What's new

Defense Official: Qaher 313 Home-Made Fighter Jet to Protect Persian Gulf

Status
Not open for further replies.
1)
2) F-18 cannot detect it at any distance? Are you pulling assumptions out of your back? Anything that has a mass and size can be detected on radar. Atleast the current material sciences technology we possess does not allow one to become completely invisible on radar. @gambit @Oscar or @Penguin can better explain this.

I'm not touching this as I do not believe this is a real fighter program (at least not untill we see more convincing evidence than a mockup).

In general
No aircraft is totally invisible to radar, stealth aircraft make it difficult for conventional radar to detect or track the aircraft effectively, increasing the odds of a successful attack.

Importantly
Stealth is the combination of passive low observable (LO) features and active emitters such as Low Probability of Intercept Radars, radios and laser designators. These are usually combined with active defenses such as chaff, flares, and ECM.[6] It is accomplished by using a complex design philosophy to reduce the ability of an opponent's sensors to detect, track, or attack the stealth aircraft.[7] This philosophy also takes into account the heat, sound, and other emissions of the aircraft as these can also be used to locate it.
Stealth aircraft - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, LO features alone don't cut it. You also need sensors that don't give you away easily. Does Iran have those? If not, you can have a LO design which is spotted immediately as soon as it starts doing anything worthwhile...

I'm not convinces Iran has a LO design, let alone appropriate sensors and weapons and countermeasures.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
.
Yes, I have bad habit of not reviewing after typing due to laziness & f-4 is typing error.

So, disclosing simple capability of weapon is threat to nation security then mostly advance nations are under threat.

You want to use cruise missile technology to shoot a aircraft then AIM AMRAAM gonna run for money.

Don't hide in excuse of complexity of technology when you are out of logic.

What is to do with my religion in defence analysis.

Our DRDO claims their missiles are more advance then US missile then I am gonna mad & behave rudely if other people counter it.

Fanboy people like you thinks everybody who counter these claims is anti Iran.

Not really a western fan-boy like you, I use only logic , and I have given you a hint about a possible technology to be used once the attacking aircrafts are detected by the long range radar, they might comprise satellite navigation or computer based positing in space to send the Qaher-313 undetected to get close and shoot down the aircrafts if they have slept through the air defence systems, this is just one possibility for the use of the stealth fighter plane. I cannot go into scientific details for you, I have given you a general and plausible idea, so take it, think about it, or leave it, it is as simple as that.
I think your long range ballistic missile is fake or at best an RC model, can you please send me the blue prints of it. if not than you are a bad boy, an ignorant and you have no logic at all.
 
.
@Oscar, @gambit, while we are on it, I have a doubt. It would be great if you could clarify it. In post # 154 @kollang has claimed that since 313 has air intakes above the wing, there is more space for weapons bay. I have my doubts on this.

Also, I believe having the intakes above the wing root is not the best design for a fighter that is meant to engage other fighters in dog-fights. Could either of you shed more light on this?
Let it go. This thing, and call it a thing is being generous, is a national joke and disgrace to Iran. In a way, I feel sorry for the Iranian members here. We all have our national pride and they are no different. But the reality is that Iran does not have any viable low radar observable fighter program and this thing looks like it was lifted out of some 1980s Japanese manga comic.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
.
2) F-18 cannot detect it at any distance? Are you pulling assumptions out of your back?
He is.

Anything that has a mass and size can be detected on radar.
True.

Atleast the current material sciences technology we possess does not allow one to become completely invisible on radar.
True. Nothing is invisible in radar detection -- at this time. And certainly Iran does not have the technology to make such a breakthrough.

3) What is locking with passive radar?
No such animal as a 'passive radar'. Radar detection is a two-parts process: Transmit and Receive.

Popular media blurbs will use the phrasing 'passive radar' but every radar engineers in the world know there is no such beast.
 
.
I'm not touching this as I do not believe this is a real fighter program (at least not untill we see more convincing evidence than a mockup).

In general


Importantly

Stealth aircraft - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, LO features alone don't cut it. You also need sensors that don't give you away easily. Does Iran have those? If not, you can have a LO design which is spotted immediately as soon as it starts doing anything worthwhile...

I'm not convinces Iran has a LO design, let alone appropriate sensors and weapons and countermeasures.

What do you know? they might have all that; they are at the edge of sciences in R&D, and they are coming with new civilian products that are beneficial to all humanity, just read about their recent nano-technologies and stem cells achievements, despite the very heavy sanctions imposed on them. They have even succeeded in cold fusion reactors, witch, I do not think your country the Netherlands has done.
There are many people who think that Iran has to abide by world standards in its military hardware, but it is not the case, from what I understand, they are tailor making their designs to suit their needs in their Area, and they are making them the most possibly efficient weapons, because they understand from their experience of war that the efficiency and the availability of the weapon is more important than the look or the international standard, as long as it can do the job it is intended to do with precision and efficiency than there is absolutely no difference, only in cost; if an air to air missile succeeds at shooting down an enemy's warplane, it does not matter much if its name is AMRAMM or another less known name, it is the results that count. So what one should understand is that Iran is strengthening itself militarily to prevent any major world power from attacking it militarily, they have prepared themselves against a major US attack, so any less powerfull nation won't even think about war with Iran, even the US do not think about it anymore, they prefer to use more sanctions knowing that many of their friends and allies along many other nations will suffer too, so either it is out of bad politics, confusion in its own political ranks, or pure madness.
 
.
Not really a western fan-boy like you, I use only logic , and I have given you a hint about a possible technology to be used once the attacking aircrafts are detected by the long range radar, they might comprise satellite navigation or computer based positing in space to send the Qaher-313 undetected to get close and shoot down the aircrafts if they have slept through the air defence systems, this is just one possibility for the use of the stealth fighter plane. I cannot go into scientific details for you, I have given you a general and plausible idea, so take it, think about it, or leave it, it is as simple as that.
I think your long range ballistic missile is fake or at best an RC model, can you please send me the blue prints of it. if not than you are a bad boy, an ignorant and you have no logic at all.

You himself argue without logic & solid proof & our ICBM test tracked by all spy satellites of the world including our own spy satellites not some photoshop or plastic hoax with big claims.
 
.
I think this plane will be ready in 7-8 years if they don't abandoned it like they did with shafaq.
 
.
Let it go. This thing, and call it a thing is being generous, is a national joke and disgrace to Iran. In a way, I feel sorry for the Iranian members here. We all have our national pride and they are no different. But the reality is that Iran does not have any viable low radar observable fighter program and this thing looks like it was lifted out of some 1980s Japanese manga comic.

Thank you for the reply, but my question here was not entirely 313 specific. I just wanted to know if it is a good design philosophy to have air intake above the wing root, I have not seen an single fighter jet with such a design, so i was wondering if this is a design constraint to have intakes below the wing.
 
.
Thank you for the reply, but my question here was not entirely 313 specific. I just wanted to know if it is a good design philosophy to have air intake above the wing root, I have not seen an single fighter jet with such a design, so i was wondering if this is a design constraint to have intakes below the wing.
In F-5,you can see the intake is above the wing and everyone knows F-5 is the best when it comes to maneuver.
AFD-080827-125.jpg
 
.
No such animal as a 'passive radar'. Radar detection is a two-parts process: Transmit and Receive.

Popular media blurbs will use the phrasing 'passive radar' but every radar engineers in the world know there is no such beast.

Uhm, what about...
Passive radar systems (also referred to as passive coherent location and passive covert radar) encompass a class of radar systems that detect and track objects by processing reflections from non-cooperative sources of illumination in the environment, such as commercial broadcast and communications signals. It is a specific case of bistatic radar, the latter also including the exploitation of cooperative and non-cooperative radar transmitters.
Passive radar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In which case 'you' do not emit, but just receive and proces what is reflected of third party transmissions. (reminiscent of ESM, which is location by non-emitting and receiving your opponents emissions)
 
.
Uhm, what about...

Passive radar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In which case 'you' do not emit, but just receive and proces what is reflected of third party transmissions. (reminiscent of ESM, which is location by non-emitting and receiving your opponents emissions)
Yes, and those 3rd party transmissions make up the 'Transmission' half of that two-parts process of radar detection. The fact that I have no control (ownership) of those transmissions does not negate the technical requirement that there has to be some EM waves traveling through the heavens in order to collide with a body, reflects off that body, and to be received by me.

The phrase 'passive radar' is a conveniently made up phrase in order to give the layman a frame of reference -- radar. But the phrase itself has no technical credibility in the radar community.
 
.
What do you know? they might have all that; they are at the edge of sciences in R&D, and they are coming with new civilian products that are beneficial to all humanity, just read about their recent nano-technologies and stem cells achievements, despite the very heavy sanctions imposed on them. They have even succeeded in cold fusion reactors, witch, I do not think your country the Netherlands has done.
There are many people who think that Iran has to abide by world standards in its military hardware, but it is not the case, from what I understand, they are tailor making their designs to suit their needs in their Area, and they are making them the most possibly efficient weapons, because they understand from their experience of war that the efficiency and the availability of the weapon is more important than the look or the international standard, as long as it can do the job it is intended to do with precision and efficiency than there is absolutely no difference, only in cost; if an air to air missile succeeds at shooting down an enemy's warplane, it does not matter much if its name is AMRAMM or another less known name, it is the results that count. So what one should understand is that Iran is strengthening itself militarily to prevent any major world power from attacking it militarily, they have prepared themselves against a major US attack, so any less powerfull nation won't even think about war with Iran, even the US do not think about it anymore, they prefer to use more sanctions knowing that many of their friends and allies along many other nations will suffer too, so either it is out of bad politics, confusion in its own political ranks, or pure madness.

If they have all that, how come we've not seen ANY kind of 'normal' combat plane being developed over the past decades. Why do they soldier on with F5s and F14, local copies of Huey helicopter, derivatives of Chinese missiles etc.?

"They have even succeeded in cold fusion reactors, witch, I do not think your country the Netherlands has done."

Possibly because we've not attempted any such thing! Pakistan's Dr. Kahn did steal civilian nuclear technology from NL, which aided that country's development of a nuke weapon... Technology which subsequently found its way to Iran.
See
http://www.nirs.org/les/khanreportfinal29404.pdf
More advanced Dutch Urenco nuclear technology leaked to Pakistan, Iran and Libya Dutch government withholds crucial information | Campagne tegen wapenhandel
http://www.nuclearactive.org/docs/LES021904a.html"
A.Q. Khan

As for cold fusion
By late 1989, most scientists considered cold fusion claims dead, and cold fusion subsequently gained a reputation as pathological science. In 1989, a review panel organized by the United States Department of Energy (DOE) found that the evidence for the discovery of a new nuclear process was not persuasive enough to start a special program, but was "sympathetic toward modest support" for experiments "within the present funding system." A second DOE review, convened in 2004 to look at new research, reached conclusions similar to the first.
A small community of researchers continues to investigate cold fusion, now often preferring the designation low-energy nuclear reactions (LENR). Some have reported that under certain conditions they observe excess heat effects by interaction of hydrogen or deuterium with palladium, nickel or platinum. Since cold fusion articles are rarely published in refereed scientific journals, the results do not receive as much scrutiny as more mainstream topics.
Cold fusion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
LENR News and Research - Key Distinction: Why LENR Is Not "Cold Fusion"

Yes, and those 3rd party transmissions make up the 'Transmission' half of that two-parts process of radar detection. The fact that I have no control (ownership) of those transmissions does not negate the technical requirement that there has to be some EM waves traveling through the heavens in order to collide with a body, reflects off that body, and to be received by me.

The phrase 'passive radar' is a conveniently made up phrase in order to give the layman a frame of reference -- radar. But the phrase itself has no technical credibility in the radar community.

Fully agree.
 
. .
Thank you for the reply, but my question here was not entirely 313 specific. I just wanted to know if it is a good design philosophy to have air intake above the wing root, I have not seen an single fighter jet with such a design, so i was wondering if this is a design constraint to have intakes below the wing.
When I was reassigned to the F-16, the first time I saw the jet I was somewhat surprised by the size of the vertical stabilator -- outsized for such a little aircraft.

One of the primary factors in angle-of-attack (AOA) limitation is air flow across the vertical stab to maintain yaw axis control. As the aircraft gain pitch up AOA, not pitch down AOA, the fuselage increasingly blocks air flow across the vertical stab, reducing yaw axis stability and controllability.

Continuing Ed Uncoordinated flight - Flight Training
A high angle of attack on approach and landing reduces directional stability and control because the fuselage blocks more airflow over the vertical fin and rudder. Again, a little extra airspeed helps.
So General Dynamics gave the small F-16 that outsized vertical stab to assist it to have that famous pitch up AOA and formidable agility and maneuverability. Any larger and the vertical stab would begin to structurally compromise the aircraft under stress.

Air supply for the engine coming from topside is not unknown. The American UAVs have them. But then they are not designed to maneuver like the F-16. So what is a 'good design philosophy' depends on the mission YOU designed the aircraft to do.

Now look at all the successful fighters since the Korean War era and see where the designers have those intakes.
 
.
In F-5,you can see the intake is above the wing and everyone knows F-5 is the best when it comes to maneuver.
AFD-080827-125.jpg
The F-5's intakes may be in a higher plane than the wing roots, but they are not behind the wing roots where pitch up AOA would block air flow to the engines.
 
.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom