CPEC Turns into a Chinese Albatross on Pakistan’s neck – Asia Sentinel

[Laozi]

secondly let me school you in some basic economics my temple educated indian friend.
when you buy a product from google no benefit comes to India just because the CEO of the company is indian. but when you buy any electronics that is made in china regardless what nationality the CEO of the company is China gets a percentage of benefit from it because at the end of the day the product is made in china.

In India if one is educated in a gurukul ( temple ) then it is considered an honour. I pray to almighty that in my next life I may be granted that honour of being educated in a Guru's temple.

If world's biggest companies are being headed by Indians then it proves two things.
1. World find Indians capable of doing so.
2. Such capable individuals will share their experience and knowledge to guide India to a brighter future.

Of course you cannot see any of the above intangible benefits which one reaps in future.

End of the day, products will be made by countries having cheap and skilled labour and Services will be provided by countries having more elite educated citizens

Thanks anyway for sharing your knowledge of economics with us.

 

[randomradio]

Yeh of course I will. I lived in the West all my life in sea of people - many with delusions of superiority. I never brooked it once. And you think now I am going to get treated second class by Chinese? You fcukin kidding me here. No s.o.b will ever treat me second class - blond, blue eyed or short, epicanthic folds or Arab. My brother hangs around lots of Chinese in Sheffield. He bags the Chinese women faster then you can blink. The Koreans are a bit more tighter but they melt as well. How you are treated depends on the value you place on yourself. Our parents did not raise no second class to anybody. If you can handle English many of whom are large men with physical/intellectual and strong personalties - Chinese by comparison are children.

Now if I see a beautiful women then yeh I don't mind being treated second class

That's not what I'm talking about. You will see Chinese-only hotels and malls, Chinese-only apartment complexes. SEZs will favour Chinese over Pakistani companies. You will see laws being framed that favour the Chinese, so on and so forth. More of a class difference, not race. Gwadar will in effect become a Chinese city.

For example, the immigration plans for 500,000 Chinese is actually a gated community called China Pak Hills. It's being built by the Chinese for the Chinese. Why will they invite you in?

And they are calling it a "first phase" project, so you know it's not going to end there.

Haven't you noticed? The Chinese are forcing the Pakistanis to allow the free use of yuan in Gwadar. Why do you think that is? Saner heads in Pak have stopped that for now, but for how long?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

example, the immigration plans for 500,000 Chinese is actually a gated community called China Pak Hills. It's being built by the Chinese for the Chinese. Why will they invite you in?

Yeh see one of the psychological effects of having been enslaved and this includes us all South Asians is 70 years after our freedom we suffer from a victim complex. Deep down we still are carrying the trauma of slavery and thus are still hostage to the colonial period as victims.

This condition is for example reflected in being overly consumed by the concept of soverignty. The reality is very few countries today are entirely soveriegn. The global trading order and defence pacts across the world eat into most countries sovereignty. Not long ago we used to have huge USAF airbases in UK that were armed with nukes. These bases mostly functioned beyond the remit of HM government. Mighty countries that fought like lions and are still the stuff of military history and movies like Germany and Japan had and still have huge US military bases. Some are as large as small towns with their own airfields, hospitals, police etc. 9/11 happens in New York and we have German troopers, Norwegian commandos, Latvian soldiers, French Legionaires, Danish commandos, Canadian paratroopers, Australian heli-troops patrolling in middle of Afghanistan when non ever got touched by 9/11. It's the price they pay of being part of a larger defence and econonmic order. No country can a be island unto itself.

We have to get past this "victim complex" and act with confidence. A bit like a rape victim sees a rapist around every corner we see our sovereignty under threat at every corner. We must move forward from this victim complex. Therefore if Pakistan has to even lease out the hammer head which until yesterday was just eight miles of sand and cliffs it is no problem. The real "gold" here is creating a economic linkage that injects much need competition and fresh ideas inside Pakistan. Right now Pakistan is stale with Mullah breath. We desperately need the country to be opended up to the outside. This is rather embarrasing but I will let you into a secret that not many Pakistanis will admit - either because of misplaced pride or ignorance. Pakistan has no real industry and no real industrialists. So this talk of Pakistani industry being wiped out is hocus pocus.

Our real industry is people export, followed by commodity export, followed by renting our strategic location. With the Chinese for the first time we have a chance that Pakistanis might be introduced to thinking like businessmen. That is why I went as far as suggesting leasing the hammerhead in Gwadar to China.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/gwadar-goes-red-specabad.530463/

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Yeh see one of the psychological effects of having been enslaved and this includes us all South Asians is 70 years after our freedom we suffer from a victim complex. Deep down we still are carrying the trauma of slavery and thus are still hostage to the colonial period as victims.

This condition is for example reflected in being overly consumed by the concept of soverignty. The reality is very few countries today are entirely soveriegn. The global trading order and defence pacts across the world eat into most countries sovereignty. Not long ago we used to have huge USAF airbases in UK that were armed with nukes. These bases mostly functioned beyond the remit of HM government. Mighty countries that fought like lions and are still the stuff of military history and movies like Germany and Japan had and still have huge US military bases. Some are as large as small towns with their own airfields, hospitals, police etc. 9/11 happens in New York and we have German troopers, Norwegian commandos, Latvian soldiers, French Legionaires, Danish commandos, Canadian paratroopers, Australian heli-troops patrolling in middle of Afghanistan when non ever got touched by 9/11. It's the price they pay of being part of a larger defence and econonmic order. No country can a be island unto itself.

We have to get past this "victime complex" and act with confidence. Therefore if Pakistan has to even lease out the hammer head which until yesterday was just eight miles of sand and cliffs it is no problem. The real "gold" here is creating a economic linkage that injects much need competition and fresh ideas inside Pakistan. Right now Pakistan is stale with Mullah breath. We desperately needthe country to be opended up to the outside. This is rather embarrasing but I will let you into a secret that not many Pakistanis will admit - either because of misplaced pride or ignorance. Pakistan has no real industry and no real industrialists. So this talk of Pakistani industry being wiped out is hocus pocus.

Our real industry is people export, followed by commodity export, followed by renting our strategic location. With the Chinese for the first time we have a chance that Pakistanis might be introduced to thinking like businessmen. That is why I went as far as suggesting leasing the hammerhead in Gwadar to China.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/gwadar-goes-red-specabad.530463/

"Mullah Breath"........ .......obviously a Mullah at a London Mosque must have burped near you after Iftar and you can still remeber the smell.............happened to me nearly 20 years when I was at college.........

 

[khanmubashir]

So for you, Atheism is okay as long as you have certain qualities.

May all Hindu and Islamic fanatics start believing in this concept.

Regards and respect



Thanks fot being so candid and having a practical and tested solution for the likely future crisis



who can revert to a religion which is the newest

I also said Chinese r smart enough to know that the reason USA failed in Afghanistan was that it disregarded our interest so we made USA interest unachievable in Afghanistan Chinese r here to make money and we would be allowing so to get our cut and they would have to accommodate us otherwise they can't make money ie and they know it
And as USA Afghnistan saudi Yemen episodes show we look out for our interest so foreign trolls don't need to worry about us

I also said Chinese r smart enough to know that the reason USA failed in Afghanistan was that it disregarded our interest so we made USA interest unachievable in Afghanistan Chinese r here to make money and we would be allowing so to get our cut and they would have to accommodate us otherwise they can't make money ie and they know it
And as USA Afghnistan saudi Yemen episodes show we look out for our interest so foreign trolls don't need to worry about us

And these news of cancellation of some contracts like bhasha dam to China or decline of allowing Yuan use in gwadar is indication of demanding better terms which they have to provide as they have invested there 60 billions $ and only we can ensure it works same as we r the one who can provide solution of Afghnistan and USA knows it and so does China

 

[Laozi]

I also said Chinese r smart enough to know that the reason USA failed in Afghanistan was that it disregarded our interest so we made USA interest unachievable in Afghanistan Chinese r here to make money and we would be allowing so to get our cut and they would have to accommodate us otherwise they can't make money ie and they know it
And as USA Afghnistan saudi Yemen episodes show we look out for our interest so foreign trolls don't need to worry about us

I am sure people like you who are candid enough to accept and challenge super powers can look after their nation's interest. Good Luck

And these news of cancellation of some contracts like bhasha dam to China or decline of allowing Yuan use in gwadar is indication of demanding better terms which they have to provide as they have invested there 60 billions $ and only we can ensure it works same as we r the one who can provide solution of Afghnistan and USA knows it and so does China

I am glad that your new PM has guts to demand better deal from China

 

[khanmubashir]

I am sure people like you who are candid enough to accept and challenge super powers can look after their nation's interest. Good Luck



I am glad that your new PM has guts to demand better deal from China

I am not saying original cpec agreement was bad for us because it was a whole frame work of several with different conditions and arrangements now we want the less favorable ones to be modified And we r gonna get em too because now Chinese r vested

And we r gonna get em too because now Chinese r vested

So no need of Indian trolls who use names of Chinese to be worried for us

 

[SBUS-CXK]

Ohh please cry me a river.

stop false flagging and then we can have a mature discussion on anything you want. right now all i see is a wana be indian who's probably never step foot outside India pretending to be American so people on the forum give him some credibility

Change your flags then we can talk. i dont know why you are embarrassed using an Indian flag

Americans really care about CPEC?
NO. and how many Americans did you see in this thread?

So it's obvious. It seems that some members have no confidence in their own country. Oh, because it's very failed.

 

[4GTejasBVR]

I am sick of hearing India didn't achieve this because of this or that for many decades already.
Sick of hearing India WILL BE THIS and WILL BE THAT for ages.
If you are happy to have freedom to be poor, then be happy and no need to give any more excuses.

DON'T tell me your problem.
Solve it yourself and tell us about it after you solved it and made a success of it, NOT BEFORE.
No more WILL BE, please.

You think as if only India have such problems, and the success of other countries is not because of its people's willingness to make sacrifices and endure injustice and unfairness for the sake of their country.
.

LOL show this attitude else where. Not with Indians. And bottles bullcraps with me. I have good friends of chinese origin who says different things. All you little people first grow up. One little ching mong war in ur region will through ur little countries back Into decades.

wow, 1 billion Dalits democracy... they don't know the bureaucrats in India... so I say Indians don't know their country. Lol, a lovely Indian.

It seems that illiterate countries have better "fantasies".

LOL look who is talking? When ever you use an android or google search always remember Indians managing it. Illiterate Indians hahaha.

Be bold. So as per you China became superpower? Or not. Yes or no simple question

Keep talking indian BS. More pathetic excuses as to why india is too weak, powerless and unable to fight Pakistan despite india being 7x bigger than us and having abundant access to the world's most advanced weapons systems whilst we are denied this privilege..........

Come on then! What are you waiting for? Don't keep talking. Come and try us if you can. If not then indians are all talk. As they have been for at least 5000 years

U means we have been for 5000 years? Or u are assuming you are from dubai sheikh family tree

 

[Dungeness]

Well, you don't understand me at all. CCP is one big failure.
Pakistan is not armour for my failure, it never was. Insignificant to us as an economic threat. May be security threat to that matter.
And we haven't failed, we are improvising.

It's like a black humor when an Indian calls CCP a failure.

 

[SBUS-CXK]

LOL show this attitude else where. Not with Indians. And bottles bullcraps with me. I have good friends of chinese origin who says different things. All you little people first grow up. One little ching mong war in ur region will through ur little countries back Into decades.



LOL look who is talking? When ever you use an android or google search always remember Indians managing it. Illiterate Indians hahaha.

Be bold. So as per you China became superpower? Or not. Yes or no simple question


U means we have been for 5000 years? Or u are assuming you are from dubai sheikh family tree

Wow, so the Indian is the boss of Android or Google?
No, you are just an employee.

This is the boss.

so sorry, we do not have the "superpower" propaganda, it belongs only to India.

 

[Suriya]

The decisive factor in CPEC is not going to be interest rates, the industries. business practices, roads, repayments but something more in the arena of politics. Down the road I can guarantee that we will see a Chinese versus Mullah standoff. As more and more Chinese move into Pakistan CPEC will begin to take off. This will lead to more Chinese moving to Pakistan. The more Chinese will be measure of success.

However this will start a ticking bomb. At some stage, somewhere some Chinese are inadvertantly going end up falling foul of some Mullah who will then launch a demonstration like they did in Faizabad recently. This will place the Chinese against the Mullahs. The former will not give in a inch. Then the federal government will get involved because of Chinese pressure. The Chinese will expect a robust action. How this then plays out will decide the fate of CPEC. If the Chinese lose out they will gradually lose interest in long term plan and then just focus on the short term to recuperate their investment. Long Term investment will fizzle out. By way of example we may use the Lal Masjid incident of 2007 as a pointer to the future. Quote -


Students at the Red Mosque's two affiliated seminaries launched a campaign for Shari'a, occupying a nearby children's library and embarking on vigilante raids through the capital to stop what they called "un-Islamic activities," such as DVD vendors, barber shops and a Chinese-run massage parlor that they accused of being a brothel.[21]

On 27 March 2007, female students from Jamia Hafsa kidnapped three women, who they accused of running a brothel, and seized two policemen.[23] All of the women were released after supposedly confessing to running the brothel and were shown on the television wearing burqas. Also due in part to an intercession from the Chinese Ambassador, Luo Zhaohui.[24]

​

ISLAMABAD, June 23: The government on Saturday averted a near ‘diplomatic disaster’ between Pakistan and China by securing the release of nine Chinese nationals, six of them women, who were abducted by the Lal Masjid brigade form a massage parlour.
Islamabad remained in the grip of intense diplomatic and security activity, with the Chinese envoy pleading the case of the abducted women and men with highly-embarrassed government functionaries.

https://www.dawn.com/news/253217/chinese-hostages-freed

Thus far we can have all the shenanigans within Pakistan but because Pakistan is islolated from the external world - something obvious by the limited foreign airlines operating in Pakistan despite being a country of 200 million people. However with CPEC Pakistan will open up to lots of Chinese. In this scenario it is only matter of when not if that the Chinese end up tripping on the Mullah trap. As we know it does not take much for that to happen. The Lal Masjid incident is a reminder of that.

With huge deluge of Chinese the chance of another similiar standoff taking place will be on the cards. Exactly how this then plays out will decide the fate of CPEC. Success or it will fizzle out. We will find out in time. The clock is ticking.

You're gonna see that Chinese businessmen wear local style cloth and visit Mullas with gifts, he may promise to help Mullas and his followers to dig some wells and provide them clean waters, this is a true story happened in Balochistan in the past. Chinese are good at turning a bad thing into a positive thing for both sides, in Chinese culture, danger and opportunity is two sides of the same coin.

The most funny thing you probably find is, some Chinese businessman will learn Qu'ran and talk about Islam with Mullas, and he even can convert to Islam, finally, they become ally of Mullas!

Forget to rely on Chinese to help you resolve the *Mulla Dilemma*.

1.China men don't know Pakistani Mullah at all

2.Pakistani Mullahs don't know China man at all


CPEC will change pakistan and more importantly pakistanis for ever for better or worse. A certain change from current discourse is waiting ahead .

 

[Sankpal]

Good project by china for Chinese economy and China.

Sorry to say but same can't say about pakistan. China is the beneficiary country.

 

[Max]

cheap propaganda piece, lots of them will come, some of them in reputed media too, those who are butthurt with CPEC will try to stir hatred between Pakistan and China as usual with their low IQ propaganda and fail.

The Gwadar port profit sharing agreement is similar to what we offered to Singapore port authority but they wasted time and did nothing. moreover its on BOT whatever Chinese port authority will build (planned port city) will be transferred to Gawadar port authority after lease end. Pakistan will not spend a single penny.

As for Chinese coming to Pakistan, They are more then welcome, but the fact is Pakistan outnumber Chinese even on their own financed projects like power plants let alone the projects (with loans) for highways and motorways which are under construction by Govt run FWO..

not to mention all provinces and federal stake holder discuss the projects and its further scrutinised by parliamentary, provincial and Senate committees on CPEC.

 

[randomradio]

Yeh see one of the psychological effects of having been enslaved and this includes us all South Asians is 70 years after our freedom we suffer from a victim complex. Deep down we still are carrying the trauma of slavery and thus are still hostage to the colonial period as victims.

This condition is for example reflected in being overly consumed by the concept of soverignty. The reality is very few countries today are entirely soveriegn. The global trading order and defence pacts across the world eat into most countries sovereignty. Not long ago we used to have huge USAF airbases in UK that were armed with nukes. These bases mostly functioned beyond the remit of HM government. Mighty countries that fought like lions and are still the stuff of military history and movies like Germany and Japan had and still have huge US military bases. Some are as large as small towns with their own airfields, hospitals, police etc. 9/11 happens in New York and we have German troopers, Norwegian commandos, Latvian soldiers, French Legionaires, Danish commandos, Canadian paratroopers, Australian heli-troops patrolling in middle of Afghanistan when non ever got touched by 9/11. It's the price they pay of being part of a larger defence and econonmic order. No country can a be island unto itself.

We have to get past this "victim complex" and act with confidence. A bit like a rape victim sees a rapist around every corner we see our sovereignty under threat at every corner. We must move forward from this victim complex. Therefore if Pakistan has to even lease out the hammer head which until yesterday was just eight miles of sand and cliffs it is no problem. The real "gold" here is creating a economic linkage that injects much need competition and fresh ideas inside Pakistan. Right now Pakistan is stale with Mullah breath. We desperately need the country to be opended up to the outside. This is rather embarrasing but I will let you into a secret that not many Pakistanis will admit - either because of misplaced pride or ignorance. Pakistan has no real industry and no real industrialists. So this talk of Pakistani industry being wiped out is hocus pocus.

Our real industry is people export, followed by commodity export, followed by renting our strategic location. With the Chinese for the first time we have a chance that Pakistanis might be introduced to thinking like businessmen. That is why I went as far as suggesting leasing the hammerhead in Gwadar to China.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/gwadar-goes-red-specabad.530463/

Dude, you are trying to find some weird philosophical solution that won't work for a very real problem. There's a huge difference between having a victim complex and allowing yourself to become a victim.

What you are basically saying is, "Hey, that lake is full of crocs. If I change my attitude, they won't attack me, so I can enter the water without worries".