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Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

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No offence guys BUT some times these numbers are mind boggling.

esp wen you add the potential PAK FA cost of $30billon and upwards from 2020..

Dont get me wrong i already know the 2012 defense budget will over $40 billion BUT STIL large nos for a developing nation
 
No offence guys BUT some times these numbers are mind boggling.

esp wen you add the potential PAK FA cost of $30billon and upwards from 2020..

Dont get me wrong i already know the 2012 defense budget will over $40 billion BUT STIL large nos for a developing nation

This is a developing nation of 1.2 billion people, and a trillion dollar economy. By the time PAK-FA starts to arrive, and by the time the last MRCA is delivered, it would be a multi trillion dollar economy. Our defence budget, with all these capital aquisitions involved, is still a small percentage of our GDP compared to our neighbours or the rest of the world.

Can you think of any other developing nation that is so huge population-wise or by the size of the economy? Only China, and their declared defence spending is about three times bigger than ours.

So you can't make a mindless comparison with other developing countries. Obviously a bigger country will have bigger expenditures in all fields, including defence.

So if you modify your last sentence as "large numbers for a large developing nation", you will understand the point.
 
No offence guys BUT some times these numbers are mind boggling.

esp wen you add the potential PAK FA cost of $30billon and upwards from 2020..

Dont get me wrong i already know the 2012 defense budget will over $40 billion BUT STIL large nos for a developing nation

The procurement costs will be spread out over the years.
 
UAE's Rafale deal is no mirage

After a long and often tortuous process, the UAE is understood to be in the final stage of negotiations for the procurement of about 60 Dassault Rafale fighters with many industry insiders predicting that contracts could be signed during the Dubai Airshow. Jon Lake reports...

...The UAE never ran a full competition to select a fighter to replace the Mirage 2000s and simply opened negotiations with Dassault aimed at acquiring an improved and upgraded Rafale.

The UAE has periodically looked at competing aircraft and has talked to other suppliers – fuelling regular reports of a change of heart over the French fighter. But despite requesting technical information on the Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet in September 2010, the more recent reports of negotiations with Lockheed Martin for the supply of more F-16E/F Desert Falcons (because the French offering of an advanced Rafale version was reportedly seen as too expensive), and optimistic noises emanating from the Eurofighter consortium, the UAE’s eyes have kept returning to the Rafale, which has continued to be aggressively and energetically marketed to the Emiratis....

...Many insiders now seem to accept that the Rafale is a ‘done deal’ in the UAE.

This is surprising in some respects as, although the Rafale performed extremely impressively during recent operations over Libya, the UAE has made no secret of the fact that it requires an aircraft significantly more advanced than the current Rafale versions in service with the Armée de l’Air...

...But whatever the reason for the UAE’s unwillingness to fund the required Rafale improvements, it seems as though the deal is ‘back on’, perhaps with the UAE having scaled back its requirements, or perhaps with the French government having decided that it is willing to ‘bite the bullet’ and fund the necessary development in order to try to win what could be a pivotal first export order for the Rafale.

Arabian Aerospace - UAE's Rafale deal is no mirage


The author is known to be pro EF, but since Libya we can see, that even he is impressed by the Rafale! However, the UAE will continue to milk the French and get everything out of this chance, even though the outcome might be clear. They simply are in the better position to negotiate and they know it.
 
The UAE has made no secret of the fact that it requires an aircraft significantly more advanced than the current Rafale versions in service with the Armée de l’Air.

It specifies a longer-range active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar with ground moving target detection and tracking (GMTI/GMTT), ‘interlaced’ air-to-air and air-to-ground modes, a more capable version of the Spectra electronic warfare suite, integration with MBDA’s Meteor long-range missile and, crucially, with more powerful versions of the Snecma M88 engines, producing more than nine tonnes of thrust (about 1.5 tonnes more than the current engine).

Over time, Meteor integration and some AESA and Spectra improvements have become a funded part of the core Rafale programme, but the Armée de l’Air has no stated or funded requirement for a more powerful engine, which the UAE reportedly still wants and which many analysts believe would be essential for long range air-to-ground operations with heavy weapons in the region (and certainly to allow carriage of a three-missile heavy strike loadout using the Black Shaheen). Nor are planned French radar and Spectra improvements believed to be sufficient to meet UAE requirements.

There may also have been a stumbling block in that the UAE is understood to have demanded that the existing Mirage 2000-9s must be ‘bought back’ by the French either for resale or for use by the French forces at an estimated unit price of €20 million – equivalent to about €1.2 billion for the whole fleet.

Historically, Dassault has tended not to use its own resources to fund military aircraft development, preferring its government clients to do so. In this case, the cost of developing the upgrades required by the UAE has been estimated at 4-5 billion euros – or more modestly at €2 billion ($2.9 billion), a sum which the UAE has reportedly expected the French side to pay.

Though the UAE has previously invested in the development of more advanced versions of fighters that it has bought (funding the development of both the Mirage 2000-9 and of the Block 60 F-16E/F in return for a share of profits from any export of aircraft with the features it had paid to develop), it seems not to have the appetite to do so for a modernised and advanced version of the Rafale, or it may be disinclined to be the launch customer and ‘guinea pig’ for such a variant.


Arabian Aerospace - UAE's Rafale deal is no mirage
 
Damn the wait is too Long....Results after Christmas ? Somehow - I dont think so.
 
Any thing expected before at least new year, somebody gonna enjoy 2012 and some one's fighter jet will lose all hopes...
 
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Old news taken up once more by the author, although the UAE agreed to most of the technical specifications of the Rafale F3+ after they saw how it performed in Libya.


Damn the wait is too Long....Results after Christmas ? Somehow - I dont think so.

I still expect the end of the year, because the shortlisting, just like the opening of the comercial bids were delayed for 1 or 2 weeks, behind the schedule IAF officials stated. Now we heard something about mid dec, so 1 or 2 weeks more are possible.
 
Japan deal blow for Eurofighter

JAPAN will buy American-built F-35 fighter plane over BAE Systems’ Warton-built Eurofighter.

The two planes, and Boeing’s Super Hornet, were in the running for the lucrative contract for 42 aircraft.

The deal was estimated to be worth £5.1bn.

A BAE spokesman said the Euro-fighter consortium was disappointed with losing out after five years of work on the bidding process – but other opportunities were being pursued...

...The Indian government is likely to announce its choice of jet between Christmas and New Year. It is looking at buying 126 jets in a deal worth up to £7bn.

Japan deal blow for Eurofighter - Business - Blackpool Gazette


Decision of MMRCA should happen in India in the coming days (google translated)

The Ministry of Defence of India indicates that a decision is imminent on whether the Air Force will buy the Typhoon or the Rafale as the army chief, General VK Singh, should not spend one more year in office, and that ballistic missiles manufactured in India are the success story this year. These are the highlights of the End of Year Review of the Ministry of Defense, an annual summary released Wednesday.

The terms of the 2011 review of "the decisive year for the MMRCA," suggesting that the winner of the competition to sell 126 multi medium combat aircraft to India these days to be announced. In April, the Ministry of Defense eliminated the Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Saab and Mikoyan, leaving only the Dassault Rafale fighters and Eurofighter Typhoon in the fight. On November 4, the two trade proposals were opened. The Indian Air Force gave its benchmarking and is now with the Ministry of Defense.

Once the winning bid is announced, the Defense Ministry will convene a "Contract Negotiation Committee" to negotiate a final price. Defense Ministry sources indicate that both the price quoted by suppliers is significantly higher than the $ 8 billion that the Union Cabinet cleared for this purchase...

Google Übersetzer
 
the wait is really getting long now. I fear that they may cancel the deal and if they do it then it will be really tough to handle the humiliation on PDF :P
 
the wait is really getting long now. I fear that they may cancel the deal and if they do it then it will be really tough to handle the humiliation on PDF :P

deal or no deal ...just 9 days to go...

anyway , with new improved su-30 ...and FGFA on card..humiliation only meant for enemies..
 
Theres no humilation.

IF THE IAF cancels the deal its because THEY HAVE BETTER OPTION with $20 billion.

maybe the LCA MK2 will be closer than we think IE 2015 (why buy mmrca in 2015 then)

maybe PAK FA is closer than 2020 ie 2017 (can we afford both in 2017)

maybe THE USA is making outrageous promises on F35

regardless

I WISH A DECISION either way
 
According to De fence contracts the company which will win has to spend 30% in india

Any idea which company will benefits in private sector , so that we can buy shares and make some money




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Sources

Aero India 2011: EADS defence division ties up with L&T - International Business Times

BAE Systems, M&M announce land system-focused defence JV

Wipro Infrastructure Engineering ties up with EADS arm - Economic Times

EADS To Tie Up With TATA Group For Indian Army US$ 1 Billion Tactical Communications Contract | India Defence

JBM Group in education tie-up with Dassault Systemes, India News Headlines - TolMol News

SME News - Dassault Systèmes partners with Persistent Systems in India

Business Line : Companies News : Punj Lloyd arm ties up with Dassault Systemes

Hinduja Group firm signs MoU with Dassault Systemes - Business news, small business.

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Dassault ties up with Vel Tech for tech training - southindia - Chennai - ibnlive

Defiance & Dassault tie up - www.efficientmanufacturing.in

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