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China & Russia need to take action against America.

Bilal Bhai, it is true that China and Russia don't want American presence in Afghanistan but only after 2014. Otherwise why Russia had opened Northern Distribution Network for US back in 2009. Russians admire Americans contribution for counter-insurgency operation in Afghanistan.

No, it is basically holding 200,000 US troops hostage. Russia and Pakistan can cut off both routes simultaneously, and the 200,000 US troops with no generators, no food, no ammo and surrounded by Taliban would be history.
 
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No, it is basically holding 200,000 US troops hostage. Russia and Pakistan can cut off both routes simultaneously, and the 200,000 US troops with no generators, no food, no ammo and surrounded by Taliban would be history.

Anyway, why Russian will do it, stability of Afghanistan is more important to Russians than annoying Americans using Pakistan. I think your Chinese government links ETIM to Al-Qaida which shows they too feel benefit from American presence. Both China and Russia fear that abrupt American withdrawal will spillover insurgency in Xinjiang and Chechnia and CAR.

By the way, Americans even have third route through Georgia-Azerbaijan-Kazakhstan-Uzbekistan.
 
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I hear what you are saying but stand back for a second - If China and Russia do stand alongside Pakistan and offer support against the bullyboy tactics employed by the US do you really see the USA continuing to use the methods they are imposing at the moment?
I believe Pakistan will not be used as a battle ground. I believe the results of this mindset would be catostropic for our region and not in the interests of anyone. It is clear for perhaps their own agenda more than anything else these nations will raise their voices now and if not now pretty soon.

they will cos in the long run their interests are aligned with pakistans not america

---------- Post added at 11:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:01 PM ----------

No, it is basically holding 200,000 US troops hostage. Russia and Pakistan can cut off both routes simultaneously, and the 200,000 US troops with no generators, no food, no ammo and surrounded by Taliban would be history.

Agreed its only a matter of time as america gets more desparate like a drunk with no money will fight needlessly and get beaten
 
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Anyway, why Russian will do it, stability of Afghanistan is more important to Russians than annoying Americans using Pakistan. I think your Chinese government links ETIM to Al-Qaida which shows they too feel benefit from American presence. Both China and Russia fear that abrupt American withdrawal will spillover insurgency in Xinjiang and Chechnia and CAR.

By the way, Americans even have third route through Georgia-Azerbaijan-Kazakhstan-Uzbekistan.

I think that the russians value the fact that they can land nukes on america and are very much against a missile shield in Europe and will not allow america to have a precense that is detremental to their interests

Why are you so desparate for america to have presense in our neighbourhood? Does india need american assistance? You can hardly be described as natural allies
 
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Anyway, why Russian will do it, stability of Afghanistan is more important to Russians than annoying Americans using Pakistan. I think your Chinese government links ETIM to Al-Qaida which shows they too feel benefit from American presence. Both China and Russia fear that abrupt American withdrawal will spillover insurgency in Xinjiang and Chechnia and CAR. .

Both China and Russia see U.S. and NATO as bigger threats than a bunch of cavemen.

Before 9/11, China and Russia didn't have much a problem with Taliban governed Afghanistan. Al Qaeda are already in their weakest state. Besides Pakistan can use its influence on some insurgent groups not to harm Russian and Chinese interests and not to help those who are against Russian and Chinese interests.
 
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No, it is basically holding 200,000 US troops hostage. Russia and Pakistan can cut off both routes simultaneously, and the 200,000 US troops with no generators, no food, no ammo and surrounded by Taliban would be history.

Yes that is the best option:

Russia could deliver death blow to Nato, say analysts

ISLAMABAD: With the Russian threat to cut land routes for supply to NATO troops in Afghanistan, the Afghan battleground may turn into a cold death trap for NATO, defence analysts believe. They say that Pakistan should utilise the opportunity for a peaceful and prosperous Pakistan by pulling it out of the American war.

Russia has threatened to cut off NATO supply routes to Afghanistan if the alliance doesn’t compromise on its missile defence plans. “If NATO doesn’t give a serious response, we have to address matters in relations in other areas,” Russian news services reported. Russia’s cooperation on Afghanistan may be an area for review, the news services reported.

Pakistan has already cut the NATO supply route after the Mohmand Agency attack by NATO troops that killed twenty-six Pakistani soldiers. Lt General (retd) Hameed Gul while talking to The News said that Russia would utilise every option to take revenge from the Americans and time has come for the Russians to do this. He said that Russia wants to join hands with Pakistan and Pakistan should re-consider its policy towards Russia. “Americans and NATO troops have been strangled in Afghanistan and time has come for Pakistan to avail the opportunity that it missed on 9/11 to regain the respect and sovereignty”, Gul said.

He mentioned that Americans will have to leave Afghanistan and will ask for concessions and Pakistan should negotiate with them for their exit. If Russia cuts the supply then the route will be from Georgia to Baku and then to Azerbaijan, which means NATO will never get the supply, said Gul.

“Now NATO troops will have to exit Vietnam style, and that too by using Pakistan’s airspace because Iran will never let USA use its airspace”, the retired General said. He mentioned that the war against terror that was started with our own people will come to an end at once and there will be peace in no time once the Americans leave Afghanistan. He said that Indian interests in Afghanistan were growing but India will get nothing from Afghanistan.

Maria Sultan, defence analyst, while talking to this correspondent said that if the Russians also cut the supply line of NATO then it will turn out to be cold death for NATO troops. “They will literally be strangled in Afghanistan with 90000 troops and as they admit that they have reserves for three months which actually means they have reserves for two months and then NATO will have to airlift the troops and during the airlift only 15 to 20 percent can be alive out of the 90000 troops”, Maria said.

She mentioned that in Afghanistan, everything comes from outside and the insurgency this year has been very high as 700 causalities have been reported. Therefore after the Russian decision, Afghanistan will turn into a reverse Kargil for NATO. “They will have weapons but no bullets to fire; and if Pakistan shuts the air corridors on NATO then it would be a cold death for them and America will have to renegotiate with Pakistan”, she said.



Russia could deliver death blow to Nato, say analysts
 
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Both China and Russia see U.S. and NATO as bigger threats than a bunch of cavemen.

Before 9/11, China and Russia didn't have much a problem with Taliban governed Afghanistan. Al Qaeda are already in their weakest state. Besides Pakistan can use its influence on some insurgent groups not to harm Russian and Chinese interests and not to help those who are against Russian and Chinese interests.

If they didn't have problem with them why Russians supported Northern Alliance and never recognized Taliban government.
 
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If they didn't have problem with them why Russians supported Northern Alliance and never recognized Taliban government.

Because Northern Alliance was pro-Russia 20 years but times have changed today. The same Northern Alliance are now in American created Afghan National Army (ANA) and are pro-american. Besides only a few countries recognized the Taliban government in the 90's.

Pakistan and Russia also didn't have good relations back then, but today the relations between the two countries are improving. U.S. and India didn't have any good relations back then, but today the relations between U.S. and India are in an all-time high.

Don't compare 1990 strategic interests to 2011 strategic interests. The world has changed a lot since 9/11/2001.
 
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I hear what you are saying but stand back for a second - If China and Russia do stand alongside Pakistan and offer support against the bullyboy tactics employed by the US do you really see the USA continuing to use the methods they are imposing at the moment?
I believe Pakistan will not be used as a battle ground. I believe the results of this mindset would be catostropic for our region and not in the interests of anyone. It is clear for perhaps their own agenda more than anything else these nations will raise their voices now and if not now pretty soon.

china and russia are ALREADY beind pakistan.

the question is to what EXTENT, and for what PURPOSE.

every scenario has a cost/benefit, my point is do not rely on the notion that china and russia will act as a guarantor because their relation is binary with the US, its not, they do co-operate, they can maybe come to an understanding on pakistan to the US on one issue, in return for concession on another? who knows?

pakistan is already a battle ground, pakistan is already in a precarious situation.

if china cared so much, or had such power dont you think they could help pakistan more directly in afghanistan, or prevent the situation getting worse?

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Simply please tell me dude where were Russia and China in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya?? If Americans are succesfull with iran, pakistan they already have arabs eating out of their hands, and lets say they succeed with their european missile shield when is it that China and Russia may feel that time is running out. Why do you think Russia is moving towards Syria

Oh and the americans are never going to get pragmatic? Georgia?

you raise some good points, i do think russia is a more credible threat than china because they have mad dog in charge.

but ask yourself this, compared to us/nato/zionist lobby - do russia and/or china have the combined/individual WILL and ABILITY to negate evil designs on pakistan?

us could do something CRAAZY, that means china/russia need to threaten to do the same.
 
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No, it is basically holding 200,000 US troops hostage. Russia and Pakistan can cut off both routes simultaneously, and the 200,000 US troops with no generators, no food, no ammo and surrounded by Taliban would be history.

US can cut a bloody swath through Pakistan while Carrier groups clear the coast for forward bases from which to stage operations or leave at their leisure.

Both your statement and this statement have the same likelihood of occuring.

Russia has nothing to gain, lots to lose should it actually go through with it.
 
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US can cut a bloody swath through Pakistan while Carrier groups clear the coast for forward bases from which to stage operations or leave at their leisure.

Both your statement and this statement have the same likelihood of occuring.

Russia has nothing to gain, lots to lose should it actually go through with it.

how will the US guarantee delivery of supplies across pakistan?
 
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how will the US guarantee delivery of supplies across pakistan?

If there is a war between Pakistan and the U.S. the U.S. will bomb the air bases and command and control facilities. As well as sam sites and so on.
 
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If there is a war between Pakistan and the U.S. the U.S. will bomb the air bases and command and control facilities. As well as sam sites and so on.

obviously WE HOPE NOT :)

but then none of those trucks will be safe, th us will lose a lot of trucks.

just wondering anyway, dont wanna think too hard on this one!!
 
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If there is a war between Pakistan and the U.S. the U.S. will bomb the air bases and command and control facilities. As well as sam sites and so on.

Big talk, but Pakistan is no Vietnam or Afghanistan. :lol:

Pakistan is a nuclear-armed nation, with the 6th largest population in the world. It's on an entirely different level.

Remind me, when was the last time America fought directly with a nuclear-armed nation? The answer is never, even one loose nuke in the hands of anti-US militant hands is too much to bear.
 
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