China to upgrade radar of Pakistan’s JF-17 fighter aircraft

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Hi,

I would rather have the technology at this time rather than super cruise---. The structural changes could have been done awhile ago---if Paf had already planned the change---.

We can't just take the retd Air marshall's word that the change just started---.

The issue isn't just the time it takes to develop on paper and before prototyping, but the prototyping itself. The JF-17 first flew in 2003 and entered IOC in around 2010. You're looking at least 3-5 years of qualification tests for a new structure, esp. if a new engine, flight control system, way more composites, etc are involved. This clearly isn't doable in the Block-III's timeline, so the PAF's emphasis is on the new subsystems and some minor structural changes right now.

But if they want the Block-IV to be like the NG in structural enhancements, then they'd better start designing today and aim for a prototype by 2022, with serial production in in 2026.

 

[SQ8]

Hi,

I would rather have the technology at this time rather than super cruise---. The structural changes could have been done awhile ago---if Paf had already planned the change---.

We can't just take the retd Air marshall's word that the change just started---.

They did plan the change. We cannot(and must not) understate how damaging that sob Zardari and his cohorts were for Pakistan. And I mean outside of the PAF. These sons of pigs destrpued every institution, ate every fund, manipulated every organization to ensure that their pockets were lined.

When the main people in the PAF were almost in tears that they had no money to pay just the interest charges on loans taken, imagine what else was done to the country.

Just as the 90s were a lost decade for the PAF, the 2008-2013 were lost to the PAF.

 

[CHI RULES]

Hi,

And I wrote about that 2 years ago regarding the JF17 BLK3 design upgrade---.

Grippen gave a lead to Paf for the upgrade

that's called out of box thinking and same perhaps required by every organisation/individual of Pak. Chinese phrase is dream different while sleeping on same bed.

We should not be reactive in every scenario but should have proactive approach. Perhaps block III is coming in 2019-20 time frame as threat environment shall change with induction of Rafael. But why we are not considering the near future upgrades of Jaguars and SU30 upgrades. The readiness level of SU30 is also going to improve in next 1-2 Years as work is going on in India. i.e plans to produce crucial spares in India and to develop sufficient stockpile of necessary spares in India.

We should plan to induct in next 2-3 years the stealth fighter though in limited numbers along with modern High Altitude SAMs.

 

[SQ8]

that's called out of box thinking and same perhaps required by every organisation/individual of Pak. Chinese phrase is dream different while sleeping on same bed.

We should not be reactive in every scenario but should have proactive approach. Perhaps block III is coming in 2019-20 time frame as threat environment shall change with induction of Rafael. But why we are not considering the near future upgrades of Jaguars and SU30 upgrades. The readiness level of SU30 is also going to improve in next 1-2 Years as work is going on in India. i.e plans to produce crucial spares in India and to develop sufficient stockpile of necessary spares in India.

We should plan to induct in next 2-3 years the stealth fighter though in limited numbers along with modern High Altitude SAMs.

The only thing Pakistanis are proactive is in procreation.

 

[CHI RULES]

The only thing Pakistanis are proactive is in procreation.

Amazing Reply Sir

 

[SQ8]

Amazing Reply Sir

Jhoot bola?

 

[CHI RULES]

Jhoot bola?

Totally exact analysis of nation by you, even defense strategies are of reactive nature.

 

[Dazzler]

The only thing Pakistanis are proactive is in procreation.

Yourself included?

 

[SQ8]

Yourself included?

Not yet, working on it.

Totally exact analysis of nation by you, even defense strategies are of reactive nature.

Defense, procurement, environment , social etc
Even corruption is reactive. Pakistanis don’t really come up with schemes, truthfully they copy or seize opportunities but never create corruption opportunities themselves.

Take the JF-17, the upgrades you mentioned are going to be rolled in but reactively looking at the MKI and Rafale, not beforehand.

Electronics are shileded against EMP only after they hear India is doing it.
This mentality will be the end of Pakistan eventually.

 

[Dazzler]

Not yet, working on it.

Passing sweeping statements is a child's play. Better not generalize unless you know every person in the country personally.

 

[SQ8]

Passing sweeping statements is a child's play. Better not generalize unless you know every person in the country personally.

I know most people from most areas in 4 provinces in Pakistan having lived, studied and worked among them. Ill stick to my observation.

You can disagree with my observations, but you have no right to dispute my right to make them.

 

[Dazzler]

I know most people from most areas in 4 provinces in Pakistan having lived, studied and worked among them. Ill stick to my observation.

You can disagree with my observations, but you have no right to dispute my right to make them.

No one disputed your right to make them, not me at least. You can make as many as you please but that will not change the reality that a glimmer of hope still exists at the end of the tunnel.

Someone, somewhere is doing the right things and making the right choices. Otherwise, nothing could have stopped Pakistan from becoming another balkanized Yugoslavia.

 

[SQ8]

No one disputed your right to make them, not me at least. You can make as many as you please but that will not change the reality that a glimmer of hope still exists at the end of the tunnel.

Someone, somewhere is doing the right things and making the right choices. Otherwise, nothing could have stopped Pakistan from becoming another balkanized Yugoslavia.

The right choices have nothing to do with proactivity or reactive behavior patterns or hope.

This isnt a prexisting condition but has come to be as a national psyche due to India specific development thought and national upbringing.

The Marut was proactive, a need to develop a local industry and avoid economic pitfalls.

The super-7 was reactive: there was a need seen AFTER the crisis had transpired(80’s economy).

That doesn’t mean other nations aren’t reactive in general either, but we have settled into it as a majority.

Sure, you do see proactive Pakistanis like the 30 under 30 list on forbes; but what is their national impact and state impact at the end of the day?

Agha Hasan Abdi for e.g gave Pakistan UbL and a University.

Edhi was proactive.

Who else?

 

[Dazzler]

The right choices have nothing to do with proactivity or reactive behavior patterns or hope.

This isnt a prexisting condition but has come to be as a national psyche due to India specific development thought and national upbringing.

The Marut was proactive, a need to develop a local industry and avoid economic pitfalls.

The super-7 was reactive: there was a need seen AFTER the crisis had transpired(80’s economy).

That doesn’t mean other nations aren’t reactive in general either, but we have settled into it as a majority.

Sure, you do see proactive Pakistanis like the 30 under 30 list on forbes; but what is their national impact and state impact at the end of the day?

Agha Hasan Abdi for e.g gave Pakistan UbL and a University.

Edhi was proactive.

Who else?

Imran Khan, the man gave Namal and two SKs so far after all.

But the reactive part is true, i can vouch for that. Heck, they even pushed forward with Al Khalid 1 knowing that India was discussing the T-90MS which turned out to be false as only some components will eventually make it to the S version.

In the end, i think there is still disagreement but thats normal and life goes own.

 

[SQ8]

Imran Khan, the man gave Namal and two SKs so far after all.

But the reactive part is true, i can vouch for that. Heck, they even pushed forward with Al Khalid 1 knowing that India was discussing the T-90MS which turned out to be false as only some components will eventually make it to the S version.

In the end, i think there is still disagreement but thats normal and life goes own.

Not even IK is proactive: after all, SK hospital is because of his mother. Namal is just an add on to existing philanthropy which if we start discussing education the citizens foundation in Pakistan has done great strides in just as the Aga Khan did too.

The simplest example of this was regarding staff cars being changed during 2006-7 when we actually had money available; the French were haraunging us on the Mirage and we did not want to stick with just the F-16. The PAF had the budget but to avoid it going back(as happens with government) over the federal year it was decided to just replace the staff cars since the surplus funds existed(suddenly the PAF was flooded with the reborn civics and The pricier cars for the chief)

Were there not other pressing defense projects that could have taken those funds? Why were hundreds of cars which are a creature comfort given priority over actual needs.

Then what right do these uniformed medal walas have to critique generally uneducated and unaware government political appontees who allocate billions of rupees to ptdc guest houses that are never used or fake government hospitals?

At the end of the day, the same lot exists.

Proactive folks do try to enter these organizations and others in the private sector. But while those in the private sector make some small impact, most of these government types either succumb to the system or be proactive and move onto better venues.

We are a nation in general of reactive people, we watch and wait on someone else to do something and then we emulate them or respond to them.

Being good or bad has nothing to do with proactive or reactive.

Tomorrow if a nuclear weapon does land near a large armoured formation of ours; the vehicles will stop rolling and electronics not work even if they put NBC on their brochures.
The T-90 wont because the Russians planned for that when they put NBC on their labelling.

Now if they all know this and still not react... what would call that? Criminal perhaps?