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China - The world's hotbed of innovation?

Well you don't see Indians calling the construction of roads, dams and airport as innovation, do you?
there are a lot of innovation when it comes to building those world wonders,especailly those being called human engineering miracles by discovery channels.great engineering projects are the highest form of use of innovation to benefit the great public.
 
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stop trolling. indians are also progressing . both china and india can progress. it does not have to be one or the other. the world is big enough for both.

India is not progressing. Importing is not progression. When I see Indians topping innovation indexes or getting the most patents granted, then I will believe it. Indian religious cultures not conducive for innovation. Too much religion involved. The main reason India cannot innovate is due to the caste system that discriminates people from different classes, ethnicities, looks, religions, etc.
 
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Imitation is the first step to innovation. You imitate and learn from it, then you try to improve on it which eventually becomes a new innovation. Human knowledge is acquired gradually. You don't go from nothing to innovation. Imitation is a necessary step on the way to innovation. I'm glad we learnt lots from reverse engineering. Reverse engineering is a very difficult thing to do, it might look easy but its damn hard. That's why only a handful of countries can reverse engineer. It's very important to catch up to existing technologies through learning and doing.

THIS! :tup:

Whether China is a center of innovation or not at this time is irrelevant. The body of knowledge China is accumulating will go far in cementing a future after manufacturing has moved on.

Other countries will emerge but what happens after manufacturing moves on to other places? Will they be able to learn and develop on their own?
 
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Nobody is jealous here, Look at the stats of innovation index and patent submission, India is right behind China and catching up.
Indo - Israel scientific agreement is going to build a good scientific research base in India.

So are you insecure? Did i asked you anything about india? Why did you bring that, to prove your insecurity and jealousy.
 
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So are you insecure? Did i asked you anything about india? Why did you bring that, to prove your insecurity and jealousy.

Who is insecure here??

You just came to support a troll out of insecurity, why hide behind trolls??

I am only saying why India should be bashed in this thread.
 
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I see a 50 cent army guy who was given permission by CCP to do propaganda here :rofl:



You are trolling with the same kind of delusional posts in all threads with the same wording troll.

i am eagerly waiting for you to debunk those statistics from PCT, WIPO, World Bank, and Thomson Reuters``if you call those figures delusional i have got nothing to say to you primitive lot
 
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Who is making junk patents?
In recent years, China has been moving very fast in the number and speed of patent applications. As Thomson Reuters pointed out in a research report, “China will surpass Japan and the United States in the annual number of patents by 2011.” However, coming at the same time is the corporate and academic opinion that “over 50% or even 80% of Chinese patents are junk.”
 
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stop trolling. indians are also progressing . both china and india can progress. it does not have to be one or the other. the world is big enough for both.

be seriously, what 'progress' did india made for past 20 years? the fact is everyone is making progress as world technology and society evolves, and the indians so called progress is well below the world average..

you really need to stop reading hindi propaganda news, check professional reports and annual statistics, because their aims of writing something are quite different from sensational western wannabe indian medias....their findings are guided by their field of professionalism
 
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love the logic of the title, without the idea where do the patent come from?

From here

“The so-called patent agents are actually little more than makers of junk patents,” said Ms. Guo laughingly. Ms. Guo is a patent agent herself and was a bit tired as she had just returned from a business trip where she had met a handful of clients. ials, and she had to write down several patents on the spot.She told China IP that in one company visit the day before, all technical staff there simply described products to her verbally, without any written mater


Guo seemed helpless over how these patents are produced more “efficiently.” In actual practice, she told our reporter, agents might even go so far as “creating” some innovative features for those soon-to-be-doomed patent applications. “We agents are practically becoming inventors,” she said with self mockery. “However, when we try to tell companies what’s in our mind, they refuse to understand and think we are just looking for money.”


In recent years, China has been moving very fast in the number and speed of patent applications. As Thomson Reuters pointed out in a research report, “China will surpass Japan and the United States in the annual number of patents by 2011.” However, coming at the same time is the corporate and academic opinion that “over 50% or even 80% of Chinese patents are junk.”


“As a patent agent, I’m even more anxious to create valuable patents than corporations are,” Guo said. Usually regarded as a high-income group, patent agents have their bitter complaints.

Supportive Policies Cause Many Junk Patents


To encourage innovation, in recent years local governments have issued incentive policies for patents; setting up funds and offering other preferential treatment. This was effective and China saw a fast increase in the number of patents applied for and granted. Many firms received financial support and tax cuts. However, it has been reported that for many firms the most common motive for the increased patent applications is government support instead of the patents themselves. A marketer with little IP knowledge reported to China IP : “Our company applied for many patents last year to qualify for preferential government policies.” People simply use patents as nothing more than a means to an end. Therefore the patent support policies were dubbed as policies that can be used to make a “quick buck.” In one IP fraud case, a Shanghai swindler helped an enterprise apply for patent for free; the enterprise received a patent certificate while the swindler received a handsome amount of money from the support fund.


You Minjian, lawyer in charge of IP affairs at Co-effort, a Shanghai-based law firm, stated, “The government support policy caused plenty of junk patents and a batch of agents who produce such junk. Service prices of the trade were also dragged down. Now in Shanghai it only costs 4,000 Yuan for an invention. The sum is simply too low for a good patent, which requires time and thought. People just get things done quickly. When you go to defend your rights you will find that too many applications are just junk. But enterprises don’t care, for all they are looking for is some financial interest.”

Presently, this group of patent agents can be described by one word——busy. Every agent has piles of cases at hand and sometimes they are too busy to accept new cases. According to Ma Lianyuan, former president of All-China Patent Agents Association, China has more than 10,000 certificated agents, but no more than 7,000 of them really practice. Statistics from the website of the SIPO showed that some 980,000 applications were fled in China in 2009. So each agent took 140 on average annually, and had to finish one every 2.5 days. The quality can be imagined.

However, due to the amazing number of applicants, patent agency became a trade so hot that more and more firms joined in. Consequently, price cuts became an important competitive means. “Some enterprises, setting eyes on the government fund rather than patent quality, would usually choose agencies of lower price and inferior service,” a Shanghai agent reported, “and enterprises and agencies would bargain fiercely, just like picking up a head of cabbage from the street.” Disorderly market competition also fueled junk patents. Tan Wenye, partner of Anova Law Group said, “In the US, people simply don’t bargain with lawyers, just like patients don’t bargain with doctors. For enterprises, IP is as precious as life to human beings.”

However, enterprises were not the only ones who set eyes on supportive policies. College incentives to patent applications fueled enthusiasm among faculty and students, and scandals of junk patents were staged. Middle school and university students sought extra marks in college entrance and postgraduate exams, and some professors took it as a tool to obtain money. Supported by research funds and workplace subsidies, plenty of patent applications and numerous result-assessment meetings appeared.

Tian Lipu, commissioner of SIPO, said the country’s preferential policies were attractive. The encouragement is a good thing, but it might easily go astray. He believes “junk patents” are a problem at a certain stage of development which can be solved by more refined and scientific administration and the incentives should focus on inventions and international patents.

You Minjian also said, “Government support should focus more on inventions which go global, because they are costly and competitive, and awards should be available for completed inventions.”

Flaws in Patent Examination

The epidemic of junk patents naturally led to finger-pointing at SIPO. The absence of substantive examination on design and utility model applications caused a large number of junk patents under these two categories. The Office has been placing emphasis on revising China’s patent system to curb the problem, and the threshold for designs was raised greatly in the third revision to the Patent Law in 2009.

Apart from an improved system, however, more doubts exist regarding patent examinations. A researcher from a pharmaceutical company told of his personal experience on an online forum. He said, “Following our agent’s suggestions, our lab applied for six patents at the same time. But each carried no substantial difference, all being variations of one technology and only having unnecessary changes on a certain step of the process.” The result was that the applications went to different departments of examination, one to biomedicine, another to biological assessment and still another to material assessment. Four of them were finally rejected with different reasons, one didn’t receive any reply and only one stood the chance of being approved. The researcher couldn’t help asking: why did the applications, almost the same in nature, go to different departments? And why did the examiners have widely different perspectives and gave different reasons of refusal? Ironically, it was only at that point that the researcher understood his agent’s cunning in suggesting six patents simultaneously.

China still lacks high-quality examiners as applications pile up,experts report. Moreover, inadequate assessment and supervision also contributed to the appearance of junk patents. Ruud Peters, CEO of Philips Intellectual Property and Standards, once stated in an interview, “All patent examination organizations hope to get done with all of the backed-up applications. And there is only one way: to go through the process quickly. It means to sacrifice quality and attention for speed, and a decrease in the average quality of patents.”

all the above is reported in the below Chinese Newspaper report.

Who is making junk patents?
 
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