Dalit boy brutally assaulted by 5 uppercaste men in ghaziabad

[fanne]

Define force?

mostly in wars , if hindus were defeated they were given option to convert or get killed , those opted for conversion got their lives spared.

Of course, but that's not a forced conversion.

ofcourse , that is not forced .
in my view it was a wise decision to convert than losing lives , respect womefolks and respect all .

 

[Nilu Pule]

Obviously rape would have occurred, but not in large numbers otherwise it would have been documented.

These foreigners settled down, they didn't just screw the women and leave.

I'm not saying we are genetically more similar to them than say a non-Muslim Kashmiri, Punjabi or Sindhi, I'm saying we are descended from members of their societies who came during the Islamic conquests and our genetics clearly show this. However, they also show that these people did assimilate into the region and as a result form only a minor component of our ancestry (however, for some of us it's still fairly significant). Also, there were still plenty of people from Pakistan working side by side with them, occupying high positions (or forming their own dynasties) and being treated as equals, not as inferiors (a few crazies tried to peddle that theory but they flopped).

Pashtuns and Baluchis are genetically more similar to other Pakistanis than Baluchis or Pashtuns from Afghanistan or Iran.

Not always, we're all (mostly) pretty similar in colour and can be pretty fluid in terms of other parts of our phenotype, I have my fair share of incorrectly guessing someone's origins, and people have done the same with me.

Hindustani muslims was the term used for subcontinental muslims. They were considered inferior by the foreign Muslims . Even the Hindustani muslims who had some foreign ancestory were looked down upon.

A pakistani gujjar does not look different from an Indian hindu one. Their dressing style and hairstyle/beardstyle might differ. But they are of the same stock.

 

[AfrazulMandal]

It was fair though, they did try to (and still try to) do the same to us.

Nah.

Except for Babri, they did not dare touch any other place.

They were destroyed because they were centers of ignorance.

Look at Bamiyan. Look at Taxila. What good have they done to the world?

Define force?

Options given to keep land for instance.

We had the right to destroy our enemies. But if they accepted the right path, they were spared.

Of course, but that's not a forced conversion.

It's coercion.

But hey.

They lived. And they became civilized.

that is not forced .
in my view it was a wise decision to convert than losing lives , respect womefolks and respect all .

What happened happens for good.

For truth to shine, darkness had to go.

Hindus and Buddhists were and still are addicted to their wrong ways. Removing addiction is a PAINFUL process and it needs force.

 

[Hamza913]

mostly in wars , if hindus were defeated they were given option to convert or get killed , those opted for conversion got their lives spared.

That would have happened, but those who opted for conversion would have went back to their previous religion.

In fact, most people who converted for non-genuine reasons would have almost certainly still retained their old religions but would have been less public in their display.

Hindustani muslims was the term used for subcontinental muslims. They were considered inferior by the foreign Muslims . Even the Hindustani muslims who had some foreign ancestory were looked down upon.

A pakistani gujjar does not look different from an Indian hindu one. Their dressing style and hairstyle/beardstyle might differ. But they are of the same stock.

Only a few held those kinds of deranged views, not the majority.

Gujjars are a pretty diverse group in terms of phenotype, I wouldn't paint us all with one brush.

It's coercion.

Yeah, which is slightly different to my definition of force, i.e killing someone if they don't convert.

 

[Nilu Pule]

Muslim conquerers in India lost their spirit. Collecting jizya became their goal. They should have entirely removed all these Hindu Buddhist Jain influences. We would have been united and more than a match for any country in the world.

Ok bro! Yu complete their unfinished work.

That would have happened, but those who opted for conversion would have went back to their previous religion.

No they couldn't. Because there was death penalty for apostates during Islamic rule.

 

[Hamza913]

No they couldn't. Because there was death penalty for apostates during Islamic rule.

They could only do that if they had enough evidence, and Hindus would have been clever enough to keep their faith private or live in mostly Hindu neighbourhoods where nobody would report them. Same for other non-Muslims.

 

[AfrazulMandal]

Ok bro! Yu complete their unfinished work.



No they couldn't. Because there was death penalty for apostates during Islamic rule.

Inshallah we will.

Yeah, which is slightly different to my definition of force, i.e killing someone if they don't convert.

Ok. Our definition a vary. But yeah force was used because it was necessary.

In fact, most people who converted for non-genuine reasons would have almost certainly still retained their old religions but would have been less public in their display.

Difficult in muslim ruled areas. It difficult even in India of today. Remote areas were different. Plus another thing.
Reverts in India were fed beef. This made them feel that they will never be allowed back in Buddhism Sikhism Jainism or Hinduism. That was a checkmate. Genius.

They could only do that if they had enough evidence, and Hindus would have been clever enough to keep their faith private or live in mostly Hindu neighbourhoods where nobody would report them. Same for other non-Muslims.

That was why most of the rural India remained non Muslim. Most of the urban areas became muslim.
But sultans should have shown more zeal to plant our Deen.

 

[Nilu Pule]

They could only do that if they had enough evidence, and Hindus would have been clever enough to keep their faith private or live in mostly Hindu neighbourhoods where nobody would report them. Same for other non-Muslims.

Lol!!! I am no fan of hinduism/brahminism.

Do you even know how rigid hinduism was back in the day?

Hindu army men who served British overseas, lost their caste. They were ostracized by their fellow caste brethren.

British missionairies used food to trick Hindus into conversion. They used to give bread to poor hindus. To those who ate it, they used to say you are a Christian now. Other Hindus wouldn't accept back into the fold.

These stories might sound ridiculous. But they are true.

Some were forcefully converted. Many converted( Rajput Muslims) to escape jizya and enjoy extra priveleges.

 

[Hamza913]

Do you even know how rigid hinduism was back in the day?

To be fair, I don't.

Your explanation seems plausible, but I still think they would have just gone back to Hinduism and be accepted if they truly were threatened to convert or die, I don't think Hindu's were that rigid back then.

But sultans should have shown more zeal to plant our Deen.

Many Sultans lived embarrassingly lavish lifestyles and did not care for the religion, but they still had sincerely devout soldiers among their ranks.

For example, Akbar was an apostate and openly encouraged the Mughal elite to become less religious, and most followed suit (but very few openly declared apostasy like he did). However, some clutched onto Islam and never let go, one notable example was Akbar's top general Shahbaz Khan (he was a Punjabi from Lahore, so much for inferior Ajlafs lol). His dedication to Islam was very fierce, he kept his beard, regularly offered namaz and his colleagues would often lament him for being too into spreading Islam across Hindustan. His religious zeal even in the face of it being widely unpopular even seems to have impressed Akbar who let him keep his position.

He's definitely one of my favourite heroes from the Islamic conquests of Hindustan since he proves that no, locals were not viewed as inferior and also got pretty high positions.

He conquered large portions of Hindustan during Akbar's reign, participating in some of the Mughal Empire's toughest battles and even managed affairs of the state whilst Akbar went out on longer expeditions. Many rebellions were also put down during under his leadership, and he revolutionised the Mughal military system to make it less corrupt and a more efficient fighting force (much to the dismay of the other corrupt officers).

There were still some excellent Sultans though, such as Sikander Shah Mir (another Ajlaf, a Kashmiri Gujjar to be precise) or Aurangzeb Alamgir.

 

[50cent]

any message for pakistani dalits ?




some eye opening facts .

Stick to topic India minority

 

[fanne]

To be fair, I don't.

Your explanation seems plausible, but I still think they would have just gone back to Hinduism and be accepted if they truly were threatened to convert or die, I don't think Hindu's were that rigid back then.

it was impossible to revert back to hinduism once you ate or drink with muslims back then.
hinduism was one way traffic till swami dayanand started shudhi of converted muslims in india , even shudhi was not accepted by rigid hindus and shudhi muslims again reverted to muslim fold .

 

[Hamza913]

it was impossible to revert back to hinduism once you ate or drink with muslims back then.

I'm not talking about long term converts who changed their minds, I'm talking about the ones who were converted by force and immediately became Hindu afterwards.

I'm fairly certain that if they didn't socialise with Muslims, they'd be fine.

 

[fanne]

I'm not talking about long term converts who changed their minds, I'm talking about the ones who were converted by force and immediately became Hindu afterwards.

I'm fairly certain that if they didn't socialise with Muslims, they'd be fine.

hinduism was a bigot, backward and rigid religion in middle ages . still it has kept it's backward ness intact .

 

[pothead]

Hehehe..funny thread.

From Rohit "Fake Dalit" Vemula whose mother apparently sold her sons dead body for 20 lakhs and an apartment to every fake Dalit outrage, the vultures are circling.

The Dalit lynchings from kerala to West Bengal do not matter to these vultures as they are done by their owns seculars.
BUT they are loosing elections after elections and are about to loose much bigger with in an year should tell u about their desperation.

 

[fanne]

Hehehe..funny thread.

From Rohit "Fake Dalit" Vemula whose mother apparently sold her sons dead body for 20 lakhs and an apartment to every fake Dalit outrage, the vultures are circling.

The Dalit lynchings from kerala to West Bengal do not matter to these vultures as they are done by their owns seculars.
BUT they are loosing elections after elections and are about to loose much bigger with in an year should tell u about their desperation.

everything finally converges on election and vote politics .