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Current Account Surplus for First Time in 4 Years in October 2019

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Historically, Pakistan has always been able to take the first initial steps, followed by abject failures in the basic structural reforms needed. All the aspirin in the world does not help if the many abscesses are not drained.

Let us see how things are different this time around, or not.
I dont generally post in these topics but just enquiring,,why n how the medical metaphors u guys r using r representative of Pakistans economy.
Baseline- i dont claim to have any knowledge about commerce,,,but how the hell fever n abscess represent pak economy.
Ps- treatment continues without handling fever,,,n abscesses r excised ,,no aspirin.
Perhaps i am desi doctor n dont know civilized white medicine
 
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I dont generally post in these topics but just enquiring,,why n how the medical metaphors u guys r using r representative of Pakistans economy.
Baseline- i dont claim to have any knowledge about commerce,,,but how the hell fever n abscess represent pak economy.
Ps- treatment continues without handling fever,,,n abscesses r excised ,,no aspirin.
Perhaps i am desi doctor n dont know civilized white medicine

I used that analogy only to tie in to the use of the "broad aspirin" metaphor by @Nilgiri . (I could identify more pathology quite directly, but then it disturbs the natives. :D )

This is definitely good news. But I’m also a bit sceptical as to what this might have cost us, let’s wait till we get a breakdown of what sort of imports have decreased, which exports have increased, and what’s happening with FDI, I’ve been getting worrying news on capital flight and outflows, and not much more than portfolio investments in. We need to know what this current account surplus cost us too, we know it cost us PKR devaluation, inflation and lower growth, but hopefully GFCF and inward investment wasn’t sacrificed too.

Anyway, I hope the economy adjusts to this and then we can get more sustainable growth going forward.

For now, it is important to support any positive developments, whatever they might be. The real economic battle is yet to be fought, quite clearly.
 
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Someone tell this retard that it is because of their attempts to 'engineer' a negative CAD the price of commodities and other items has further skyrocketed and it is the reason that tomatoes are selling for more than Rs. 300/kg.....some achievement indeed!

What is even more sad is the fact that this gimmick works even on the apparently educated.
What kinda science is that ?
I mean you do know simple economics right ?

Tomato prices are high due to two simple reasons
Devaluation
And
Seasonal variation

CAD should be within limits..correction isnt called engineering rather than letting it go high due to artificial high rupee is called engineering

Now i am certian that you know this stuff so its basically denial nothing else..
 
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Or you can say that those self proclaimed "Very Educated" actually don't know sh^t.
The commodities prices are rising because the economy is import based. The growth was fuelled by the imports rather than production to meet the demands of goods and services. The traders are raising the prices.
We also know that traders are dead against IK/PTI because of their efforts to formalise and document the economy.
The thieves know that if this government continues for few more years, eventually they would be caught out and have to cough up tax and penalties for the trillions of rupees they have made through so-called "trade" without every declaring any substantial profits in their official tax returns.
Have you forgotten the tax returns of non other than the greatest scammer, the 3 times PM of Pakistan!
Best Tax Return of his life is still less than my income. And I am just a poor Joe.

Pakistanis had been taken for a ride. Don't you dare talk about economics, about which you know jack all.

So you say that the growth was merely import based; do you want to pick up the details of production over the past 15 years in poultry, agriculture, services, defense etc.? Or would you rather discuss the energy infrastructure and power generation in the past 15 years? Please do not FORCE me to defend PML because I am a victim of their neglect of Karachi but just because NS did not pay any income tax, while he was evidently paying WEALTH tax, it does not mean that all PML policies were wrong. Their delivery on road network and power generation alone is commendable.

On the other hand you are claiming that the business community/traders are against PTI and IK; are you so naive to believe that the country can progress through war on traders?????? A sane person does not take traders on, he speaks to them and takes the traders onboard; much like the Bangladeshi PM did and look where their economy is. There are always 2 ways to do thing, the right way, the wrong way...........PTI has only a very few things which they are doing the right way and even there we know who is leading the way.

I don't know why you would assume I don't know about economy when there are renowned economists with different schools of thought. But even if I speak to you as a layman I would tell you that after the latest increment in my salary I am actually taking home less then I was taking home last year and over that my purchasing power has further been reduced by 30% easily. My plans, for the new car, for the upgrade of the house, for investment, for my children's future have all faced setbacks and the honest PTI is responsible for this mess because my life was so much easier, comparatively, under the corrupt N-league. And by 'me' I mean the common Pakistani, including ofcourse myself.

This is what Nawaz and his corruption has produced . People with zero understanding of issues but yet mouth bigger than donkey’s.
It should be mandatory for all kids to get proper iodine so no one grows up to be stupid and Patwari.

You mean the same corruption of which an iota has NOT been proved just like Imran Khan's poor sister who made billion selling sewing machines?

Sometimes, one must ponder over claims of his 'love affair' rather then post insults because one merely ends up disclosing the family and category to which he belongs.

At the end harvest season tomatoes become expensive due to decrease in supply
In past vegetables were imported from India to decease prices I think patwaris want Pakistan to import tomatoes from India

Are only Patwaris buying tomatoes at Rs. 300 (Rs. 400 today in Karachi)?

You guys seriously need to get out of the political mentality and start thinking of Pakistan and your fellow countrymen. When tomatoes become more expensive in Pakistan, we must import just as we export tomatoes and onions when we have surplus. It is as simple as that.

What kinda science is that ?
I mean you do know simple economics right ?

Tomato prices are high due to two simple reasons
Devaluation
And
Seasonal variation

CAD should be within limits..correction isnt called engineering rather than letting it go high due to artificial high rupee is called engineering

Now i am certian that you know this stuff so its basically denial nothing else..

Tomato prices are high because of the Government's stubbornness and reactive approach. They did not allow timely import of tomatoes from Iran (usually it is imported from India) and only allowed import after the hue and cry over Rs. 300 (and now Rs. 400) per kg of Tomatoes.

CAD should indeed be in favour but not at the cost of consumers and larger damage to economy. If I earn X and end up paying X+Y just because the Government wants to manage CAD then what is the point of it all?
 
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this is superb progress . the hard work and austerity has finally paid off . the economic shock has been painful to us all...

two more years of stability and we shall be on the right track IA

congratulations
 
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Please do not FORCE me to defend PML because I am a victim of their neglect of Karachi but just because NS did not pay any income tax, while he was evidently paying WEALTH tax, it does not mean that all PML policies were wrong. Their delivery on road network and power generation alone is commendable.

On the other hand you are claiming that the business community/traders are against PTI and IK; are you so naive to believe that the country can progress through war on traders?????? A sane person does not take traders on, he speaks to them and takes the traders onboard; much like the Bangladeshi PM did and look where their economy is. There are always 2 ways to do thing, the right way, the wrong way...........PTI has only a very few things which they are doing the right way and even there we know who is leading the way.

I don't know why you would assume I don't know about economy when there are renowned economists with different schools of thought. But even if I speak to you as a layman I would tell you that after the latest increment in my salary I am actually taking home less then I was taking home last year and over that my purchasing power has further been reduced by 30% easily. My plans, for the new car, for the upgrade of the house, for investment, for my children's future have all faced setbacks and the honest PTI is responsible for this mess because my life was so much easier, comparatively, under the corrupt N-league. And by 'me' I mean the common Pakistani, including ofcourse myself.

You mean the same corruption of which an iota has NOT been proved just like Imran Khan's poor sister who made billion selling sewing machines?

Sometimes, one must ponder over claims of his 'love affair' rather then post insults because one merely ends up disclosing the family and category to which he belongs.

You guys seriously need to get out of the political mentality and start thinking of Pakistan and your fellow countrymen. When tomatoes become more expensive in Pakistan, we must import just as we export tomatoes and onions when we have surplus. It is as simple as that.



Tomato prices are high because of the Government's stubbornness and reactive approach. They did not allow timely import of tomatoes from Iran (usually it is imported from India) and only allowed import after the hue and cry over Rs. 300 (and now Rs. 400) per kg of Tomatoes.

CAD should indeed be in favour but not at the cost of consumers and larger damage to economy. If I earn X and end up paying X+Y just because the Government wants to manage CAD then what is the point of it all?

I don't know where to start.
Lets start with first very obvious statements of yours.

1- "Please do not FORCE me to defend PML because I am a victim of their neglect of Karachi.

2- but just because NS did not pay any income tax, while he was evidently paying WEALTH tax, it does not mean that all PML policies were wrong.

First one first, you admit that Karachi is neglected, by both PPP and PMLN. It is still neglected because PPP AKA Zardaris are hell bound to extract and money launder as much as they can. Therefore, if you are a Karachite, that reason alone should have been enough for you to understand what games had been played by both of these criminal parties masquerading as politicians.
For your information, they didn't do any good for Lahore either after spending billions upon billions on its "Development". Same goes for any other city.

Your second sentence is even more deadly for Pakistan nation. If you have any sense, you would have hated these two parties for this and this reason alone. I think very differently, that's why I criticise them. I have written extensively before 2013 elections, in the wishful thinking that I would make a contribution towards the betterment of my beloved Pakistan.

Let me quote a real life experience, which is repeated throughout the UK all year around.
In my youth after Uni I trained for a profession in which I used to attend various HMRC offices.
In my mix portfolio of clients were some small traders, one of which a certain Mr Patel owning few shops was reluctant to pay the fair dues to her majesty's government. I tried to advice him few times that "hath hola rakh". But the man thought he was getting away with it. Me knowing otherwise was extremely worried about him.
After declaring losses for few years, he fall in to the net and his number came. I accompanied him to his district's office of HRMC.
The story went like this, he was asked politely why he had failed to declared any reasonable income from his businesses for last few years!!
The man started to lie. After repeated requests and warnings by the officers dealing with the case, the man didn't came clean, his case officer started to produce evidence from his file.
How much mortgage he pays, How much private schools fees he paid for his kids, how much he transferred to banks and his relatives in Kenya, etc.etc.
You see my friend they had full record of his transactions. They can obtained record from all over the world. The guy was assessed for all those years, penalty and interests slapped on top of the assessed tax liabilities. Order to pay or face jail time.

Now quickly turn our attention to Mr. Fraudia AKA Nawaz Butt. The best income of his life, I repeat his life he declared was closely equal to £120,000 a year. We make that sort of income and I couldn't be able to visit Pakistan in last 10 years. Compare this Nawaz Butt's and his family members frequent visits to London in First Class.
That answers questions about Pakistani traders and industrialists from top to bottom. Don't you worry, I personally know families which are in top 10 richest in Pakistan to many hundreds of common traders owning big shops in your and my beloved Karachi. One of the reason I don't visit Pakistan is because of dirty and filthy conditions in Karachi.

I don't know which world you live in, but if you have any sense, you will never write the selfish comments you had above. You may be able to afford car etc. but there are millions upon millions of people in Pakistan, going hungry, dying from minor ailments because the medicines are not available.

Don't tell me it had happened over night in PTI's government.

Please don't start with criminal Dar's policies and his crime of artificially keeping the Rupee strong against the US Dollar. You should be thankful that IK and PTI have changed the course and moving the country in the right direction.
 
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I don't know which world you live in, but if you have any sense, you will never write the selfish comments you had above. You may be able to afford car etc. but there are millions upon millions of people in Pakistan, going hungry, dying from minor ailments because the medicines are not available.

I was not being selfish, we all have dreams and we all have plans. Some have plans to buy a goat, a sheep or a buffalo while others may have plans to buy a new car, house, yacht or Jet. And I wasn't only speaking about myself, i was speaking for the entire Pakistani nation. The intention was just to try and explain how our dreams, individually and collectively, have been shattered by PTI's 1 year in power. And the entire blame lies on PTI for this entire mess; they could have continued with the same handicaps while fixing things one by one instead of trying to fix everything all at once and wreaking havoc with our lives.........

I know that it cannot get any worse and perhaps that was the real intention of PTI all along to make things worse in the first couple of years so that people remember only the better things when economy and situation starts to stabilize in the last 2 years of the Government, right before elections. My contention is that there is a right way to do the right thing and there is a wrong way to do the right thing; PTI chose the worst way to try and do the right thing and perhaps that too after danda from Daddy.
 
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At macro level, things do look stable and improving but this needs to be translated at micro level as well like prices of food and other daily use commodities going down.
A British proverb:
Look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves.
 
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I was not being selfish, we all have dreams and we all have plans. Some have plans to buy a goat, a sheep or a buffalo while others may have plans to buy a new car, house, yacht or Jet. And I wasn't only speaking about myself, i was speaking for the entire Pakistani nation. The intention was just to try and explain how our dreams, individually and collectively, have been shattered by PTI's 1 year in power. And the entire blame lies on PTI for this entire mess; they could have continued with the same handicaps while fixing things one by one instead of trying to fix everything all at once and wreaking havoc with our lives.........

I know that it cannot get any worse and perhaps that was the real intention of PTI all along to make things worse in the first couple of years so that people remember only the better things when economy and situation starts to stabilize in the last 2 years of the Government, right before elections. My contention is that there is a right way to do the right thing and there is a wrong way to do the right thing; PTI chose the worst way to try and do the right thing and perhaps that too after danda from Daddy.

There was no other way. We were technically bankrupt. What would you do differently? Please suggest:

- current account deficit was expected to be 18-20 billion, we were bleeding 2 billion a month

- fiscal deficit was more than 6% iirc

- we had obligations to pay 11 billion in debt repayment or default which would have been uglier than what we have been through

- rupee was over valued so hampering exports and causing block in recovery in CAD situation


- Net reserves were actually negative


Now tell me what would you have done differently?
 
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There was no other way. We were technically bankrupt. What would you do differently? Please suggest:

- current account deficit was expected to be 18-20 billion, we were bleeding 2 billion a month

- fiscal deficit was more than 6% iirc

- we had obligations to pay 11 billion in debt repayment or default which would have been uglier than what we have been through

- rupee was over valued so hampering exports and causing block in recovery in CAD situation


- Net reserves were actually negative


Now tell me what would you have done differently?

To start off, I would have completed my homework before assuming power......and I would have gone to IMF the day I had taken oath.

As for the the rest, it is a repeat cycle after exit of every Government; for reference please look up the state in which PPP Government left the coffers.

Somehow we are always under extreme debt, always on the verge of bankruptcy and always facing threats to our existence both foreign and domestic.

As for your comments on CAD & FD, it was the same under the previous Government but they managed through exports, remittances and loans thereby expanding the economy as opposed to the current Government which has borrowed even more and has actually managed to shrink the economy (quite possibly the first time in history of Pakistan). With the previous way of doing things, the exports would eventually have grown with availability of cheap surplus power (which was not available during PMLs 3-4 years due to negligence by Musharraf and PPP) and the expanding economy would have made it much easier to repay the loans.

There was NEVER any serious default situation........even PTI's first Finance Minister thought he could handle the economic affairs without even going to IMF. He could have done that too, but he failed to acknowledge the fact that you do not merely go to the IMF for loans, you go to IMF for reasons different altogether.

Net reserves while Dar was the FM were over 20 Billion USD and stable.

My friend, consider the last 5 years of PML Governance; now make 1 adjustment and assume that the establishment was providing a mere 25% of support to PML of which it is providing to PTI and then imagine the difference in everything it would have made, to our economy, to our internal security and external image etc.
 
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To start off, I would have completed my homework before assuming power......and I would have gone to IMF the day I had taken oath.

The IMF conditions were even tougher initially. So going to it right away as you suggest, tell me how would it have been easier on the general public as you were asking for in the previous post?

As for the the rest, it is a repeat cycle after exit of every Government; for reference please look up the state in which PPP Government left the coffers.

PPP left an annual CAD of 2 billion vs 2 billion a month left by PMLN

Somehow we are always under extreme debt, always on the verge of bankruptcy and always facing threats to our existence both foreign and domestic.

18-20 billion CAD which was ~7% of GDP was unprecedented.

As for your comments on CAD & FD, it was the same under the previous Government but they managed through exports, remittances and loans thereby expanding the economy

No one was willing to loan anything to Pakistan. You seem to have forgotten. We had to beg UAE, Saudia, China and Qatar, got 12-15 billion in financing and it got eaten up quickly in a years time due to huge CAD and short term loan taken by Dar that were due last year.

as opposed to the current Government which has borrowed even more and has actually managed to shrink the economy (quite possibly the first time in history of Pakistan).

Thank tears of rupee over value, if it was managed gradually over the years the GDP would not have taken the shock it had to.

With the previous way of doing things, the exports would eventually have grown with availability of cheap surplus power (which was not available during PMLs 3-4 years due to negligence by Musharraf and PPP) and the expanding economy would have made it much easier to repay the loans.

you did not have the luxury of “eventually” having the exports rise when you had to pay for 20 billion in CAD and 11 billion in short term loan. The world would not give leeway to you for what you owe them now:)

There was NEVER any serious default situation........even PTI's first Finance Minister thought he could handle the economic affairs without even going to IMF. He could have done that too, but he failed to acknowledge the fact that you do not merely go to the IMF for loans, you go to IMF for reasons different altogether.

He was quite clear on the default threat please dig out his old videos. Do a simple exercise, just check the net reserves number vs CAD of that time and tell me how it does not look like a real default situation to you? :)

Net reserves while Dar was the FM were over 20 Billion USD and stable.

borrowed money. It doesn’t take a genius to realize that when when your yearly CAD were as high as they were and growing each year.

My friend, consider the last 5 years of PML Governance; now make 1 adjustment and assume that the establishment was providing a mere 25% of support to PML of which it is providing to PTI and then imagine the difference in everything it would have made, to our economy, to our internal security and external image etc.

Oh please bro... be specific... did the export fall from 25 to 20 billion in the first 4 years due to the above, or some other policies of the PMLN government? If it has just maintained at 25 billion we would have had 15-20 billion actual earned foreign exchange and the situation would not have turned so ugly. Even the second finance minister of PMLN pointed that Dar’s policies were detrimental.
 
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i start growing hope now
the proble is : If i remember correctly pmln did this too but Pakistani governments in their bid to win elections spend a lot of money on useless stuff. I just PTI wont do that otherwise we will be in that shit again.
 
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I was not being selfish, we all have dreams and we all have plans. Some have plans to buy a goat, a sheep or a buffalo while others may have plans to buy a new car, house, yacht or Jet. And I wasn't only speaking about myself, i was speaking for the entire Pakistani nation. The intention was just to try and explain how our dreams, individually and collectively, have been shattered by PTI's 1 year in power. And the entire blame lies on PTI for this entire mess; they could have continued with the same handicaps while fixing things one by one instead of trying to fix everything all at once and wreaking havoc with our lives.........

I know that it cannot get any worse and perhaps that was the real intention of PTI all along to make things worse in the first couple of years so that people remember only the better things when economy and situation starts to stabilize in the last 2 years of the Government, right before elections. My contention is that there is a right way to do the right thing and there is a wrong way to do the right thing; PTI chose the worst way to try and do the right thing and perhaps that too after danda from Daddy.

Look brother, I understood your intentions. But when we comment here it is not addressed to an individual, it is for everyone who reads it. So my message was aimed at people at large.
Now to answer your points, it is understandable that people have dreams and plans, and they are disappointed if they couldn't fulfil those dreams and plans. I am sure many many millions are disappointed and disillusioned. Understandable entirely.

What you have to think is what could have been the alternatives!! Lets look at it with the spectacles of reality.
1- The Reserves were artificially boosted by Dollar's borrowing at very expense interest rates. They were all short term loans. So in reality the reserves were not even enough to pay one month's import.
2- If IK and the team didn't realised the situation early, Pakistan would have run out of the reserves quickly and could have defaulted on its international commitments.
3- It was a utmost priority to address the issue immediately. Asad Umer had to be scarified because he was not prepared to deal with the dire situation Dar and Butts left Pakistan. The choices were very clear, swallow the bitter pills and face the troubles head on. I am glad PTI did that, because the consequences of the failures were unthinkable.
4- Now the haemorrhaging is stopped, Pakistan can move gradually in to the right directions. There are two different kind of challenging facing the Federal Government at the moment, apart from the development plans and expenditures to stimulate the economy when we are stable.

A- Keep decreasing the imports. Launching initiatives to increase the country's infrastructure and production capabilities. Pakistan has to encourage foreign investors, especially Chinese companies to invest in Pakistan in production plants and facilities. That approach would result in two facet benefits for Pakistan;
i- Decrease the imports, and improve balance of trade/balance of payment crisis, which could have easily destroyed everything.
ii- Increase local industrial capacity that would result in increase in the export, if we concentrate to achieve investment in the fields/industries which would result in increase in exports. Huge potential in dairy farming and deployment of better agricultural techniques could pay huge dividends if agricultural yields increases. There are technologies available which can minimise the water usage and increase the yields.
iii- New agricultural techniques have to be introduced and implemented. We have huge swathe of land in Baluchistan, Sind, South Punjab, and lower KPK which could benefit from new irrigation techniques. Pakistan can increase its agricultural yields and irrigated land by many folds. Chinese had worked on their deserts and turned them in to green pastures, we have to get that technology from the Chinese as a priority. It would save us from water shortages in the future and would increase the available agriculture land by many folds.
B- The exports would increased from the measures stated above. The dual effect would be trade surpluses, surplus in current account, increase in the reserves.
C- The above three effects would improve the Rupee's exchange against Dollar and other currencies. That would bring down the prices.

I hope you understand that to continued what Butts and Dar were doing is suicidal. All Pakistanis should be thankful that IK/PTI are changing course and saving Pakistan from imminent disaster.

Furthermore, Pakistan needs to put emphasis on tax collection, which PTI is rightly doing. That would reduced the budget deficit and eventually would result in surplus.

I don't see anything wrong with PTI's policies. The only snag is that there are many treacherous snakes and crooks in Pakistan who had been making trillions from Pakistan without paying any taxes and making common man's life hell.
 
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Look brother, I understood your intentions. But when we comment here it is not addressed to an individual, it is for everyone who reads it. So my message was aimed at people at large.
Now to answer your points, it is understandable that people have dreams and plans, and they are disappointed if they couldn't fulfil those dreams and plans. I am sure many many millions are disappointed and disillusioned. Understandable entirely.

What you have to think is what could have been the alternatives!! Lets look at it with the spectacles of reality.
1- The Reserves were artificially boosted by Dollar's borrowing at very expense interest rates. They were all short term loans. So in reality the reserves were not even enough to pay one month's import.
2- If IK and the team didn't realised the situation early, Pakistan would have run out of the reserves quickly and could have defaulted on its international commitments.
3- It was a utmost priority to address the issue immediately. Asad Umer had to be scarified because he was not prepared to deal with the dire situation Dar and Butts left Pakistan. The choices were very clear, swallow the bitter pills and face the troubles head on. I am glad PTI did that, because the consequences of the failures were unthinkable.
4- Now the haemorrhaging is stopped, Pakistan can move gradually in to the right directions. There are two different kind of challenging facing the Federal Government at the moment, apart from the development plans and expenditures to stimulate the economy when we are stable.

A- Keep decreasing the imports. Launching initiatives to increase the country's infrastructure and production capabilities. Pakistan has to encourage foreign investors, especially Chinese companies to invest in Pakistan in production plants and facilities. That approach would result in two facet benefits for Pakistan;
i- Decrease the imports, and improve balance of trade/balance of payment crisis, which could have easily destroyed everything.
ii- Increase local industrial capacity that would result in increase in the export, if we concentrate to achieve investment in the fields/industries which would result in increase in exports. Huge potential in dairy farming and deployment of better agricultural techniques could pay huge dividends if agricultural yields increases. There are technologies available which can minimise the water usage and increase the yields.
iii- New agricultural techniques have to be introduced and implemented. We have huge swathe of land in Baluchistan, Sind, South Punjab, and lower KPK which could benefit from new irrigation techniques. Pakistan can increase its agricultural yields and irrigated land by many folds. Chinese had worked on their deserts and turned them in to green pastures, we have to get that technology from the Chinese as a priority. It would save us from water shortages in the future and would increase the available agriculture land by many folds.
B- The exports would increased from the measures stated above. The dual effect would be trade surpluses, surplus in current account, increase in the reserves.
C- The above three effects would improve the Rupee's exchange against Dollar and other currencies. That would bring down the prices.

I hope you understand that to continued what Butts and Dar were doing is suicidal. All Pakistanis should be thankful that IK/PTI are changing course and saving Pakistan from imminent disaster.

Furthermore, Pakistan needs to put emphasis on tax collection, which PTI is rightly doing. That would reduced the budget deficit and eventually would result in surplus.

I don't see anything wrong with PTI's policies. The only snag is that there are many treacherous snakes and crooks in Pakistan who had been making trillions from Pakistan without paying any taxes and making common man's life hell.
Retrospectively asad umar was right though...
The correction was achieved much earlier..so we did over correct things..you dont need surplus..just need to limit it to 1-2% of GDP

But if there was indeed resistance from asad umar on hard decision than it was the right decision though hugely unpopular

Key issues are still growth, inflation and taxation
They are connected to each other you can get taxes without growth but you cant grow without taxes

Time to target the retail sector
 
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