Complete Ban or limited viewing of the forum for all indian users

[Peshwa]

I'm against the ban, so it's clear that you aren't on my side.

Agreed.

 

[Brar]

Is it just me or is it really bizarre that this @Dalit guy is complaining about trolling and hate posts??? I mean come one!!!

And lets be honest. If Indians were not allowed here, pakistanis would just be fighting and trolling each others. You should be happy with the indian members as they serve as collective punching bag that unites pakistanis

 

[Musings]

No need to ban them. learn from them. Try to understand the obsession - educate them. If they are beyond that are continue the manure talk - ban them.

the site needs them and they obviously need us.

 

[rott]

The site will see a huge drop in traffic

Agreed. Indians generate money for PDF. That's why they're our best customer. But sadly it's not gonna be like that anymore.

i agree with you, admins must check other significant and important activity also
1. anti women posts, those demeaning women. no matter who, all are given birth by a women. so respect them
2. anti religion posts, super bad. specially against Hindus. never post such posts...they are always in bad taste
3. and ti Hindu gods posts, anyone can post such things here and can get away with it. but posting it is really bad.
4. one liners... they don't add value to any thread.

all these type of posts are really really bad.... and you and I should work to control them than creating polls like this.

The First person to ban should be you.

 

[Dalit]

Don't misquote me!

I said, "nonsensical suggestion", and then "overhyped problem". The first is self-explanatory, banning a big part of the user base, and destroying discussion is a completely senseless suggestion.

As for the overhyped problem, that's exactly what it is, we have some trolls, always have had them. And as long as users report them, mods take action and ban if necessary. PDF has no major issue with Indian trolls as far as I can see. Out of the thousands of Indian origin posts per day, far fewer violate forum rules. If I revealed my track record here on PDF, you'd probably think I was biased against them for how many Indian IDs were banned by me personally compared to Pakistanis. Truth is, the forum has zero tolerance especially against Indian suicide trolls the likes of which you mentioned. You're just too blinkered to see that. Victim mentality is astonishing even with a completely Pakistani mod and admin base, and leniency shown to Pakistani posters.

And pls don't try to lie/distort and misrepresent what I said. "Nonsensical suggestion and overhyped problem" is two separate points and completely different to "nonsensicial and overhyped problems". Either you misread or you're misquoting intentionally.



All management are Pakistani so there will obviously be some implicit bias in our favour. There's nothing wrong with having this bias IMO, I'm just stating a fact here. The fact is that we mods/admins as Pakistanis are humans too, we run a Pakistani forum; our coverage, our social media arm, professionals we host, all are Pakistani. That inevitably means that the forum will exhibit some Pakistani bias, and it does, although it's far less bias than Indian forums exhibit, which is why PDF is more successful. So I agree with your point of PDF leniency vs Indian forums, this a good thing about PDF. Allowing debate and dissent is how conversations are created and maintained.

However, I'm sure if PDF was handed over to you and people who think like you, you'd run it into the ground within months.

Your beloved user base is always involved in trolling and derailing discussions. Whether this user base is big or small should not be criteria for applyin. You sound like Ramiz Raja. No, we are not going to appease the Indians. Especially Indians that are trolls. It is not a senseless suggestion to reduce Indian trolling on PDF. It is a big problem. Don't downplay it. We need to acknowledge the problem.

We are simply making suggestions for the mods. They have difficulty dealing with the large Indian user base. When you restrict their ability to troll in fewer sections of the forum, the mods have lesser trouble dealing with Indian troll. I too have eyes and I have also been on Pakistani forums for decades. My experience is much different to yours. Indians behave erratic and cannot control themselves. If the word Pakistan is in any topic, Indians become emotional and angry.

Debate is not the issue. The problem is intentional trolling.

 

[Robbie]

although it's far less bias than Indian forums exhibit, which is why PDF is more successful.

I think the heart of it would lie in economics, not just politics. Indian forums have a lot of users and can afford to not have Pakistani users at all. This carries a penalty in terms of viewpoint, but the economics is easier.

Conversely, on a Pakistani forum like this, economics gets far easier with Indian audiences as well as diversity of viewpoints.

What I'm really saying is - I'm giving a dog whistle to the Pakistani nationalists to accuse you of selling out

 

[rott]

Actually I don't have an opinion here. I'll leave it to Pakistani members. It's their forum, their rules.
@dbc

 

[Jungibaaz]

Your beloved user base is always involved in trolling and derailing discussions. Whether this user base is big or small should not be criteria for being just. You sound like Ramiz Raja. No, we are not going to appease the Indians. Especially Indians that are trolls. It is not a senseless suggestion to reduce Indian trolling on PDF. It is a big problem. Don't downplay it.

We are simply making suggestions for the mods. They have difficulty dealing with the large Indian user base. When you restrict their ability to troll in fewer sections of the forum, the mods have lesser trouble dealing with Indian troll. I too have eyes and I have also been on Pakistani forums for decades. My experience is much different to yours. Indians behave erratic and cannot control themselves.

Debate is not the issue. The problem is intentional trolling.

Okay let's agree to disagree then. I think you are probably thinking we've got a huge Indian troll issue, hence your suggestions, and I'm of the view that this banning suggestion would be hugely damaging.

I think if you spent a week or two behind the scenes with mod team, looking at the system from the inside. Your perception would change.

 

[Ivan]

I think there should be limits on the ability to post and comment, on all the new members regardless of whichever country they represent. As and when the management feels that a certain member is contributing productively, the power to make posts and comments should be increased and so should be the ability to participate in different sections of the forum. This way, PDF can weed out bad members that can harm the reputation of it. In the meanwhile, the non-serious should be in a section where they can chill.

 

[Jungibaaz]

I think the heart of it would lie in economics, not just politics. Indian forums have a lot of users and can afford to not have Pakistani users at all. This carries a penalty in terms of viewpoint, but the economics is easier.

Conversely, on a Pakistani forum like this, economics gets far easier with Indian audiences as well as diversity of viewpoints.

What I'm really saying is - I'm giving a dog whistle to the Pakistani nationalists to accuse you of selling out

I can't speak to it purely from economic sense. We've always had a huge Indian population, but you're right that PDF can punch above its weight because of the sheer volume and diversity of its posters.

But honestly, having been a mod, I know none of us are instructed to watch PDF's bottom line. It's all about maintaining a good environment for discussion and debate. And without having the other side of the debate from Indians, the forum would be far less lively. I've seen smaller forums die out because of intolerance of the opposing user base, that hasn't happened with PDF due to the more accommodative policies.

 

[rott]

I think there should be limits on the ability to post and comment, on all the new members regardless of whichever country they represent. As and when the management feels that a certain member is contributing productively, the power to make posts and comments should be increased and so should be the ability to participate in different sections of the forum. This way, PDF can weed out bad members that can harm the reputation of it. In the meanwhile, the non-serious should be in a section where they can chill.

I think I'll be the first one to get banned then.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

We need harsher punishments for Indian trolling. Recently they have taken a liking to insulting sacred Islamic terminology and belief. I have reported them the best I can. We should not tolerate any blasphemous content here.

Secondly they form groups here and target Pakistani members or pro-Pakistani members. They scour the forum to find anti-Pakistan views and co-opt those members on discord.

I am talking mostly of two members who everyone knows here, one Tamil and one Bengali Hindu.

 

[Morpheus]

People seem to be confusing these trolls as offering some sane opposing view. They don't add anything of value, except just troll around. Since full time banning is out of the question, the next sensible one would be to limit them to the indian defense section only.

Second, we have also seen the vast amount of fake news that come from their media. There should be 100% ban on any content/link from there. The opposing view offered by "them" is using these fake post. And no matter how many times it has been debunked, they will always keep bringing it up in any future discussion. If you want to have a fair and logical opposition view, then these users are not the one to offer.

Lastly, Freedom of speech doesn't mean troll. If you want this to be a serious forum with quality of content, then you can't justify freedom of speech and look the other way when these users are just trolling, and insulting others.

The mods hand are tied, but this should help. Less modding required, so not lot of their real life time is taken, and the quality of content here will grow. Win win situation for everyone.

 

[Chanakyaa]

People seem to be confusing these trolls as offering some sane opposing view. They don't add anything of value, except just troll around. Since full time banning is out of the question, the next sensible one would be to limit them to the indian defense section only.

Second, we have also seen the vast amount of fake news that come from their media. There should be 100% ban on any content/link from there. The opposing view offered by "them" is using these fake post. And no matter how many times it has been debunked, they will always keep bringing it up in any future discussion. If you want to have a fair and logical opposition view, then these users are not the one to offer.

Lastly, Freedom of speech doesn't mean troll. If you want this to be a serious forum with quality of content, then you can't justify freedom of speech and look the other way when these users are just trolling, and insulting others.

The mods hand are tied, but this should help. Less modding required, so not lot of their real life time is taken, and the quality of content here will grow. Win win situation for everyone.

"Adsense" ka Kya hoga Kalia ?

https://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/defence.pk#card_overlap

 

[Dalit]

Okay let's agree to disagree then. I think you are probably thinking we've got a huge Indian troll issue, hence your suggestions, and I'm of the view that this banning suggestion would be hugely damaging.

I think if you spent a week or two behind the scenes with mod team, looking at the system from the inside. Your perception would change.

Whilst you have the experience of being a mod, we as members also have eyes and see certain patterns.

All I am suggesting that if certain Indian members stop trolling, most Pakistani members won't have a reason to react. There will be less negativity and more time for actual discussion.

I can swear that since I have been participating in forums I have only seen immense trolling and hate from one side. This experience goes back as far as the days of pakistanidefenceforum.com It has always been the same story. The same old.