Developments and Turkish operations in Libya

[Vergennes]

4 or 5 Pantsirs destroyed today alone

I can't understand why anybody would by Russian crap going forward. Serious question about russian defence equipment is raised. Is russia really just a paper tiger?

Maybe their air defence equipments aren't as good as advertised. Maybe they're just garbage. Maybe maybe there are lot of possible reasons.

But there could be several factors.

-Like any nations producing and exporting weapons,Russia sells downgraded versions to its clients.
-The crew's training,indeed Haftar's troops (mercenaries) are not the best trained and qualified out there.
-Turkey's electronic warfare. (Probably)

 

[azyr]

Maybe their air defence equipments aren't as good as advertised. Maybe they're just garbage. Maybe maybe there are lot of possible reasons.

But there could be several factors.

-Like any nations producing and exporting weapons, Russia sells downgraded versions to its clients.
-The crew's training, indeed Haftar's troops (mercenaries) are not the best trained and qualified out there.
-Turkey's electronic warfare. (Probably)

I'm also guessing we're blinding these systems with some sort of EW since it's not logical to down 8 (or was it 9 now) SAM systems without losing a single drone (which to be honest is easy bait).

There's also the possibility that the idiot Haftar & Co. don't realize that weapons and systems aren't really valuable on their own. For example a SAM system with multi-layer protection (including not letting howitzers into range) is a lethal deterrent while sitting systems inside hangars (or even in the open actively searching) is a sitting duck.

The systems are of course not good as advertised, but I seriously doubt they are THIS bad. I guess having the assets and information gathering capability of a NATO army outweighs shiny toys (no matter how expensive and numerous) in the hands of paper tigers by a big margin as evident here.

 

[Mithridates]

Well. All aspects of their military which have been challenged has failed. From tanks to air defence to air force. The only branch not tested is the strategic force. I bet that they will fail miserably as well if tested.

you are seeing what you want to see, otherwise their kornets decimated Israeli tanks, t-72s decimated our chieftains, t-90 decimated rebels in Syria...

 

[AKINCI]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1263103801738878976

 

[WarDaddy97]

Maybe their air defence equipments aren't as good as advertised. Maybe they're just garbage. Maybe maybe there are lot of possible reasons.

But there could be several factors.

-Like any nations producing and exporting weapons,Russia sells downgraded versions to its clients.
-The crew's training,indeed Haftar's troops (mercenaries) are not the best trained and qualified out there.
-Turkey's electronic warfare. (Probably)

Those are valid points but you’re missing the main problem.
see, Pantsir would be more effective if it were part of multilayered network. To understand what I mean look at AD system of Kheymim.
First in surrounding areas there are Syrian systems from S75 to S200
Around perimeter of the base there are TORS and Pantsir. Then s400. Add to that various EW antennas.
Obviously we’ll never see that in Libya since Russia “officially “ has no troops there but PMC. But then the deployment of Pantsir would be useless and оbsolete .

 

[Saithan]

Those are valid points but you’re missing the main problem.
see, Pantsir would be more effective if it were part of multilayered network. To understand what I mean look at AD system of Kheymim.
First in surrounding areas there are Syrian systems from S75 to S200
Around perimeter of the base there are TORS and Pantsir. Then s400. Add to that various EW antennas.
Obviously we’ll never see that in Libya since Russia “officially “ has no troops there but PMC. But then the deployment of Pantsir would be useless and absolute.

GNA has that multilayered defense around Tripoli airport, or had. But the sellingpoint of pantsir and such systems are suppose to be their stand-alone capability.

 

[AKINCI]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1263098243573039104

 

[WarDaddy97]

you are seeing what you want to see, otherwise their kornets decimated Israeli tanks, t-72s decimated our chieftains, t-90 decimated rebels in Syria...

Decimated is a big word. In reality, out of 50 or so tanks/apcs lost in 2006, only 5 were completely destroyed.

GNA has that multilayered defense around Tripoli airport, or had. But the sellingpoint of pantsir and such systems are suppose to be their stand-alone capability.

What exactly consisted of GNAs AD network?
AD system can not and will not successfully work in stand-alone deployment. Here and there might be successful usage but overall it’s useless.
Russia’s worse enemy is their childish propaganda

 

[xbat]

Panstir missile doesnt have a seeker(active or passive), it gets corrections from launch unit all the way. You can jam the missile with cutting data link. You can jam old fashioned search radar or illumination radar.

it has a huge booster(comparing to missile body) after a couple seconds booster separates, missile go its way without propulsion. You can make sharp maneuvers to frazzle incoming missile,

btw its cannons are just chit, cant hit anything

 

[Mithridates]

Decimated is a big word. In reality, out of 50 or so tanks/apcs lost in 2006, only 5 were completely destroyed.

that is israel's fault that didn't bring more tanks to field...

 

[WarDaddy97]

that is israel's fault that didn't bring more tanks to field...

Or maybe it’s Hezbollahs fault for losing or not sacrificing many atgm operators to artillery, tank fire and drone missiles

 

[Mithridates]

Or maybe it’s Hezbollahs fault for losing or not sacrificing many atgm operators to artillery, tank fire and drone missiles

it was a major blow in Israeli forces, they could not overcome it that is why they did not bring more weapons and did not continue the war.

 

[hyperman]

can you silly people stop derailing this thread, this thread is about current libyan operations, take you D#$% waiving about hezbollah and israel somewhere else.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1263122306949234689

 

[Vergennes]

Putin routine...