Clueless on China

[ChinaChina]

I don't care what he thinks...I say it as it is.

At least he has to say something now than accuse me of being Chinese.

this guy ruhul is blinded by his hatred for the chinese, not really worth discuss any thing with him. i ask all chinese or pakistani brothers please ignor him cos we dont want to sink to his level do we?

 

[oceanx]

Canadian Chinese people aren't actually Chinese though in terms of culture.

I have a cousin who lives in Canada and even though they were born in Hong Kong.... they honest-to-God think they are "true Canadians".

So I don't expect you to understand the concept of face when it comes to "diplomacy"... but clearly the Chinese and American leaders understand this which is why they do so many deals off the table.

As I said, there needs to be more cultural understanding between leaders if relations are ever to improve.

Okay. So you have a cousin whose wife's uncle's third son's step-nephew is Canada. This relation has now conferred expert status on you on matters of "Chinese Canadians" - insert your teenish LOL/ROFL/busting-your-gut-laughing-your-head-off-laughter

Not even our friend Rahoo goes to this distance in his assertions.

It's hard to believe that to this day, this very day, there are so-called Chinese wearing PRC colors who would boast of the albatross of "two or three quadrillion US$" in electronic IOUs as "assets" ...

This is not a joke: the minute PRC goes to bully Taiwan or Vietnam (over the Spratlys) is the minute I will personally petition America to write off every penny of that "debt" as a computer error ... or just write it off ...

Whatya gonna do?

Now here is a real story to match your tale of "my cousin in Canada". I had a great great aunt who worked for some German diplomat back in the early years of last century. She apparently got paid very well by the standards of the time.

When she went to "redeem" the generous Marks she got paid in - they were utterly worthless.

That was in the 1920s.

Enjoy your "face" and your Weimar paper.

 

[Ras]

Okay. So you have a cousin whose wife's uncle's third son's step-nephew is Canada. This relation has now conferred expert status on you on matters of "Chinese Canadians" - insert your teenish LOL/ROFL/busting-your-gut-laughing-your-head-off-laughter

Not even our friend Rahoo goes to this distance in his assertions.

It's hard to believe that to this day, this very day, there are so-called Chinese wearing PRC colors who would boast of the albatross of "two or three quadrillion US$" in electronic IOUs as "assets" ...

This is not a joke: the minute PRC goes to bully Taiwan or Vietnam (over the Spratlys) is the minute I will personally petition America to write off every penny of that "debt" as a computer error ... or just write it off ...

Whatya gonna do?

Now here is a real story to match your tale of "my cousin in Canada". I had a great great aunt who worked for some German diplomat back in the early years of last century. She apparently got paid very well by the standards of the time.

When she went to "redeem" the generous Marks she got paid in - they were utterly worthless.

That was in the 1920s.

Enjoy your "face" and your Weimar paper.

Nice post.....

 

[Break the Silence]

LOL India is the one with no friends, not China.

We have alliances with Pakistan, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka. We have India completely surrounded.

Shanghai Cooperation Organisation = China + Russia + Pakistan

We also have a very strong economic relationship with the USA, we own more than a trillion of their debt and several trillion more in currency reserves of dollars. President OBAMA even said that the USA-China relationship will determine the fate of the 21st century.

Want to have the 1962 war again?

China + Pakistan will crush India like a worm without even the slightest bit of effort. India has NO ALLIES that will come to their aid in a direct military confrontation.

OMG!!! How silly post is this one.....!!! I am shocked by your strength(ALLIANCE) and confidence..OOPS!! sorry, its Over confidence..
Mate!! Always remember... Confidence is Good, But Being "Over-confident" means "Suicide"

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

This is not a joke: the minute PRC goes to bully Taiwan or Vietnam (over the Spratlys) is the minute I will personally petition America to write off every penny of that "debt" as a computer error ... or just write it off ...

Whatya gonna do?

Haha your loyalty is so cheap you cannot wait to hurt the people of the country who's flag you put on your profile.

If America does not pay back the debt, who do you think suffers? Ordinary Chinese people.

You're so eager to hurt them, aren't you?

By the way I also oppose ANY use of force regarding Taiwan... and I will not mind if they choose independence at all. Chinese people who "pretend to be Canadians" such as yourself will never understand this.

Also you clearly don't understand how finance works, if a country does not pay its debt... then it's credit rating will be downgraded and it will be forced to pay a much higher rate for any future loans which is disastrous for a country that borrows so much. Who ends up suffering? Ordinary people, who you don't seem to care about.

 

[Ras]

Haha your loyalty is so cheap you cannot wait to hurt the people of the country who's flag you put on your profile.

If America does not pay back the debt, who do you think suffers? Ordinary Chinese people.

You're so eager to hurt them, aren't you?

By the way I also oppose ANY use of force regarding Taiwan... and I will not mind if they choose independence at all. Chinese people who "pretend to be Canadians" such as yourself will never understand this.

Also you clearly don't understand how finance works, if a country does not pay its debt... then it's credit rating will be downgraded and it will be forced to pay a much higher rate for any future loans which is disastrous for a country that borrows so much. Who ends up suffering? Ordinary people, who you don't seem to care about.

It does not work like that...it is not just China who hold American treasury bonds...if China decides to dump the dollars it holds into the market or America writes it off the rest of the world almost all of who holds American dollars as the primary reserve currency will move in and buy more of it to keep it stable to protect their own holdings.Sure the dollar will take a hit but it will recover.China will be set decades back.

Being the reserve currency of the world has huge advantages.

 

[footmarks]

Okay. So you have a cousin whose wife's uncle's third son's step-nephew is Canada. This relation has now conferred expert status on you on matters of "Chinese Canadians" - insert your teenish LOL/ROFL/busting-your-gut-laughing-your-head-off-laughter

Not even our friend Rahoo goes to this distance in his assertions.

It's hard to believe that to this day, this very day, there are so-called Chinese wearing PRC colors who would boast of the albatross of "two or three quadrillion US$" in electronic IOUs as "assets" ...

This is not a joke: the minute PRC goes to bully Taiwan or Vietnam (over the Spratlys) is the minute I will personally petition America to write off every penny of that "debt" as a computer error ... or just write it off ...

Whatya gonna do?

Now here is a real story to match your tale of "my cousin in Canada". I had a great great aunt who worked for some German diplomat back in the early years of last century. She apparently got paid very well by the standards of the time.

When she went to "redeem" the generous Marks she got paid in - they were utterly worthless.

That was in the 1920s.

Enjoy your "face" and your Weimar paper.

Interesting observation. In case of balance sheet and net worth calculations of companies, debt conveyed is account receivable, so part of net worth. But countries are not companies. Let us take a scenario where US decide to pay off its huge debt towards China. All debts are in US $, so as soon as US start paying $, the value of US $ vis a vis RMB will fall and Chinese competetiveness will be gone as majority of world's trade happens in US $. (China cannot keep all the paid $ in its reserve as it will become non-liquid). As long as US economy is stable, it can print as many $ as required. If US economy go bust, huge debts it owe to China will become bad debt (worthless, has to be written off), apart from a huge loss for China, its large forex reserves (primary held as US $) will be rendered worthless. In simple words, Chinese economy will fall along with that of US.
As you can see, huge current account surplus China carries with respect to US is not good for China on the contrary. Its China who depends on US rather than the other way around, china is carrying the burden, not holding the US economy afloat as many chinese think. This situation will remain as long as US $ maintains its position as the only currency acceptable as standard forex currency (as gold is).

 

[footmarks]

It does not work like that...it is not just China who hold American treasury bonds...if China decides to dump the dollars it holds into the market or America writes it off the rest of the world almost all of who holds American dollars as the primary reserve currency will move in and buy more of it to keep it stable to protect their own holdings.Sure the dollar will take a hit but it will recover.China will be set decades back.

Being the reserve currency of the world has huge advantages.

Exaclt my point too.I would like to add:
Since US being a capitalist economy, a lot of people/countries have their interest(read money) invested with US companies (MNC's having investment and business throughout the world). So keeping such companies afloat will be beneficial to others too. While Chinese economy is largely held close by Public sector companies, which themselves have bad credit ratings and survive from Govt support. No one give a damn if these companies go bankrupt.
In other words, US economy will be supported by other countries (for their own interest though) but for chinese economy, as it is said, "who will cry when you die"

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

It does not work like that...it is not just China who hold American treasury bonds...if China decides to dump the dollars it holds into the market or America writes it off the rest of the world almost all of who holds American dollars as the primary reserve currency will move in and buy more of it to keep it stable to protect their own holdings.Sure the dollar will take a hit but it will recover.China will be set decades back.

Being the reserve currency of the world has huge advantages.

Tell me why would we "dump" the debt and hurt ourselves?

As I said before, I don't want ordinary people to be hurt in this argument between nations. That's who will suffer, ordinary people.

I see no reason at all to dump the debt and devalue our own currency reserves, might as well flush money down the toilet. Why would we do that?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

In other words, US economy will be supported by other countries (for their own interest though) but for chinese economy, as it is said, "who will cry when you die"

I see Indians are soooo happy to see Chinese people being hurt.

If the Economy crashes it will be ordinary people who suffer. Why would you want that?

Who will cry when China dies? Maybe 1.3 billion people will cry.

This is why China loves Pakistan, and NOT India.

 

[Ras]

Tell me why would we "dump" the debt and hurt ourselves?

As I said before, I don't want ordinary people to be hurt in this argument between nations. That's who will suffer, ordinary people.

I see no reason at all to dump the debt and devalue our own currency reserves, might as well flush money down the toilet. Why would we do that?

The point is there is no way China can dump the dollars you hold or call back the entire American debt purchased. So the illusion of keeping American economy afloat is nothing but a illusion.

Edit: I personally hope that China stops buying more of our debt..it will devalue the dollar and bring more manufacturing back home. But we all know China will not do that as that will hurt Chinese exports.

 

[mike05]

An amazing decent discussion has been turned to rubbish with all this sidetracking.

We all know that US and China need each other for trade purposes and keeping the world stable (A dormant superpower is better then a aggressive one no?). So all this currency dumping nonsense will never happen.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

The point is there is no way China can dump the dollars you hold or call back the entire American debt purchased. So the illusion of keeping American economy afloat is nothing but a illusion.

You're arguing against something I NEVER SAID. That's a straw man argument.

Like I said in the post above, we will NEVER dump the debt because that would be hurting ourselves! Why would we do that?

Maybe you in India would like us to hurt ourselves but we aren't that stupid, sorry. You might as well ask us to punch ourselves in the stomach, we aren't going to do that either.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

An amazing decent discussion has been turned to rubbish with all this sidetracking.

We all know that US and China need each other for trade purposes and keeping the world stable (A dormant superpower is better then a aggressive one no?). So all this currency dumping nonsense will never happen.

Exactly right.

Why would we flush money down the toilet for no reason? It just doesn't make any sense.

 

[Ras]

You're arguing against something I NEVER SAID. That's a straw man argument.

Like I said in the post above, we will NEVER dump the debt because that would be hurting ourselves! Why would we do that?

Maybe you in India would like us to hurt ourselves but we aren't that stupid, sorry. You might as well ask us to punch ourselves in the stomach, we aren't going to do that either.

I am not saying you said that....just removing a popular belief on this forum that China keeps the US economy afloat. It is not that China has a choice in dumping the money or not.There is no choice.