesh. A more prosperous Bangladesh is in India's interests.

Nusraat Faria Mazhar :smitten:

Nusraat Faria Mazhar - Google Search

Just wanted to say I like your avatar, that chick is hot....someone called her fat:o:?!?!
Yes,She is very hot.:enjoy:
 
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My friend,Total economic size matters.

To a degree it does.

China may have lower per capita income than say :Australia but that doesn't mean Australia is more important than China.

Are we talking about "importance" or economic livelihoods of the people?

You can't compare BD with Gujarat or Punjab as these economy are much smaller than BD

Gujarat is about 80% size of B'desh GDP. We have already discussed this many times, its getting boring. So lets agree to disagree here. Punjab yes, its population is much too small, its people would have to be 4 - 5 times richer than Bangladeshis to be around the GDP of Bangladesh.

Gujaratis have to be about 2 - 2.5 times richer than Bangladeshis for Gujarat to compare in total GDP size (Because population of Gujarat is 60 million compared to Punjab 27 million.). They are already 2 times richer now....hence 80% of Bangladesh GDP.

So economic size consideration the appropriate would be between Bangladesh and Maharastra.

If you are going by your particular definition of "importance" over everything else....then sure. But only WB and UP are at or below Bangladesh per capita income in the similar GDP category....so its going to be a pretty one-sided comparison with MH and TN especially (the 2 most industrialized, economically developed and urbanized states of entire India)....and gujarat and AP also (though bifurcation has reduced the "importance" as you put it of current AP, im talking about former united AP hehe).
 
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someone called her fat:o:?!?!

Don't bother about it, I just play around here. :P

I have my eyes on two Bangladeshi beauties, Nusrat Faria and Tanjin Tisha, I am just waiting for the day we invade Bangladesh! :D

@BDforever :whistle:

Depreciation of currency has little to do with inflation...there can be a correlation but it heavily depends on the particular scenario being talked about. One can happen without the other....sometimes both happens....sometimes they happen in opposite directions. The situation is complicated.

All Real GDP is doing is gauging the effective strength of an economic output instead of what is written on paper (Nominal)

Lets say India GDP was 100 US dollars in year 2000 and the same year Bangladesh was 10 dollars.

The next year India GDP goes to 110 US dollars and Bangladesh goes to 11 dollars (exact same nominal growth of 10%).

But during this year prices of goods and services in India increased by 5% and Bangladesh by 10%. Lets say no depreciation or appreciation happens anywhere w.r.t US dollar since we are highlighting the role of inflation only.

That effectively means in year 2001, we have 110 divided by 1.05 = 104.8 dollars of production compared to before for India.

For Bangladesh in 2001, we have 11 divided by 1.1 = 10 dollars.....which makes sense because 10% growth was countered by the 10% inflation.


Nominally you are producing more than last year in US dollars and the average worker is earning more than last year...be it in Takas or US dollars...lets say by 10% (because lets forget about investment, capital inflows through govt loans/net spending and net exports and focus on 100% consumption economy for simplification).

So a worker is earning 10% more than he did last year because of the 10% nominal growth....and his spending money has also increased by 10%....he will find he is still only able to buy the same amount of goods and services that he did last year....and thus he is also producing the same amount since we are talking about production - consumption simple sort of economy.

Basically the entire growth of the economy was done through printing more money. Your economy will increase nominally, but it wont increase in the real sense.....since people are still eating the same number of chapathis each day, buying the same number of TV sets, using the same amount of fuel.....you are in a stasis physically basically.

Thats why REAL growth is preferred to nominal growth at ALL times.

It does not matter if you are able to exchange your income in takas for 10 USD or 11 USD....if the 10 USD and 11 USD buy you the exact same number of goods and services locally. Whats worse is when 11 USD buys you even less than 10 USD did last year....but that is another topic.

There is also a related somewhat nuanced concept of PPP theory which has nothing to do with inflation...with real GDP numbers we are still assuming perfectly even purchasing power of every currency in the world....when comparing between countries.

I hope you understand this before you continue the discussion.

Now specific parts:



When you quote IMF figures, i will point out the intricacies of the full IMF prediction. They are predicting higher inflation in Bangladesh, not me. Take it up with them....or be prepared to accept all their data and predictions and not selective bits and pieces.



Like I said before, depreciation and inflation are two different economic phenomenon. You are mixing up the two. Depreciation/Appreciation is more related to the PPP theory I brought up earlier. If you want me to go into this, tell me...but for the moment it is straying off topic somewhat.

There might even theoretically be a time when 1 Bangladesh Taka buys more US dollars than 1 Indian Rupee.....but Indian Rupee has inflated much less than Bangladest Taka.



No. I am predicting growth acceleration in both countries. Just a higher growth acceleration in India. As with all predictions I am liable to be wrong. We will have to wait and see. I am actually more optimistic about Bangladesh than either IMF or World Bank. If Bangladesh plays its cards right it can get to a REAL growth rate higher than 7% and even 8%....which is quite phenomenal. But it needs SHW administration to take up some real strong reforms and initiatives similar to what Modi administration is doing and planning for India....it cannot accelerate much on cruise control. I am confident some of this will happen, more so because SHW administration will be watching what happens in India and implementing the successful ideas themselves....it is a global competition game right?



Past 5 years had a lousy govt for India for the majority. "wider economic gap" is such a general statement that I cannot say I predict that... since GDP and GDP per capita is only one small part of economic measurement anyways. For overall economic performance we will again have to wait and see. I too am not a big fan of predictions etc....my only qualm is that you cannot consider MH as the only state economy comparable to Bangladesh when there are many other contenders both by sheer size and dynamism...and improving economic climate. You are free to disagree and lets move on.



Uh not they aren't. Some are better in India, some are better in BD....and there are few major differences in most of them.

To me literacy rates and education are way more important than any other social indicator area....and thats one area where India is far ahead of Bangladesh. You are free to bring up any social indicator and I will give my 2 cents on why India or Bangladesh is worse. The general trend is that there are a few massive states in North India that are severely lagging in various indicators, bringing down the whole average....how those states now change politically to bring in more reform and action oriented govts and bureaucrats will be the main factor in getting these numbers improving at a faster rate.



Ask who exactly? Bangladeshis? Most neutral world sources (World Bank, IMF, UNDP, PWC, citibank, the economist etc) certainly do not think so judging by their growth rate predictions for India and Bangladesh. Most lie at 6-7% for Bangladesh and 7 - 8% for India when we talk about long term real growth rates. Unless you know something they don't?



Most stable? Thats a matter of opinion. If a country is swinging between 6% to 10% growth from year to year....it is not very stable....a country growing at 6% every year is way more stable.....but which hypothetical situation would you prefer?

"Low debt" by itself means nothing. I think what you mean is debt to GDP ratio right? I mean if a country produces 10 dollars worth every year and has a debt of 10 dollars......how would that compare to a country that produces 1000 dollars every year but has a debt of 500 dollars? Latter country has much higher absolute debt than the first one....is it in a worse situation though?

Public Debt/GDP ratio also has its limitations in simply comparing. FYI, Bangladesh has around 32% in this regard and India around 50%...but a country like Japan has debt/GDP of 226%! Singapore a phenomenally well managed country has a debt/GDP ratio of 111%. Many developed countries are in this ball park.....so obviously a simple debt/GDP ratio is not going to give the full story....rather many other factors come in like credit rating, financial stability, political and economic stability. These are all areas where India scores higher than Bangladesh.....there are no allegations of a stolen election, kangaroo courts, vote rigging, political assassinations and threats and an ever present looming threat of a coup and history of coups and history of all of these and bitter politics creating such a schism between the population.



Current account deficit in India is marginally around -1.5%...Bangladesh is near 0. Both of these are very low.

Developed countries: US for example has -2.4% UK has -5.5%.

India also has 350 billion USD of forex reserves compared to 25 billion USD for bangladesh. Per capita this is more than 274 dollars for India and 157 dollars for Bangladesh....so the difference in CAD is not a big deal....though credit should be given to Bangladesh that is it in a solid position compared to say Pakistan.

List of countries by current account balance as a percentage of GDP - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of countries by foreign-exchange reserves - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of countries and dependencies by population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Exports per capita:

India: 363 USD

Bangladesh: 194 USD

Ref: List of countries by exports - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Remittances are already reflected in the CAD argument....its not really something to be terribly proud of either....a necessary evil to give high paying jobs to "surplus" labour because conditions back home economically cannot abosrb them effectively.



Completely agree. Same is true for India. Best of luck to both countries!

Excellent post! :tup:
 
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To a degree it does.



Are we talking about "importance" or economic livelihoods of the people?



Gujarat is about 80% size of B'desh GDP. We have already discussed this many times, its getting boring. So lets agree to disagree here. Punjab yes, its population is much too small, its people would have to be 4 - 5 times richer than Bangladeshis to be around the GDP of Bangladesh.

Gujaratis have to be about 2 - 2.5 times richer than Bangladeshis for Gujarat to compare in total GDP size (Because population of Gujarat is 60 million compared to Punjab 27 million.). They are already 2 times richer now....hence 80% of Bangladesh GDP.



If you are going by your particular definition of "importance" over everything else....then sure. But only WB and UP are at or below Bangladesh per capita income in the similar GDP category....so its going to be a pretty one-sided comparison with MH and TN especially (the 2 most industrialized, economically developed and urbanized states of entire India)....and gujarat and AP also (though bifurcation has reduced the "importance" as you put it of current AP, im talking about former united AP hehe).
Both living standerd and total size matters.Goa have highest per capita in India.But you can't put it on a same catagory with Maharastra,isn't it? As it is tiny compared to Maharastra.Gujarat Punjab are wealthy compared to Bangladesh but are so much smaller in population.For both population size and economic output Bangladesh/Maharastra would be appropriate.
 
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.from a commoner like me, the way i see it, every city have their pros and cons.....there are slums and there are posh areas....to me Dhaka and kolkata have many similarities...full of Bengali speaking people...throwing gali and dirts everywhere...but one good thing in kolkata street are, they follow traffic rules. and mcdonald sux ,the one on park street.

IMG_20140922_112608.jpg IMG_20140922_112815.jpg IMG_20140922_114336.jpg
 
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like this one ?

dhakaairport69.jpg

I think this comparison is patently unfair. This Airport was developed in the early 60's when honestly (honestly!) no airport in India (except maybe IGI in New Delhi) could compare to it (IGI was actually more plain, to be PC). But our airport is still ours - ugly or not. The facilities are adequate and comfortable. I don't see the point....

Your govt. (through Airports Authority of India and your Highways Authority as well) has been on a roll building shiny new airports and highways because of,

a) new-found liberalization of economy and its growth.
b) the existing road infrastructure and airports in India before 2000 were not considered adequate.

In fact most of the Indian airports (before the newer crop of airports in the past decade) did not look better than ours (some of the older Indian posters may kindly attest to this). Most Indian airport terminals were more 'Sarkari school-looking' than this in the eighties and nineties. Most Indian airports did not even have boarding bridges while this one did all through the eighties. I've seen this as a teen ager at that time myself in my travels.

As soon as we build our shiny new airports in another five years, should we start chest thumping too? How stupid would that be? This stupid game of one-up-manship ??

It is really really simple to source steel structures locally and build a brand new airport terminal in two years. The point is that these mega airport and highway projects help no one except line the pockets of harami chaur Indian politicians hiding behind fake saffron robes and 'Namavalis'. These projects don't help any of the Indian PDF fanboys here. Not one Rupee. The politicians have all got you fooled. So get that through all your thick heads and stop with all the bazaari ganging up and chest thumping.

The focus in Bangladesh has been different. We are concentrating on HR issues through NGO's like reduction of fertility, increase in literacy rate, hygiene issues, immunization rates etc. The effect of these changes are far more far-reaching than airports. If you still want to thump chests - do something useful for a change. Go back to your old Gaon and help your poor villagers improve their lives.

Airports and highways can wait. The utilization of this airport in the picture is hardly 60~70%.
 
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I think this comparison is patently unfair. This Airport was developed in the early 60's when honestly (honestly!) no airport in India (except maybe IGI in New Delhi) could compare to it (IGI was actually more plain, to be PC). But our airport is still ours - ugly or not. The facilities are adequate and comfortable. I don't see the point....

Your govt. (through Airports Authority of India and your Highways Authority as well) has been on a roll building shiny new airports and highways because of,

a) new-found liberalization of economy and its growth.
b) the existing road infrastructure and airports in India before 2000 were not considered adequate.

In fact most of the Indian airports (before the newer crop of airports in the past decade) did not look better than ours (some of the older Indian posters may kindly attest to this). Most Indian airport terminals were more 'Sarkari school-looking' than this in the eighties and nineties. I've seen this as a teen ager at that time myself in my travels.

As soon as we build our shiny new airports in another five years, should we start chest thumping too? How stupid would that be? This stupid game of one-up-manship ??

It is really really simple to source steel structures locally and build a brand new airport terminal in two years. The point is that these mega airport and highway projects help no one except line the pockets of harami chaur Indian politicians hiding behind fake saffron robes and 'Namavalis'. These projects don't help any of the Indian PDF fanboys here. Not one Rupee. The politicians have all got you fooled. So get that through all your thick heads and stop with all the bazaari ganging up and chest thumping.

The focus in Bangladesh has been different. We are concentrating on HR issues through NGO's like reduction of fertility, increase in literacy rate, hygiene issues, immunization rates etc. The effect of these changes are far more far-reaching than airports. If you still want to thump chests - do something useful for a change. Go back to your old Gaon and help your poor villagers improve their lives.

Airports and highways can wait. The utilization of this airport in the picture is hardly 60~70%.


Meh....I don't even bother to read such lectures completely.The point is your infrastructure is of poor quality,and that doesn't stop Bangladeshis from mocking Indian infrastructure

Upcoming airport @ Kannur,a Tier 3 city in Kerala

15tvkr-kannurairpo_1951237f.jpg
 
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The one reason for opening this thread is to whip up trolling and increase bad blood between people of our two countries. I don't know what the thread intends to accomplish other than that....

When I see an Indian open a thread like this in the Bangladeshi forum then the intention is clear and it is only to incite rivalry and ill-feeling.....
 
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Meh....I don't even bother to read such lectures completely.The point is your infrastructure is of poor quality,and that doesn't stop Bangladeshis from mocking Indian infrastructure

Upcoming airport @ Kannur,a Tier 3 city in Kerala

15tvkr-kannurairpo_1951237f.jpg

Yes it is - you're right. You've proven your point, Thank You. Our infra sucks. :-)

Now would you leave us the heck alone and go back to the Indian forum please?
 
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.from a commoner like me, the way i see it, every city have their pros and cons.....there are slums and there are posh areas....to me Dhaka and kolkata have many similarities...full of Bengali speaking people...throwing gali and dirts everywhere...but one good thing in kolkata street are, they follow traffic rules. and mcdonald sux ,the one on park street.

Come to Bombay City to see how traffic works; Calcutta is not The best example, although it is still miles ahead of Dhaka wrt traffic management.
 
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