Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[luckyyy]

Only coz of the bad reputation of Mig jets (Mig-21,27) of technical lags.

If you see the feature wise of all MMRCA contenders, Mig-35 is the best.

going by the price at which these Mig-21,27 were bought , it's a miracle that they are still flying..

 

[redpearl75]

going by the price at which these Mig-21,27 were bought , it's a miracle that they are still flying..

Can we take chances this time making a the jets mere a miracle and accepting it that way.. We donn't have to concider it as a miracle but something that's a practical thing and good as well.... Mig 21-27 are relics and should never even brought along with this MRCA deal.... How many lives Mig 21 has claimed, do you know that and still you say that it's a miracle.... Can we really take chances with our efficiency and life when iy comes to something like this.... Mig 35 sure is a great fighter but does it stand any chance in front of the other contenders when it comes to weapon options/Radar/range/Avionics package/Weapon load.... No... Though the price it offers is the most cheapest but I don't find Mig 35s to be a great deal as we already operate Fulcrums and we need something different and better this time...

 

[redpearl75]

As far as I see, Super Hornets or Rafales would be the best option followed by Gripen even though it's light but it offers a great package....

 

[warlords]

does anyone know about the capabilities of gripen's ericsson radar??

 

[redpearl75]

does anyone know about the capabilities of gripen's ericsson radar??

PS-05/A multimode radar (Sweden), Airborne fire-control radars

Type
I/J-band (8 to 18/20 GHz) multimode search and fire-control radar.

Description
PS-05/A is the multimode search and fire-control radar that is installed in the JAS-39 Gripen multirole combat aircraft and in its baseline form, comprises a 25 kg antenna/platform assembly, a 73 kg power liquid-cooled, travelling wave tube power amplifier/transmitter unit, a 32 kg software-controlled exciter/receiver unit and a 23 kg signal/data processor. Within this latter unit, the signal processing function is programmable, while the D80 data processor uses software written in Pascal and incorporates a built-in test routine. To provide the required operational flexibility, low, medium and high Pulse Repetition Frequency (PRF) functions are incorporated together with a range of waveform modes which include the following:Air-to-Ground Ranging (AGR)A ground target ranging mode.Doppler Beam Sharpening (DBS)A synthetic aperture mode that utilises Doppler processing and is used for high-resolution ground mapping with high angular coverage obtained via continuous antenna scanning.High Pulse Doppler (HPD)A high PRF mode that utilises Doppler processing for clutter rejection and which is designed primarily for use against forward hemisphere air targets.Low Pulse Doppler (LPD)A Doppler processing mode that is used against moving surface targets.Low Pulse Repetition Frequency (LPRF)A low PRF mode with pulse-to-pulse frequency agility that is used for real-beam mapping and surface target detection.Medium Pulse Doppler (MPD)A medium PRF mode that utilises Doppler processing and is designed for use against nose and tail aspect air targets. A high-resolution submode is incorporated to facilitate target tracking.SpotLight Mode (SLM)A synthetic aperture spotlight mode that utilises Doppler processing for very high-resolution mapping.Use of these various waveform/PRF combinations allows the
That's what Janes says...

The PS-05/A is a pulse-doppler radar currently used by the JAS 39 Gripen fighter aircraft. It weighs 156 kg and has been developed by Ericsson and GEC-Marconi, based on the latter's advanced Blue Vixen radar for the Sea Harrier (which inspired the Eurofighter's CAPTOR radar as well).

The PS-05/A works in the 8-10 GHz band and has 1 kW energy output (> 10 kW maximum output). The radar is capable of detecting, locating, identifying and automatically tracking multiple targets in the upper and lower spheres, on the ground and sea or in the air, in all weather conditions. It consists of four parts and all parts can be replaced in 30 minutes.

Gripen operator Hungarian Air Force reported the PS-05 radar set has proved reliable so far, both in domestic service and NATO flight exercises in Corsica.

Versions
MK-3
Is the latest version of PS-05/A radar which is currently in use and has been available since 2005.

It is capable of detecting a fighter aircraft from 120 km distance and can see road traffic and count ships at anchor in a harbour at 70 km. The radar weighs 156kg made up of a 25 kg antenna/platform assembly, a 73 kg power liquid-cooled, travelling wave tube power amplifier/transmitter unit, a 32 kg software-controlled exciter/receiver unit and a 23 kg signal/data processor. [1] [2]

Radar modes:

a) Air-to-Air modes:

LRS (Long Range Search) is used to detect and identify targets at high ranges.
TWS (Track While Scan) allows to track targets and search for other targets.
MPTT (Multiple Priority Target Tracking).
PTT (Priority Target Tracking) allows accurate targeting and tracking Air-to-Air missiles.
STT (Single Target Track).
ACM (Air Combat Mode) is used for automatic target detection in dogfight.
b) Air-to-Surface modes:

LRS (Long Range Search) is used for ground or sea target search at long distances.
RA (Raid Assessment) ensures bombing.
SMTI (Stationary and Moving Target Indication) is used for ground stationary or moving targets.
GSPTT (Ground and Sea Priority Target Tracking).
GM (Ground Mapping) ensures mapping of terrain under the aircraft for navigation purposes (e.g. terrain copying at night or adverse weather condition).
HRM (High Resolution Mapping) ensures terrain mapping by synthetic aperture in order to gain high resolution pictures.
RANGING high accuracy ground target ranging.
All information is processed by a Mercury Computer Systems RACE/PPC setup, which has replaced the Ericsson D80 of Batch 1-2 Gripens.

MK-4
Is an upgraded version of MK-3 and should improve SAR capability to modern standards and enhance GMTI/GMTT (SMTI/GSPTT) modes.

MK-5
Is a further upgrade of MK-4 radar which will gain new AESA antenna instead of mechanically scanned antenna. This radar will be available by 2012.

Development of the AESA radar for Gripen started out under the Saab Ericsson NORA (Not Only a RAdar) programme, and has been underway for several years, including test flying aboard a specially-retained Saab JA 37 Viggen testbed. Benefits of the NORA concept was the provision of improved long-range tracking as a result of the combination of longer detection range and electronically-steered beam control, dominant battlespace awareness, track identification through non-co-operative target recognition, low probability of intercept and enhanced jamming capabilities. The AESA radar programme is directly linked to MIDAS (Multifunction Integrated Defensive Avionics System), which will also add electronic attack and advanced datalinking capabilities.

And that's what Wiki says.....

Please have a look at this link for more information.... : http://www.saabgroup.com/Global/Doc...stems/PS 05_A/saab_PS-05 A 4pg Screen PDF.pdf

I hope it's helpful...

 

[redpearl75]

 

[rockstarIN]

As far as I see, Super Hornets or Rafales would be the best option followed by Gripen even though it's light but it offers a great package....

Gripen is single engined fighter equal to LCA Mk-III, no need to go for that. Y we need to buy that if we have capacity to make one.

 

[rockstarIN]

Can we take chances this time making a the jets mere a miracle and accepting it that way.. We donn't have to concider it as a miracle but something that's a practical thing and good as well.... Mig 21-27 are relics and should never even brought along with this MRCA deal.... How many lives Mig 21 has claimed, do you know that and still you say that it's a miracle.... Can we really take chances with our efficiency and life when iy comes to something like this.... Mig 35 sure is a great fighter but does it stand any chance in front of the other contenders when it comes to weapon options/Radar/range/Avionics package/Weapon load.... No... Though the price it offers is the most cheapest but I don't find Mig 35s to be a great deal as we already operate Fulcrums and we need something different and better this time...

Mig-35 offers the same stuff which others offer. In fact Mig-35 will be added with TVC, which others doesn't have.

weapon options/Radar/range/Avionics package/Weapon load - all these are equal ro better to other contenders of MMRCA. The only problem is the lack of trust and bad old memories. new MIG-29s didnt crash as Mig-21 did.

And yes, Russian PR work is weak, look at Discovery channels airing in India, they show always F-18 or ET..

 

[redpearl75]

The developmental NORA III AESA radar mounted on the rear ramp of a C-130 Hercules transport aircraft for initial flight trials. (Saab Microwave Systems)

 

[indushek]

there also another lover "france"....mirage upgrade deal still hanging..

but my point was not that , IAF has not made any statement that MIG-35 is out of MMRCA , it's more in the public domain ..

not knowing about IAF/MoD but surely MIG-35 is least favorate in public domain.....

why ?

Firstly u have to understand the reason for which MRCA was called.

It was to compliment (in near future and replace afterwards) the Mirage jets. These were the only jets able to fly at the heights of Kargill war with ease. Also they have excellent ground attack capability. Its another story that slowly this requirement was changed to a multi role aircraft later.

Ground attack capability is one of the main reason for this contract to be called. In this effect Mig 35 cannot be called a potent ground attack aircraft as till date only a single prototype has been built and also this was done by just adding some advanced avionics to existing Mig frame of Mig 29.

Though looked at with suspicion F/A-18 has excellent above mentioned capability. Infact its called a bomb truck as u must be knowing. On the other hand Rafale too is an excellent ground attack aircraft and so on and..................................so on etc.

Hope this satisfies ur query.

 

[redpearl75]

Gripen is single engined fighter equal to LCA Mk-III, no need to go for that. Y we need to buy that if we have capacity to make one.

It's understood but the thing is that Gripen being a light weight fighter but have you noticed the weapon options/weapon load it offers, it's neat 3.5 T more than LCA, and is More that MIG 35 and nears EFT and F-16... That's why Im concidering that as a potentet contender....

It's cheap compared to Mig 35s when it comes to what it offers compared to what MIG does....

the Gripen's Range is: 2,500 km (Unrefuled)/4,075 km(With external tanks) where as Mig 35 has a range of: 2000 Kms unrefuled and 3200 with tanks.... Combat radius for Gripen is: 1300 Kms and that of Mig is: 1000 Kms..

Mig has a loaded weight of 29T whereas Gripen has only 16.5T of weight... See the difference...

there is no similarities between the Gripen and LCA as LCA is a light weight combat fighter and Gripen is concidered to be a medium weight combat jet....

 

[soaringphnx]

That way we just are left with Rafale and Super hornet then..

That's good, because both the aircraft fit the IAF requirements perfectly and are the most capable air-to-ground platforms available.

But Rafale is going to be a very expensive deal for us as seeing the current behavior of France with the upgradation of the Mirages that we operate to the Mk-II standards...

I think it's better to shell out more money than suffer from sanctions during war. That's one of the reasons why I support the Rafale.

Both have their own advantages and disadvantages.

 

[redpearl75]

That's good, because both the aircraft fit the IAF requirements perfectly and are the most capable air-to-ground platforms available.



I think it's better to shell out more money than suffer from sanctions during war. That's one of the reasons why I support the Rafale.

Both have their own advantages and disadvantages.

I agree to that completely, so far there has been a lot of hype with the EFt but that's the most controvarsial jet as 5 nations are involved in it and god know what's the future, where one nation says let's do it and the other says, not.... Rafale was my favorite since the very first day and even though it's expensive, it offers the best that's there.... Im just worried about the expenses part from the govt point of view as France might make us pay a hell lot more that what's going to be finalized... Still rafale is on tope in my list... SH is also a good deal but again it's American and Im allergic to that... lol..... Let's see what happens....

 

[soaringphnx]

Only coz of the bad reputation of Mig jets (Mig-21,27) of technical lags.

If you see the feature wise of all MMRCA contenders, Mig-35 is the best.

I would like to respectfully disagree. What feature or features are you referring to?

Air-to-ground ability: The Super Hornet offers the best air-to-ground ability with the Rafale being a close second.

Radar: The Super Hornet has the best radar.

Maintenance and life costs: IAF MiG-29s have quite a bad maintenance and serviceability history. The Gripen may be the leading candidate here. Sure, MiG-35s have a commonality with IAF MiG-29s and the navy's MiG-29Ks, but this advantage is shared to an extent by the Rafale (Kaveri engine option and Mirages in service), Super Hornet and Gripen (engine commonality with LCA).

Multi-role ability: The Rafale is the undisputed leader here.

Air-to-air ability: though I don't believe this is the most important factor for MRCA, Eurofighter Typhoon is the best air-to-air fighter.

Tech transfer: Sure, the MiG-35 can giver us 100% tech transfer, but do we really gain anything? India already has access to the MiG-35's technologies through other deals and JVs (MiG-29K and PAK FA). Rafale may be a better choice here. Even the Super Hornet can give us limited access to US tech.

Political Gains: India already has good ties with Russia. But this deal offers us a chance to get some political gains in the U.S. and Europe.

The only feature the MiG-35 offers us that the other contenders don't is the option of 3D TVC which is an unneeded feature for an aircraft which will not or will only be seldom used for air superiority roles.

 

[redpearl75]

50% of IAF equipment obsolete, says IAF chief

NEW DELHI: The Indian Air Force on Monday said that 50% of its systems and equipment were obsolete and steps were being taken to bring down the obsolescence levels in the next four to five years.

"The obsolescence percentage is 50%," Air Chief Marshal P V Naik said here adding that "by 2014-15, it would come down to 20%".

The IAF chief was addressing his annual press conference on the Air Force Day held on October 8 every year.

Asked which was the most critical area for the force in this regard, Naik said, "Air Defence. That will be the only word."

The Air Chief made it clear that even with 50% obsolete equipment, the IAF was capable of handling threats from the medium of air and space. "We are fully capable of defending the country from any threat."

At present, IAF relies mainly on its Russian-origin air defence systems such as the OSA-AK and Pechora and the shoulder-fired Igla missiles, which have been in service for over two decades.

In the recent past, the IAF has been working on developing its air defence network and is looking to procure various systems in this regard.

It has already ordered for over six squadrons of the indigenously-made Akash air defence systems and the Spyder Medium-range Surface to Air Missile (MR-SAM) system from Israel along with aerostat radars to prevent any aerial attacks.

The force is looking at deploying low-level and medium-level transportable radars at different locations and is also planning to procure radars for being deployed in high altitude areas along the borders with China and Pakistan.

What else can anyboday say, we have 50% or more inventory from Russian origin and are obsolete... No more Russian stuff for this competition pls.... We need to explore the other options as well and if proved then we will exploit those as well....